Post Icon Spring Cleaning

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

Owing to the nature of the current discussions on streamlining, I figured it'd be a good idea to bring up the post icons and what we want/don't need.

I've made a list of icons I think are redundant and not needed, and a list of icons that I find to be in question (in terms of whether they are outdated or not)


Unneeded:

Black Sun - we have two, only need one
Black Nebula - both can most likely be gotten rid of unless someone has objection
All OPEN/CLOSED icons, since it's no hardship to include a written notification in the title IMO
IMP New Recruit
Black Sun OOC
Justice
Fleet - We have four fleet icons, and I don't see us needing any more than one to be honest.
Coruscant
Kuat
Rodia
Tatooine
OOC
Brawl
Official
Meeting
Discussion
OOC Sale
OOC swap
Planning
Quest
Raid
Slaves
Weapons
Kvettch
Exotic





Questionable:


(Jedi) Mission
(Jedi) Training
Garou - do we have anyone that does this anymore?
Sullust - I can see this being useful in the main RP section, but I'm open to whatever
Dac - same as above
Syndicate - Do we use this one? I seem to recall it being used before, but I'm not sure
Myth - if we have plans to revisit Myth I say keep, but if not then there's no need to hold onto this icon



This is just my list now, mind you, and what I am seeing. If you have suggestions and whatnot, please post them. I've not really included the KA/Circle tags since I'm not sure about those, plus I think those in the Circle would be better able to say which - if any - get used more than others. I've also not bothered with the general board icons or the WOD/MU/DC ones since again, I don't have much of a hand in those particular genres.

[Droo]

The (Jedi) Mission and Training icons can fall comfortably under the catch-all "Jedi" post icon.

Also, when you go to post and are presented with a huge wall of post icons, it's a bit ugly and overwhelming. Is there anyway we can go back to the drop down clusters of post icons that we used to have?

[Kale]

I would love to see pull-down clusters again if it's possible. That would make keeping some of the faction-specific variants like the Jedi "Mission" and "Training" tags more palatable. I wouldn't mind hanging on to those for variety's sake, especially for use in the Ossus forum, but I'm not too attached to them.

Also, I find it very fitting that this thread has no post icon. :)

[Captain Untouchable]

I still think it's important to distinguish between Imperial / Alliance fleet. If you're doing border skirmishes, meetings between old Admirals and Generals, Missions on the Novgorod, or what have you: it's still relevant which faction you are affiliated with.

I think it'd be useful to see a "Senate" tag for the Alliance as well (so three in total: Alliance, Senate, Fleet), so we can stop our politics getting into our peanut butter and such.

It might be nice to see Black Sun / Pirates / Bounty redesigned as if they're the same 'faction'... maybe with an Underworld tag for "anything else"?

All the other proposed subforums have their own special icons. It might be nice if Cloud City had it's own icon for the abundance of non-Imperials / non-Black Sun there, so that Cloud City isn't the lonely kid who went on his own to prom.

Could we maybe hang on to Tatooine for now? I'd never even noticed there was one... if it's a matter of "not deleting" rather than adding a new one, this might come in handy with space western stuff.

[Zem Vymes]

Why are we getting rid of open and closed tags? If we're having to write it in the title, then that's something I figure a tag is ideal to convey. I like the SW ones. The older dungeony ones are a bit camp, but I'd rather keep those. If I'm the odd man out on that, I can cut my losses, but I like 'em.

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

Making a distinction between Imperial and Alliance fleeting is fine, and I personally see no problem with that. I see a problem however with the fact that there are four fleet icons, and that is simply too many. If we wish to have separate icons for Imperial and Alliance then there's nothing wrong with that.

A Black Sun/Pirate/Bounty set is easy enough to make.

As for Cloud City, I know that there used to be a set for it, but it's a high possibility that it was trimmed. It's no hardship to put it back into the rotation if that's what folks want.

We can certainly keep Tatooine.

[Captain Untouchable]

Why are we getting rid of open and closed tags? If we're having to write it in the title, then that's something I figure a tag is ideal to convey. I like the SW ones. The older dungeony ones are a bit camp, but I'd rather keep those. If I'm the odd man out on that, I can cut my losses, but I like 'em.

I think the idea behind getting rid of open/closed tags is that it cuts the list in half in one swoop. Putting (open) in your thread title or what-have-you would make the list of icons considerably shorter and easier to navigate.

A smattering of open tags (an Alliance open tag, an Imperial one, etc) wouldn't be too chaotic... I guess it boils down to whether or not we expect to be doing a lot of open threads in the future?

[Lilaena De'Ville]

The point of the open/closed tags is that you could find at a mouse click ALL the open or closed threads. Until the topic tag sorting is restored they are much less useful.

[Taataani Meorrrei]

I always try to make an open thread wherever possible but I know I'm in the minority on doing that.

Is there a database constraint on the number of tags that I'm not aware of, or is it mainly that people are not liking having such a plethora to pick from?

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

Also, when you go to post and are presented with a huge wall of post icons, it's a bit ugly and overwhelming. Is there anyway we can go back to the drop down clusters of post icons that we used to have?

I seem to recall that before we upgraded - or it could've been more recently - the icons available when starting a thread were limited and specific to the forum that you were starting your thread within. I will ask Ogre about that.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

They used to be sorted into categories. They also used to be used for faction forums, which is why we have so many duplicates (Jedi fleet, rebel fleet, imperial fleet, etc etc) and now they're all lumped together and no one needs an OOC topic tag because factions don't have OOC forums anymore.

Now that the categories are gone and haven't been restored and perhaps no one is interested in making that happen? it's just a huge block of tags and it's ugly and cumbersome. Duplicates should certainly be taken out.

everything from VAMP to GHOST are old WoD OOC forum tags that are obsolete and can be removed.

[Emelie Shadowstar]

I'll figure out more later but I'm just gonna toss in that I loathe putting "Open" or "Closed" in my thread titles..ESPECIALLY if people are putting the date stamp in them too. It's too damn cluttered.. I like thinking of thread titles as story names. So I find the "(open)" or "(Closed)" thing really irritating.

BUT...if the general consensus is that they aren't necessary that's cool too... can "go with the flow" type thing.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Also, when you go to post and are presented with a huge wall of post icons, it's a bit ugly and overwhelming. Is there anyway we can go back to the drop down clusters of post icons that we used to have?

I seem to recall that before we upgraded - or it could've been more recently - the icons available when starting a thread were limited and specific to the forum that you were starting your thread within. I will ask Ogre about that.
This is also true. The Circle icons, for example, were only visible in the Circle forums.

edit: in case it needs to be said I am not in favor of getting rid of the newer Open/Closed SW tags. The old ones can die in a fire, EXCEPT that then all threads tagged with them in the past will now not have tags, so I don't know how we feel about that.

The General RPing Setting/Open/Closed tags should all remain. If functionality is restored they would be available just in the general RP forums and don't bother anyone.

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

If there are OPEN/CLOSED icons that people want to keep I'm not going to be a butt about it; it's just from the list that I was looking at, there a was bit of healthy redundancy going on. If we want to limit that particular category in some fashion while still keeping it about I have no issues at all. My main goal with this is streamlining while at the same time being sure that we get what we want/need.

And yah, that things were sorted to categories at first and eventually jumbled into one giant group makes a lot of sense considering the few doubles we have. There is a lot of overlap that we can cut off.

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

No no Sarah, you do bring up a very good point in that adding an OPEN/CLOSED along with the timestamp (if so relevant) detracts quite a bit from the title. It was not something that I'd considered when I made the thread, but it is certainly something that I am considering now.

[Captain Untouchable]

Just to clarify what you mean, Sarah... do you want "open" and "closed" threads to stay... or would it be okay if there were just the "open" ones, and then the not-open ones?

Most of the threads we do are closed. I think we can probably get away with the policy that "it's closed, unless it says it isn't" - ie. have SW and SW(open), instead of having to also have the closed icons.

Honestly, that should be the policy anyway. If people are intruding on threads that aren't explicitly open, then that is a giant dick move on their part. We shouldn't have to ass-cover to safeguard against people being dicks: we shouldn't have to, because they should know better. If a post is made where it doesn't belong and isn't wanted... report the post and bounce it up to the Staff to deal with?

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

Open and Closed tags were par for the course and essential way back when. If we move to a system that is "It's closed unless we say it's open' then it would behoove us to place a note in the FAQ or somewhere noticeable stating as such.

[Emelie Shadowstar]

(ffff....you jerks calling me out to explain myself right now :shakefist - kidding <3 you guys)

Anyway... I guess I'd be cool with just general and open, I think? Mostly because, yeah, it seems that the majority of threads that happen nowadays are closed/are only supposed to include certain characters so it's almost like the "open" is special circumstances.

[Dasquian Belargic]

I am strongly against having to write the words 'open' or 'closed' in the thread titles.

That being said, I think we can get rid of plenty of post icons. I personally don't see the need for any planet based icons.

All of the BHG icons could happily do, as could a number of what we used to call 'General' (ie. non RP) icons, IMO.

I don't think there is really a need to have 3 separate fleet icons personally.

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

Ok, I took my ugly red pen to the icon list. I left the open and closed icons since folks don't want to lose those. The circled icons are up in the air as to whether they get axed. I did connect SPAM and Hijack Me since to me they are one and the same, so we can stand to at least lose one of them imo. If there are others that you think need consideration for deleting, definitely speak up.

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh126/silancy/uglyredpen.jpg (http://s255.photobucket.com/user/silancy/media/uglyredpen.jpg.html)


Also, I made a revamped icon for Tatooine that I believe would fit a little better:

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh126/silancy/taticon.jpg (http://s255.photobucket.com/user/silancy/media/taticon.jpg.html)



edit - forgot to cross out the second Black Nebula >_<

[Droo]

Is there any need for the generic open, closed, and complete icons on the 11th row down, next to the Jedi and Sith icons? We already have the SW open, closed, and complete icons on the 2nd row, along with similar icons for just about every other roleplay setting. Poetry hardly, if ever, gets used, and the "hijack me" and "spam" icons are the same thing.

Also, even though I've never been a contributer to either setting, is there any real need for the Myth and Apocalypse icons? Those settings have been inactive for a long time now, and should things ever kick-off again in earnest, it only takes a moment to add them again. I'd argue the same for the Fallout setting, too.

Edit: Black Nebula can go, I think. I don't think it even exists anymore.

Edit 2: I see you already mentioned the Black Nebula thing. And I love the new Tatooine icon. :)

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

Yeah the Myth and other non-SW verse stuff I left since I wasn't so sure. I'm with you in that it'd be easy enough to add them back into the rotation should the interest come back.

If we are able to get the filters and masks back I think that would go a long way in helping to parcel this giant mess of a table up into bits that make a lot more sense.

And thanks, glad you like the new Tatooine :)



I am currently in the process of giving a few other icons a face lift, and have finished the Alliance set and the Jedi set. I've attached the Alliance set, which now matches their forum banner. I left out Bothawui for now since, if the AFP is going to be making it the homebase for their subforum I see no need for an icon for it.

[Dasquian Belargic]

I've done some pruning.

[Droo]

Playstation, Wii, and Xbox 360 are a bit out of fashion now, too. And what about those "Justice" western ones? How do people feel about those?

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

I'd crossed out the Justice icon, but left the open and closed ones for others to decide. I'm fine either way.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Gotham can be axed, it got almost immediately replaced by the DC ones.

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

An updated graphic:

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh126/silancy/uglyredpen2.jpg (http://s255.photobucket.com/user/silancy/media/uglyredpen2.jpg.html)

[Lilaena De'Ville]

I was going to say keep Poetry, just make it an instaban if someone uses it. ;)

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

Ha!

I was debating on whether or not to circle Whine. We could always make that one an instaban :p

[Lilaena De'Ville]

I like Whine :)

Ax "parents" imo

[Captain Untouchable]

If we're going to go ahead and have a Bothawui subforum, could we maybe add a Senate tag too? A way to distinguish legit Senate business (debates, meetings, etc) from Taataani trying to get Vansen in her pants (or whatever it is Charley is trying to do :uhoh) might be handy. :)

On the flipside, the Alliance might not need Dac or Sullust any more: almost everything is based on Bothawui these days.

The Fleet and R&D icons after REB and IMP can probably go: as long as we've got an Alliance and Imperial Fleet icon, that should cover all of our bases.

Do we still need the VS tags? Most of the time a character fights another character, it's part of a larger story... so we usually end up using one of the other tags most of the time anyway.

What's the intended purpose of the Lupine and Ciz tags? Back when we could filter by that it was handy for finding all of the past stuff from our invented races to look for facts / references / etc... but since we can't do that currently, can we make do with the other tags for those instances, or is there still a need for them to have something unique?

If we're getting rid of inactive settings, we can probably take off DC as well: that's so interwoven that it'd take a massive team effort to get that rolling again (similar to Myth I guess), and I don't think there's enough interest for that right now.

[Akasha Khan]

If we're going to go ahead and have a Bothawui subforum, could we maybe add a Senate tag too?

I think a Senate tag is a great idea! It wouldn't have to be limited to threads about official Senate proceedings; there's plenty of room for political drama in the wings and back room scheming as well.


Do we still need the VS tags? Most of the time a character fights another character, it's part of a larger story... so we usually end up using one of the other tags most of the time anyway.

I like the VS. tags myself, even if they're not used as frequently as the standard tags. I see them as a sort of genre marker for a thread. Case in point: Form III: One-Man Fortress (http://www.sw-fans.net/forum/showthread.php?22112-Form-III-One-Man-Fortress-Against-All-Odds) contains a lot of saber play, but only as the climax of a story about personal growth and duty. The Valley of Humiliation (http://www.sw-fans.net/forum/showthread.php?22060-The-Valley-of-Humiliation-%28Complete%29) is one extended fight scene - there's more to it than action, but the whole purpose and focus of the thread is the climactic showdown between Solomon and Acera. The VS. tag is perfect for a thread like that. It primes the reader for a focused, self-contained duel. I could see it working just as well for a more light-hearted battle of wits between Sanis Prent and Ecks, or a dogfight between Bette Davis and Jamo Jakatta, whether or not they're connected to a larger story.


What's the intended purpose of the Lupine and Ciz tags? Back when we could filter by that it was handy for finding all of the past stuff from our invented races to look for facts / references / etc... but since we can't do that currently, can we make do with the other tags for those instances, or is there still a need for them to have something unique?

The Cizerack have enough active participants that they're almost a faction themselves. Not to the point that they need their own subforum, but tagging their threads to make them easier to find is still handy, and I like the effect of seeing a variety of group tags in SW RP. I do hope we can restore the function of filtering by tags, but it's still much easier to skim through the forums and keep myself abreast of the Pride's business, just as we can skim through Imperial or Alliance threads.

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

I agree with Kale on the vs tags and the Ciz tag. I would prefer to keep the Lupine tag.

I'll make a senate tag when I get home.

[Captain Untouchable]

If we need to keep Lupine / Ciz / Pirate / Bounty / VS / etc, could we perhaps make them a little more consistent with the other tags? The fact that most of the tags (aside from the new Tatooine one, which is friggin' awesome) are mostly black with coloured text, and then suddenly WHAM there's a bright orange Ciz is a bit jarring... and while yes, technically there are enough writers to consider the Ciz their own faction, it's important to remember that they aren't: rhe Cultural Exchange thread (for example) has a Ciz tag, but the thread is only possible because the Cizerack are part of the Alliance.

Maybe it would make more sense for the Ciz tag to match the other Alliance icons, maybe?

I'm not sure I agree about the VS tags necessarily; but if people feel there's a need for them, fair enough. Do we need both lightsabers and pistols though, or is the crossed lightsabers representative enough? I don't know how it is in the US, but in the UK we use crossed swords on maps to represent battlefields from any era, regardless of whether or not they used swords. That'd mean we could use one VS tag for lightsaber duels, gunfights, gun vs lightsaber, dogfights, Imperial vs Alliance skirmishes, etc.

Also, while they're rare, we do have threads like Original Sin II, Blood of the Father, etc which happen in some sort of alternate timeline / possible future / etc. Would it be possible/beneficial to have a catch-all "not now" / "what if" tag for that sort of thing? Maybe it was just me, but the only reason I knew Original Sin II was in the future was because I knew that's where the Executor Van Derveld account was from... and Blood of the Father confused the heck out of me. ^_^;

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

If we need to keep Lupine / Ciz / Pirate / Bounty / VS / etc, could we perhaps make them a little more consistent with the other tags? The fact that most of the tags (aside from the new Tatooine one, which is friggin' awesome) are mostly black with coloured text, and then suddenly WHAM there's a bright orange Ciz is a bit jarring... and while yes, technically there are enough writers to consider the Ciz their own faction, it's important to remember that they aren't: rhe Cultural Exchange thread (for example) has a Ciz tag, but the thread is only possible because the Cizerack are part of the Alliance.

Maybe it would make more sense for the Ciz tag to match the other Alliance icons, maybe?

The beauty of those particular thread icons is that they are different. And especially in the case of the Cizerack, the color scheme is a perfect fit. I would greatly hesitate to change that particular icon since it is so perfect and indicative of the Cizerack as a whole; bright, showy and hard to miss.

As for the Lupine icon, I'd already had intentions to give it a redo and finished it sometime last week. It is a little bit of a darker scheme.

I'm not sure who made the matching Open/Closed/Bounty icons (unless it was myself and I'm just not remembering), but I see no reason why we can't try and replicate that motif for the Pirate icon.



I'm not sure I agree about the VS tags necessarily; but if people feel there's a need for them, fair enough. Do we need both lightsabers and pistols though, or is the crossed lightsabers representative enough? I don't know how it is in the US, but in the UK we use crossed swords on maps to represent battlefields from any era, regardless of whether or not they used swords. That'd mean we could use one VS tag for lightsaber duels, gunfights, gun vs lightsaber, dogfights, Imperial vs Alliance skirmishes, etc.

I personally like the two different VS icons, since one pretty much says 'hey, Force users duking it out up in this thread', and the other says 'we got some smugglers/hunters/mercenaries going at it in here'. It's a nice easy way to tell at a glance what kind of fight is happening.




Also, while they're rare, we do have threads like Original Sin II, Blood of the Father, etc which happen in some sort of alternate timeline / possible future / etc. Would it be possible/beneficial to have a catch-all "not now" / "what if" tag for that sort of thing? Maybe it was just me, but the only reason I knew Original Sin II was in the future was because I knew that's where the Executor Van Derveld account was from... and Blood of the Father confused the heck out of me. ^_^;

'What If' may work, but I personally think using the Han Solo font makes it look like shit. And I really don't want to make an icon that says YFN, since all I see when I look at that is yiffin'.

I made two senate icons; one AFP themed and another in more of a simple gradient wash. Wasn't sure which one would be preferred.


Also not entirely on the SW front, but ages ago I did make a ST icon that I don't think I ever did anything with. If ST does kick off again, the icon is available for it.

[Captain Untouchable]

Oooh. Is that the Deep Space Nine font on that Lupine one? :ohno


Small side thought. The new Alliance icons are designed to match the new Rebel Alliance style, but if you're like me and you use the drop down at the bottom of the forums to pick your style (instead of going through each and every one of your accounts to change it manually in the settings) it seems to override subforum-specific styles. I hadn't even seen there was a new version of the Rebel Alliance theme... and I imagine for someone new to the forums, who isn't familiar with that forum theme, it might not be immediately obvious that they're related to the Alliance (a lot of people would see that font and think Battlestar Galactica before anything else), unlike the older ones which made it real freakin' obvious.

Not saying they should be changed or anything... just something we maybe need to be aware of in terms of tool tips, the order that tags show up in the list, etc.

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

Both the Lupine and ST icons use the Final Frontier font.


When new folks register and choose their settings, there is a dialogue beneath the styleset box that says "There is more than one skin in which you can view the forums. If you would like to switch to a different skin, select it from this list." If someone is new, then I imagine that they would go through the styles to find what they like. If people wish to use the quickswitch function at the bottom of the page, then cleaning cookies every so often will need to be done. Each group did have their own styles that were mostly locked in to their subforums, so I will add that to the pile of things to ask Mr. Dotnet about.

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

Ok, the list of icons that are up in the air.


Quiz
Cartoon
Signature - we have a 'Photoshop' icon that will work just as well for this, I think.
Collecting
Sketching - we have an 'Art' icon that would be used for the same purpose.
Serious - there's a 'No Spam' icon that conveys that same message. Or, if we want to get rid of 'No Spam' and keep 'Serious' that's cool too. Both I find to be interchangeable, so I'm fine either way.

[Droo]

I have no objection to all of them going.

[Charley]

Ok, the list of icons that are up in the air.


Quiz
Cartoon
Signature - we have a 'Photoshop' icon that will work just as well for this, I think.
Collecting
Sketching - we have an 'Art' icon that would be used for the same purpose.
Serious - there's a 'No Spam' icon that conveys that same message. Or, if we want to get rid of 'No Spam' and keep 'Serious' that's cool too. Both I find to be interchangeable, so I'm fine either way.


I'm okay with losing those

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

These are the Ossus tags I'd made a while back to go with the Ossus style. Yes/no?

[Ndonsa]

Are we getting a banner in the Ossus style?

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

I had made a banner for it, but I think it got left out when the Alliance and Imperial ones were plugged in. I'll check into it.

[Akasha Khan]

I like the color scheme for those Ossus tags, but the glow around the labels makes them really hard to read.

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

Changed the glow to a darker color set to multiply:

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

Thread necromancy so that I can finish this.


edit - pruned the wall and updated the Alliance tags, Tatooine tag, and Lupine tag.

[Atreyu]

Some suggestions :)

* Kill 'Gotham' (just use the DC ones).
* Kill either 'Photos' or 'Photography' (same thing, don't need both).
* Kill 'Sketching' (just use 'Art' instead).
* 'Whine' and 'Rant' possibly the same thing? If so could nuke one of those.
* Not sure what 'Kitties' and 'Repeat?' are meant for, if just for silly stuff could probably be nuked and just use 'Spam' instead.
* 'Bounty' is listed twice so one could be nuked (plus another 'Bounty' with a different colour scheme also there - don't know if that's needed or what it's there for).
* Don't know what 'NSP' stands for.

[Q. Samus Dage]

NSP is No Spam :)

[Lilaena De'Ville]

No Spam Please ;)

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

Hurf durf :p

[Atreyu]

Ahh, I see. :) I just use 'Serious' for that purpose.

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

Kept Serious, killeed NSP
Kept Rant, killed Whine
killed the duplicate general complete tag
Killed the Signature tag


Switched up the tag order a tiny bit so that Mod is the first in the list.


I think for now that I'll call this done. Once I get some other stuff taken care of, I'll come back and start looking into organizing them how we used to have them.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Wait, why did you kill whine? :( oh well

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

I know I slapped this with complete, but I had a slight idea flash, so I made an Admin tag. I've added it, so it's ready to use.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

:D

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

Oh you :p