How do we get new/different staff members?

[Kei'suke Zendu]

If we have people (person? Christin? Bueller?) trying to revitalize the board and gain new members/increase activity, it seems really stupid to not have moderators in place who are actually, you know, around and active on the board. I looked at the staff list, and it's basically all the same people, just with different accounts.

I don't expect the people who take care of the technical aspects to make stickied threads or arrange writing challenges or whatever, but moderators could. And should. Having one or two people actually trying to change things is pointless when no-one else wants to make an effort. Or people will band-wagon jump and then fuck off after a month or two.

Is it possible to give someone sticky powers (lol) without giving them the whole Mod powers thing? Maybe have like, SwFans Goodwill Ambassadors who come up with ideas to get people interested and posting.


Cos, I'll be perfectly honest. Until I actually spent time in the chat with people, I didn't want to post here. Everyone is busy doing their own thing and if you don't have a part to play in those stories, it's daunting as fuck to get started. I had no idea what the fuck was going on In Universe, and if we want to actually BE BUSY with new people, we need to change the status quo and DO THINGS.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

what a chat box could make people interested in posting what was that?

[Michael Cline]

Cos, I'll be perfectly honest. Until I actually spent time in the chat with people, I didn't want to post here. Everyone is busy doing their own thing and if you don't have a part to play in those stories, it's daunting as fuck to get started. I had no idea what the fuck was going on In Universe, and if we want to actually BE BUSY with new people, we need to change the status quo and DO THINGS.

THIS. I've been gone for at least 5 years. I'll admit to popping in every once in a while and lurking, and just seeing everyone doing their things. It was reassuring to know that people were still here, but I never really felt like I could come back. It wasn't until I started getting hit up on AIM, and found myself added to the group AIM chat that I actually felt like I could start posting again. Even then its been a struggle to convince myself that I can be a part of this community, or even should be a part of this community when I haven't been here in so long.

I can't help but wonder if there aren't other people feeling the same way who'd come back with a little outreach, and that definitely sounds like something moderators should be doing. Or, like Mandi said, some sort of community ambassadors. Something to generate interest and activity, at least.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Frankly, and personally, I wouldn't want to put forth a ton of effort on behalf of a board who's staff is not interested in/being helpful in promoting or being active/helpful/doing staff things.

[Captain Untouchable]

I hear where your coming from Jenny, but I think your argument is a double-edged sword. If we have to be proactive in order to earn our way onto the Staff, then by the same token shouldn't the Staff also be proactive? Shouldn't it work both ways?

Like I said earlier, I think most of what Holly, Atreyu, and I are saying stems from the fact that we don't know what the Staff is meant to be doing. You admit yourselves that there isn't really a job spec for being a Moderator. This means that the community doesn't know what you're supposed to be doing (and thus we have no idea whether you're actually doing it or not), but also it means that you guys don't know what you're expected to do either.

There are some things, like Holly points out, that we as community members can take partial ownership of: but there are also obstacles. We can create and edit all the wiki pages we want, but we can't delete any wiki pages because the decision has been made that you need to be a mod (or admin?) to do that. We can submit all the image claims we want, but no one in the community can actually uphold the "once you have more than 10 posts it gets added to your account" rule, because we don't have the permissions to do that: you have to be an Admin. As Holly said, we can certainly take ownership of the voting part of RP of the Month, but we can't sticky threads, we can't do fancy things to draw attention to roleplays that the community has voted to recognise, because we don't have access privileges.

Yes, we can do stuff, and we can pester the Staff to do the things we can't... but wouldn't it be easier if it was a Staff member's job?

To be blunt: as community leaders, should you not be the ones leading the community?

And pardon me for saying this Holly: but the two of us almost never agree on anything. If you've got Holly and me on the same page about something, that probably means there's a good point in there somewhere.


EDIT:

It wasn't until I started getting hit up on AIM, and found myself added to the group AIM chat that I actually felt like I could start posting again.

This is another thing. I keep seeing "as we discussed in the chat" being brought up in discussions around here, but I know nothing of this fabled chat. There's no post anywhere telling people that it even exists, let alone who to talk to or how to get invited. Hell, I didn't realise it was an AIM chat until just now - I thought there was an IRC or a chat room somewhere that I just didn't have a link to.

By it's very nature, something like this excludes new people; also, because I can't read fast enough (because of my medical condition) to keep up with the rate at which y'all post in chats, I can't be a part of that either. Being able to chat about ideas in real time is great in theory, but as two people have pointed out already, our super secret back-room approach to planning makes us something of an exclusive, rather than inclusive community. That's probably not a smart tactic if we're hoping to get new members in the coming months.

I don't think a chat box is the way to go (sorry Holly, I just think it's too small and cramped to be useful), but if there is going to be an ongoing group chat, it needs to be publicly accessible: or at the very least, publicised somewhere.

[Kei'suke Zendu]

If we had new members, I'm sure they'd be included in chats about threads/posting/whatever, but guess what? Right now half the characters on the board ARE ALL THE SAME PEOPLE. Until that changes, I don't really see the need for an IRC/chat-room when people have IM.

Plus, you know, people POST OOC THREADS ABOUT THREADS.

[Michael Cline]

By it's very nature, something like this excludes new people; also, because I can't read fast enough (because of my medical condition) to keep up with the rate at which y'all post in chats, I can't be a part of that either. Being able to chat about ideas in real time is great in theory, but as two people have pointed out already, our super secret back-room approach to planning makes us something of an exclusive, rather than inclusive community. That's probably not a smart tactic if we're hoping to get new members in the coming months.

I'm not specifically saying "Needs to be the chat" but more that there needs to be an outreach. Chat, IM, PM, e-mail, what have you. If people felt like they were a part of the community more, and that there was an open line of communication to them they'd be more apt to be active. Some of us need a push, and the chat (as an example) has been great for re-sparking our interest, but it was also the fact that at the same time, or round about the same time Mandi started IMing me and having conversations with me again, and suddenly I went from not talking to any of the people on the board for years, to feeling like I was part of the conversation again.

[Captain Untouchable]

Don't get me wrong: personally, I'd prefer it if there wasn't a chat at all. My brain isn't able to process information very quickly any more because of a medical condition I have, so I literally cannot take part in a group chat like that. All I'm saying is, since so many people seem to feel that one of those is necessary, I think it should be something that anyone off the street can walk into and take part in. If you're new, or if you're old and coming back... it should be something that you don't need to "know people" before you can join.

Generally speaking, new people don't already know people. We need to put as few roadblocks in the way of people joining our community, IMO.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

A chat box doesn't need to be small and cramped, the one at swrpg seems nice enough to me. But that's an entirely different kettle of fish and not what this thread is about.

[Kei'suke Zendu]

I dont feel like one is necessary, but if there was a thread telling me what the fuck is going on the Star Wars based part of the forums, I wouldn't have had to ask anyone.

75% of the chat is NOT Fans related, and most of the related stuff is "Where do I need to post?" and shit.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Yeah, the chat is basically people saying "i had pie for dinner" and "how do I tie a bow tie" it isn't like a super secret planning base or something.

[Captain Untouchable]

Yeah, the chat is basically people saying "i had pie for dinner" and "how do I tie a bow tie" it isn't like a super secret planning base or something.

The comments you guys made in one of the recent(ish) Jedi threads beg to differ? The only reason I know the chat exists is because you guys said you'd been discussing ideas in said chat thread. Again, because I've never seen it or been in it, I have no information about it beyond the references you guys have made.

If we had new members, I'm sure they'd be included in chats about threads/posting/whatever, but guess what? Right now half the characters on the board ARE ALL THE SAME PEOPLE. Until that changes, I don't really see the need for an IRC/chat-room when people have IM.

Plus, you know, people POST OOC THREADS ABOUT THREADS.

Part of the problem here I think is that, as you say, half the characters on the boards are the same people, and those people have IM. With that in mind, an OOC thread about an IC thread is arguably also redundant, because up until now there haven't been enough people around for it to be necessary. In the past, we posted OOC's about threads more than we do currently: the chat seems to have taken the place of that.

I can only speak for myself on this, but personally I've never expected anyone to be interested enough in the stuff I write for an OOC thread to even be necessary. Sarah and I did a thread recently and were absolutely stunned to discover that people were even reading it at all: let alone following it with enough interest for us to need to explain things. It wasn't until Charley turned into a big fluffy praise monster and started posting rep comments up the wazoo that we had any kind of clue. I have a lot of characters, but few who have enough storyline impact for anyone to actually give a monkeys: so if I did create an OOC thread for an IC thread, I would feel like a pretentious ass for doing so. That's just me, but it may be a similar story for others.

I'm not disagreeing with your point in the slightest: the more context and information we can provide, the more accessible we're going to be. I just don't think this is a need that has ever occurred to us in the past since, generally speaking, we tend to underestimate the interest people have in our stuff?

It might be worth reconsidering how certain perks are dished out: Supporter status lets you see who has viewed a thread, which (combined with Rep comments) is a good indicator of whether or not a thread is popular... but it only unlocks for the account you buy it for. Decisions like that sort of thing are above my pay grade, but it might be "good for morale" if we were able to let everyone see how many hits their threads are getting? I don't think those of us who chip in for hosting fees are actually doing it to buy the perks.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Again, we are straying from the main point of the thread, I feel.

[Kei'suke Zendu]

Let me put it this way.


If I was doing a thread with someone new, or someone I do not have on AIM/IM, I would most likely private message them or try to contact them to discuss ideas. Since most if not all of the active roleplayers are already on IM, it's easy to get in touch with them via the chat. if I wasn't in the chat, I'd be posting a thread because that seems like the most proactive way to get shit done.

I'm sorry if you somehow feel left out, but as much as we need to reach out to people, if you want to roleplay with someone, you need to reach to them as well. I've read things new people have posted and sent them pms and added them on AIM for like, ever. THERE ARE NO FUCKING NEW PEOPLE! HALF THE CHARACTERS ARE ALREADY PEOPLE WHO ROLEPLAY HERE!


Tide - I cant see what people read my threads, and I could really give a FART.

[Captain Untouchable]

This isn't about "feeling left out". A big theme running through this discussion (and other discussions on the board) is one of preparedness for when new people arrive: specifically in this thread, making sure that we have a Staff that is prepared for that, and that can make Fans look good, look active, and look welcoming.

If we're excluding people when there are bugger all new people around, it'll be even worse when potential new people show up. We'll never get new people, if we don't make ourselves into an environment where people will want to come.

But, as Holly keeps saying, we're straying from the point of the thread somewhat.

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

I have thoughts on this, but will post them when I get home.

[Morgan Evanar]

Right now I think both Chris and I are primarily technical staff. I can usually react a bit faster than he can, but I have a lot of balls in the air for stuff that's my various aspects of life, so right now roleplaying isn't a huge thing.

Other topics:
I do think from a participatory standpoint doing most of the planning in a OOC thread for an IC thread would make things much more accessible.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Dasq, you're right that proactive staff in the past were probably already that way prior to taking on the position. But honestly, you've got to start somewhere. From the way I'm reading this discussion it seems no one is really responsible for anything anywhere (content wise) ... so nothing gets done at all.

People can do these things (RPer of the month etc) without needing a mod title, but if we decide to make such things an actual responsibility of the mod team going forward there's someone that can be followed up with should it not be getting done. Not to mention that mod powers automatically give a much larger range of abilities such as stickying threads etc.

As for who is going to be a mod to do this sort of thing, we'll only know once we throw open nominations for new mods and see who responds. But I think having this stuff clarified first is important so anyone putting their hand up knows what they're volunteering for.



EDIT: I suppose on a related note, what do current staff think of these ideas (in terms of expanded mod responsibilities)? Is Morg (or whoever) happy if we tell him he's now responsible for RPer of the month etc? Any proposed initiatives are going to effect current staff as well as any new ones.

Coming back to defining what we the board wish our staff to do, any thoughts on that?

Obviously settling disputes between posters, sniping spammers, deleting double posts, but also running things like RPer of the Month, football pick threads (or at least stickying them), being more proactive in generating content and being active...

Also, can we come to a consensus on removing inactive staff members?

edit: didn't see Morg's post, but I agree that he and a Ogre are our technical staff, and so not really people who would be expected to drive things forward, although they are here to help the board do what it wants to do, in a volunteer, real-Life-stuff goes on and we understand that way.

[Captain Untouchable]

Like I said before, I think it'd help to know what the difference between Admin and Moderator is before we get into what we expect our staff to do.

To use a specific example, the Image Claims thread. The system is meant to be that after an account has ten posts (ie. it will show up in the search) the image claim from the thread is transferred to the account's profile. This needs to be done by rummaging around behind the scenes, and thus requires a certain level of access to admin functions. Can Moderators do this, or can this task only be performed by an Admin? Is it something that could be added to the Moderator staff in isolation (ie. just access to be able to do that, not access to the rest of the stuff), or is it all or nothing?

Depending on the answer to questions like that, we might have different expectations for Moderators versus Admins. If only an Admin can do it, we need to make sure there is an Admin with enough time on their hands to get it done. If there's a way to tweak the settings and delegate the task to a Moderator (or all Moderators), that's a whole different kettle of fish.

Hell, I'm not allowed to work, so I have a lot of free time on my hands. If it's possible to tick some boxes so that I can potter around doing busywork like that, I would genuinely enjoy playing secretary/janitor so that it frees up the actual staff for the important discussions/decisions/etc. I'm not interested in titles, I'm just a fidgety workaholic with no outlet, and it bugs me seeing stuff not getting done.

[Atreyu]

Also, can we come to a consensus on removing inactive staff members?

I still propose my method I mentioned on the previous page. To elaborate a little bit:

1. Contact the inactive staff members
2. Note that we've noticed they've been largely absent in recent times, and ask that things are going ok.
3. Inform them that the board is undergoing few changes, which includes a look at revamping the staff (member-wise and responsibility-wise).
4. Ask if they see themselves being a part of this new revamp, or if they may wish to instead bow out and retire** gracefully.

(** - my preferred word over, say, 'demote', which to me carries negative connotations - some people have been on staff for years and deserve a bit of respect afterall )