VH1's Loves the 90's does 99 and TPM

[Jedieb]

It was on last night, but I missed it. It'll be repeated tonight at 8PM EST. It's pretty ridiculous to get nostalgic to look back on something that happened only a few years ago, but it should be interesting. I doubt they'll look back on the hype and Jar Jar favorably, but it should be worth a laugh or two.

[The Man in Black]

If they treat it like all the horrible flops and trends of the other years, they will be QUITE harsh :D

As well they should.

[Jedi Master Carr]

Well it wasn't a flop though because it made over 900 million WW I hardly call that a flop. Even critically it wasn't that hated, it got like 64% on Rotten Tomatoes that means it is considered fresh, it is only the fans and certain parts of the media that look at it that way.

[The Man in Black]

Oh stop apologizing. It was horrid, and I'm even nice about it.

[CMJ]

Horrid? No.

Disappointing? Yes.

Occasionally fun to watch? Yes.

Worst in the series? Yes.

[JMK]

Originally posted by CMJ
Horrid? No.

Disappointing? Yes.

Occasionally fun to watch? Yes.

Worst in the series? Yes.

DING DING DING! Ring the bell Courtland is absolutely right!

TPM had the most hype of any movie ever, it would have been impossible for it to live up to it. It would have made 900 million world wide no matter how good or bad it was.

[Jedi Master Carr]

I don't know about that 900 million is hard to make, so hard only four films have made more money than it (ANH, Titantic, Harry Potter, ROTK) that is amazing any movie that makes that much there is more there than hype. I really think kids got it, the movie was more kid friendly than the last one (which is why that one didn't do as well). I still think its a good movie does it live it to the others? I don't know I like it just about as much but that is my opinion.

[JMK]

Originally posted by Jedi Master Carr
I don't know about that 900 million is hard to make, so hard only four films have made more money than it (ANH, Titantic, Harry Potter, ROTK) that is amazing any movie that makes that much there is more there than hype. I really think kids got it, the movie was more kid friendly than the last one (which is why that one didn't do as well). I still think its a good movie does it live it to the others? I don't know I like it just about as much but that is my opinion.

It may not be as hard as you think when many many people saw TPM over 20 times in theaters, some more than that, and almost everyone that is a fan saw it more than once.

[CMJ]

I don't think 900M was assured. But the kid factor is definitely a big one.

[JMK]

I think just the Star Wars vs Titanic B.O. battle was going to assure it 1 billion and it didn't even get there.

[Jedi Master Carr]

Yeah I think it being so kid friendly really helped it. I don't think it was that easy, the SW fans who went to see AOTC 20 times didn't help it any and it only made like 650 WW. I think there are a lot of factors that attributed to why it made 900. Hype, Kid friendly, rapid SW fans are and competition (TPM had virtually none before it and not much until Austin Powers 2 came out). I think those factors are partly why it made so much. The question now is will Episode 3 do anywhere close. I say that because there are reports that LFL is going to hype it up like TPM. Pepsi is doing a campaign again a long with other things. Also so far there is no Spiderman in front of it, its biggest competitor Batman Begins comes out in June. I doubt it will make 900 but it could make more than AOTC because of these factors.

[JMK]

Originally posted by Jedi Master Carr
Yeah I think it being so kid friendly really helped it. I don't think it was that easy, the SW fans who went to see AOTC 20 times didn't help it any and it only made like 650 WW.

I think that's largely because when the dust settled after TPM was released and AotC came out, many people were completely turned off by TPM and some probably didn't even see AotC. Personally speaking, I saw TPM 21 or 22 times in theaters, but after the 3rd or 4th viewing, I started realizing that it wasn't the greatest SW movie ever made. The fact that I was seeing new SW on the big screen kept drawing me back in. AotC on the other hand, I enjoyed two or three times more than TPM, yet only got to see it 7 times in the theaters. While I loved it, I wasn't drawn to the theater by the allure of 'new Star Wars' in the same way I was with TPM. I'd wager that a lot of people felt the same thing, which partially explains the 650WW gross.

[Jedi Master Carr]

Well Star Wars isn't as popular overseas (expect Japan) either never really was, I think they hype factor drawed a lot of people in Europe and elsewhere into the theaters for TPM. I am not sure how the hype of the last SW movie ever is going to effect Episode 3. I am hoping it does better than AOTC.

[The Man in Black]

Originally posted by Jedi Master Carr
Well Star Wars isn't as popular overseas (expect Japan) either never really was, I think they hype factor drawed a lot of people in Europe and elsewhere into the theaters for TPM. I am not sure how the hype of the last SW movie ever is going to effect Episode 3. I am hoping it does better than AOTC.

You seem to be "the voice of people overseas" quite often. That must add up to a lot of frequent flyer miles.

I don't recall their being much of a disparity in international affinity for Star Wars. At least before the prequels hit, that is.

[Jedi Master Carr]

I talk to people on the net plus I read a lot. Also the Original films didn't do that well in overseas markets only ANH is on the the top 25 films of all time. TESB did less than 200 million overseas that isn't very good. It is popular in Japan, I know that because of the records the films have had there.

[Dutchy]

Originally posted by CMJ
Horrid? No.

Disappointing? Yes.

Occasionally fun to watch? Yes.

Worst in the series? Yes.

I miss Jonathan. :)

[Jedi Master Carr]

LOL I could just imagine what he would have to say about this

[CMJ]

Originally posted by Dutchy
I miss Jonathan. :)

I'll let him know you're thinking about him. We still communicate occasionally. :lol

[Marcus Telcontar]

Originally posted by Jedi Master Carr
I talk to people on the net plus I read a lot. Also the Original films didn't do that well in overseas markets only ANH is on the the top 25 films of all time. TESB did less than 200 million overseas that isn't very good. It is popular in Japan, I know that because of the records the films have had there.

Bzzzt. Star wars is indeed very popluar - and you have to factor in the fact that most countries, even Australia are an absolute mile behind in theatre counts, even more so in 1977. Box office counting was almos tnon existant, the true importance of Intl receipts only seemed to truly dawn on Hollywood in the 90's with Jurassic Park becoming such a world wide hit. Add ID4 too. Up to then, what was the second / third biggest Inll movie of all time?

JMC, I have to say your argument is pretty weak this time. Arguing B.O. figures in this case too isnt showing the true popularity of Star Wars - it had two decades of video and TV to build up a world wide fan base. I point out it well and truly has - if TPM was half decent, the B.O. numbers would have been stupidly huge, in the Titanic regions. But it wasnt.

I cant even watch TPM. I still love the OT :/

[Zasz Grimm]

In my opinion, physically, it had the best lightsaber dueling sequence. I don't care what anyone says about Yoda, Maul was awesome.

And in my opinion, that battle is better than both Luke vs. Vaders.

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

Originally posted by Zasz Grimm
In my opinion, physically, it had the best lightsaber dueling sequence. I don't care what anyone says about Yoda, Maul was awesome.

And in my opinion, that battle is better than both Luke vs. Vaders.

Haha no.

Better than Yoda vs. Dooku? Sure.

Better than Luke vs. Vader in ESB? Not a chance. That duel had what most in the SW movies lack - atmosphere thick enough to cut with a knife.

[Marcus Telcontar]

Originally posted by Zasz Grimm
In my opinion, physically, it had the best lightsaber dueling sequence. I don't care what anyone says about Yoda, Maul was awesome.

And in my opinion, that battle is better than both Luke vs. Vaders.

No. Luke vs Vader had much more to it than fancy moves. It had real emotion. It was more than just another sabre battle, especially in ROTJ, it was their very souls they were fighting for. ROTJ works for all this emotion and undercurrents. The last sequence when Luke nearly gives into the Dark Side is haunting and powerful for your seeing what could be the final victory of the Emperor and the Dark Side, if he gave in.

Demented CG on a screen is nothing compared to either ESB or ROTJ sabre battles.

[Dasquian Belargic]

Demented CG on a screen is nothing compared to either ESB or ROTJ sabre battles.

AFAIK, TPM didn't use CG (for Maul). Ray Park has some mad skills :p I don't prefer that fight to Luke vs Vader, but the way the fight moves almost like a dance (Maul/Obi) is great to look at.

[JMK]

It was flashy to look at, I didn't think 2 people would move so quickly, but there can't be any debate about this...what was on the line in the 2 Luke/Vader duels makes them better than Kenobi/Maul. There were real consequences should Vader prevail. Luke was the last Jedi (not counting Leia), having him jump to the darkside would have been disastrous. If Maul had defeated Kenobi...what would have happened? A few extra tears shed and one of the other thousand Jedi Knights takes on Maul.

[Charley]

Originally posted by Dasquian Belargic
AFAIK, TPM didn't use CG (for Maul). Ray Park has some mad skills :p I don't prefer that fight to Luke vs Vader, but the way the fight moves almost like a dance (Maul/Obi) is great to look at.

Yes, but I am the kind of person that prefers emotion and intense atmosphere in a duel. For instance, one of the best duels in the history of film is in The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly. Not an action-packed showdown. No special effects. Just three guys, in a cemetary, with $250,000. Clint Eastwood, Lee Van Cleef, and Eli Wallach, all staring each other down from here to Eternity. Throw in one of the best pieces of music ever written by Ennio Morricone, and you start to figure out why duels are more than the action or the glitter.

[Droo]

What piece of Ennio Morricone music was used for that duel?

[Charley]

Originally posted by Dru
What piece of Ennio Morricone music was used for that duel?

"The Trio"

[Zasz Grimm]

Originally posted by JMK
It was flashy to look at, I didn't think 2 people would move so quickly, but there can't be any debate about this...what was on the line in the 2 Luke/Vader duels makes them better than Kenobi/Maul. There were real consequences should Vader prevail. Luke was the last Jedi (not counting Leia), having him jump to the darkside would have been disastrous. If Maul had defeated Kenobi...what would have happened? A few extra tears shed and one of the other thousand Jedi Knights takes on Maul.


And gets shut down just like Kenobi AND Jinn were. He took on a Jedi Master and Kenobi (near-knight) And nearly won. Had he not gloated he would have. Think of the repercussions that would have had. (bear with me, I already know the predetermined outcome.)

Maul kills Kenobi and Qui Gonn. Slays Padme (hur, goodbye luke and leia) and then Anakin. That happens, there are no other movies.

In that way, both battles rely on the outcome. Had Obi-Wan lost, all would have. But there really was no 'atmosphere' as you so eloquently put in the Maul battle. He just exhibited so much power and nearly slaughtered the best Jedi had to offer.

[JMK]

No disrespect to Kenobi or Jinn, but I think either Windu and especially Yoda would have handed Maul's thorny head right back to him. But that's another debate for another thread. :)