Limbaugh racist??

[Jedi Master Carr]

Not sure if anybody heard this but the loudmouth made his first controversal statement on ESPN

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20031001/ap_on_en_tv/limbaugh_quarterback_2

To me the statement is just stupid. Mcnabb is a great QB, IMO he has little offensive talent around him and IMO the Eagles lost a lot of players. Still they won a tough game a Buffalo and Mcnabb played great. ESPN should can Rush, he has no buisness doing that show.

[Figrin D'an]

He's not racist, but his comments were poorly constructed and lacked any tact. I think everyone, including ESPN, expected him to say something foolish and controversial at some point, given his tendancy to draw attention to himself.

Personally, I think that McNabb's performance the past couple of seasons has been quite remarkable, considering there are very few weapons around him. He's just a little gun shy and hesitant since his injury last season, though. It showed in the NFC title game last year against Tampa Bay, and it has still been present in the first games this season (even in the win against Buffalo). He doesn't take off from the pocket as much as he did before he broke his fibula last year. For the Eagles to be successful, he has to be willing to run when pass protection breaks down.

As for Limbaugh... I don't think ESPN should, or will, fire him... at least not yet, not until he makes another ill-advised comment or two. From a purely football POV, the guy was a sports reporter at one time and covered the NFL regularly. He's a better addition to the NFL Countdown crew in that respect that Michael Irvin, IMO.

[JMK]

I just think that Limbaugh is a loud mouthed idiot. I don't think his comments were as racist as they are ignorant and ill informed. Of course I could be wrong, and he may be a part of the Klan for all I know, but he's made a career of saying stupid things and making everyone freak out over him.


Did anyone hear what Steve Kline of the St Louis Cardinals said about Mark Prior? He hopes he takes a linedrive in the head so we never have to see him again. Pretty harsh, especially coming from a player who isn't in the post season.

[Jedi Master Carr]

Well I don't think he is racist, although I dispise him for other reason. Still I hate him on there partly because of my bias towards him and I don't think a non-football/brodcaster should be commenting on football.

[BUFFJEDI]

Wow!!!!!!I didn't know people hated Rush with this much passionO_o
I hope that he is not racist, cause I normally agree with him. Do I think his comments were racist , not at all. I actually think he told the truth. Look at the whole hopla about black coaches, I think that's were Rush is coming from, I hope .

[Taylor Millard]

I don't think Rush is racist, nor do I think his comments were racially motivated. He's expressing his opinion on McNabb. Is he right about McNabb?

In my opinion, no. I think McNabb is a great QB, but he's had a bad year. Rush just might not like McNabb and think he's overrated.

I mean, c'mon guys, how often do people think that a 'great player' is overrated? I sure know plenty of players people consider 'great' who I think are overrated and not as good as they appear.

The reason Limbaugh's comments are scrutinized is because they were on National TV and it is Limbaugh. While his comments are wrong, imo, he had every right to say them.

[Figrin D'an]

Originally posted by Taylor Millard
The reason Limbaugh's comments are scrutinized is because they were on National TV and it is Limbaugh. While his comments are wrong, imo, he had every right to say them.


Quoted for being of great truth.

[Pierce Tondry]

I pretty much agree with Taylor's entire post.

[Jedieb]

I knew Fatbaugh's ignorant mouth would wield its magic sooner or later. This is why I've changed my Sunday morning routine. The few times I have caught Countdown and seen Fatbaugh in action he's alternated between decent football comments (the NFL should fight Maurice Clarret's lawsuit), to the outright stupid (the key to beating the Bucs' defense is to PASS against them. Again, the key to beating one of the best pass defenses in the history of the game is to PASS against them. Because we all saw how well that worked out for the Raiders in the Superbowl.)

This is just vintage Fatbaugh. He basically said that the sports media has elevated McNabb because he's black. Yeah, because we all know the massive liberal bias that exists amongst sports writers.:rolleyes There's no denying that the league, fans, and media want to see black coaches and QB's succeed. Putzes like Fatbaugh ignore the history and reasons behind those wishes. Blacks have been DENIED access to coaching positions since the league started. Strong armed black football players weren't even given chances to play QB in high school and college for decades because coaches viewed it as a white position. There are reasons why guys like Doug Williams and Warren Moon were considered important black athletes and role models. Because they got chances to do things other black athletes had been denied.

It's not that Fatbaugh is wrong because he thinks McNab isn't a good QB. Anyone could argue that position. Where the blowhard gets it wrong is when he says that the reason so many people give him props is because he's black. McNab gets credit because when he's on (which he was for most of last season) he generates close to 70% of his team's offense. He does this with mediocre receivers, an average offensive line, and a pouting running back. Remember the game in which he broke his fibula last year? He threw something like 4 TD passes and had one of the best QB performances of the year. AND HE DID IT ON A BROKEN LEG! Last year I had McNab as my fantasy QB. He got me a truckload of points, week after week. Hell, before his injury he was one of the best Fantasy Football players in the league. Is Fatbaugh going to argue that the computers have a race filter that jacked up his numbers? Again, this putz is a tool of EPIC proportions.

Here's another bit of Fatbaugh logic for you to ponder. In his cholesterol addled mind Fatbaugh has plenty of proof to back up his statement. Want to know what it is? Fatbaugh says that the fact that there's been such an outrage over his comments is PROOF that he's right. Think about that. He says something ignorant, people get ticked off, he sees that as proof. Brilliant!
:rolleyes

If your on the fence about this putz, just go to your bookstore or library and get Franken's hysterical and meticulously researched book Rush Limbaugh is a Big Fat Idiot. After reading that I never took the blowhard all that seriously.

To tell the truth, I think ESPN wasn't just looking for ratings. I think they were trying to find someone to make Chris Berman look thinner. Of course, that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.:smokin

[Lilaena De'Ville]

So to justify that Rush is an idiot with a big mouth, and racist, you make fun of his weight? Wow....that's so mature... >_<

I'd quote Taylor's post again, but I won't bother. I agree with what he said.

Also... ESPN knew that Rush was gonna make loud mouthed comments. It's what he's known for. They're not going to fire him, 'cause he's good for ratings. People wanna hear what he's gonna say next.

[Jedieb]

Well of course I make fun of his weight. Because he's FAT. Hence the title of the hysterically, meticulously researched book that tore him a new one. :smokin

[Taylor Millard]

Originally posted by Jedieb
Well of course I make fun of his weight. Because he's FAT. Hence the title of the hysterically, meticulously researched book that tore him a new one. :smokin

Well if you think weighing 195 is fat, then go right ahead and make fun of his weight.
More power to ya.

[Jedi Master Carr]

Well Franken did it and I thought that book was hilarious :p

[Pierce Tondry]

Putting the Fatty McFatterton jokes aside... :rolleyes

I have to say that I really don't watch ESPN and I've never been any kind of Limbaugh fan. His presence on that channel does not make me want to watch it- it makes me want to check out CNN instead.

Admittedly, I'm not keen on political pundits in general, except insofar as an information/news source. In fact, I'm not keen on having people tell me what to think in general and I wish the media would cut that out and focus more on reporting ramifications of events with even-handed coverage.

I think I have the soul of an analyst which is why I have this particular bias.

[Jedi Master Carr]

I don't like that either too much news like Fox where they try to tell you what to think I hate that crap

[Jedieb]

195lbs, on the moon maybe.......

I’ve been so mean to Fatbaugh. Here you go, I’ll let Fatty defend himself with some of his own words. (Everything in parenthesis are my own witty observations.)

Feminism was established so as to allow unattractive women access to the mainstream of society.
With the exception of the military, I defy you to name one government program that has worked and alleviated the problem it was created to solve.
(Highlighting the epic failures that are Social Security, Medicare, Head Start, Food Stamps, The National Park System, federal penetentiaries, Youth Summer Jobs Programs, The Peace Corps, Public Libraries, the G.I. Bill, the EPA, and Unemployment Insurance. The last one is particularly ironic when you look at the next Fatbaugh quote.)
The poor in this country are the biggest piglets at the mother pig and her nipples.
(BTW, Fatbaugh once lived off the government nipple known as unemployment insurance. However, at the time, his wife WAS able to hold a job. Probably because she wasn’t as FAT as he was.)
My wife made me go and file for unemployment.
I don’t have compassion for the poor.
Never trust a draft dodger.
(BTW, Rush WAS a draft dodger.)
Ronald Reagan was the greatest President of the 20th Century.
(In of itself this isn’t an evil statement. The problem is that Fatbaugh NEVER voted for Ronald Reagan. See, this great American didn’t register to vote until he was 35 years old.)
stupid, unskilled Mexicans,
Have you ever noticed how all newspaper composite pictures of wanted criminals resemble Jesse Jackson?
I found out I was really good at insulting people.
there’s no conclusive proof that nicotine’s addictive..... And the same thing with cigarettes causing emphysema, lung cancer, heart disease.
There are more American Indians alive today than there were when Columbus arrived.
(To his credit, Fatbaugh was only off by around 15-18...... MILLION..)
I made no effort to evade or avoid it (the Vietnam draft)
(physical deferment from a) a football knee from high school
(physical deferment from a) pilonidal cyst
I had student defferments in college, and upon taking a physical, was discovered to have a physical..........
(There’s no record Fatbaugh ever took a physical. In fact, he pre-emted a physical by basically providing a doctor’s note.)
The worst of all of this is the lie that condoms really protect against AIDS. The condom failure rate can be as high as 20 percent.
(This is of course is patently false. Although I can see how a morbidly obese man with a small penis could have a condom slip off his reed thin member in 1 out of every 5 sexual encounters. Poor bastards.)
(AND FINALLY>>>>>)
It’s time to start championing old fashioned values like self restraint, self discipline
(Unless you’re at buffet of course. Or perhaps divorce court, where Fatty has found himseld twice.)

Man, Franken's book is gold. I'm going to have a blast re-reading on Sunday mornings before kickoff.

[Jedi Master Carr]

LOL Jedieb

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Calling him morbidly obese is horrible. :mad

[Jedi Master Carr]

I find it funny, of course I dislike the guy :p

[Figrin D'an]

Jedieb, you've gone from disagreement with his POV to just berating him because he's overweight (which, BTW, he used to be a lot heavier... he actually lost quite a bit a few years ago).


I'm not a fan of Limbaugh... I disagree with him on a great many things. But I'm not going to sink so low as to mock his weight problem at every turn. I see no need to stoop to childish name calling simply as an impetus to expunge your reasons for not liking the man.

Is it possible to make a point without resorting to that kind of boorish behavior?

[Jedi Master Carr]

I think its just be sarcastic Franken did the same thing in his book. Besides he did make some valid points in that one post about him. Limbaugh is a huge hypocrite, IMO.

[Figrin D'an]

Sarcasm or not, like any other attempt at humor against another person's physical being, it becomes old, ineffective and just plain rude after a while. This is my main issue with Franken's book as well. He makes some fine points, and has evidence to back them up. But he resorts to the same punchline time and time again, which really isn't even that funny.


Be it interwoven with valid criticism or not, there is little justification for droning on such a thing ad nausem.

[Jedi Master Carr]

Well I actually like Franken's book but hey that is just my opinion. I hear his new one is even better.

[Figrin D'an]

Looks like Limbaugh chose to resign from his job at ESPN.

[Jedi Master Carr]

I just saw that, wow. I wonder if he was under some preasure from some people in the NFL countdown, I know Berman said some things after the fact. And though the ESPN producer said nice things Disney might not have liked it.

[JMK]

Maybe he knew he was a bad fit from the start and didn't want to cause any more trouble for the other guys he works with. They just want to talk football and he's gone and thrown a wrench in all of that.

[Jedi Master Carr]

That is possible too. I personally don't think he worked, he just didn't seem to fit with the format even though I don't like him.

[Sanis Prent]

You are all a bunch of hypocritical tools. Way to go. I'll try to consult you when I need a double standard next time. Well played, all three of you.

[Jedi Master Carr]

First off I didn't call him a racist. I just made that as the comment to play devils advocate there to start a discussion that was all. And the whole fat thing I only find it funny because I don't like him :p

[Sanis Prent]

lol McNabb sucks lol, omg he's black too thats FUNNEE!!!

(see where I'm going?)

[Jedieb]

NA NA NA NA! NA NA NA NA! HEY! HEY! GOODBYE!

BUH, BYE FATBAUGH!!!!!!!:lol :p :lol :p

Now, if only Michael Irving would say something stupid enough to make the liberal sports media force his resignation.

[Preacher Blake]

Well, apparently you learned your lesson. Way to go.

[Jedi Master Carr]

Limbaugh is being investigated for illegal painkillers too, I wonder if he quit for that?

[Figrin D'an]

yeah, good job guys. Have fun gloating amongst yourselves in your cesspool of hypocrasy. When you manage to buy yourselves a clue and can discuss things without resorting kindergarden humor, come find me.

[Jedieb]

This is just a great day. My pool table is getting delivered and I got my favorite pregame show back. I’ll be busy putting the table together so forgive me for not being around to revel in Rush Limbaugh’s resignation. Yes, I called him by his given name. I’ve had my fun in ridiculing him, but just this once, I’m going to stay serious.

I don’t believe that Rush’s comments last Sunday are proof that he’s racist. The comments weren’t overtly racist. They were just plain WRONG. He didn’t just say McNab was overrated. If that had been the essence of his comments then there wouldn’t have been an uproar. He got in trouble for using one of his tired old right wing arguments; the liberal media distorts the truth. He didn’t attack McNab so much as he did sports commentators and journalists. He unwittingly INSULTED the very people he shared the set with! Steve Young, Chris Berman, Tom Jackson, Chris Mortensen, Sterling Sharpe, Mike Greenberg, Mike Golic, Sean Salsbury, Robin Roberts, Mike Lupica, Bob Ryan, Dennis Green, Tony Kornheiser, Mike Wilbon, and the rest of their ESPN brethren have all sung McNab’s praises at one time or another. Limbaugh just didn’t say they were incorrect when they did so, he said they were motivated by some form of race pity!

If someone told you the only reason you admired a black athlete, actor, or politician was because of his race and not his performance, wouldn’t you be ticked off? That’s what Limbaugh did to an entire field of journalists. It’s only understandable that writers across the country went off on him.

This story picked up steam as the week went along. When McNab started reacting to the story and had a press conference it really took off. By last night ESPN2 was having a discussion moderated by Bob Ley on Sportscenter. Mitch Album, an African American sportswriter from Philly, and one of the first African American NFL QB’s made up the panel. They were all critical of Limbaugh’s comments. Limbaugh had been invited to take part in the discussion but he declined. His denial to appear on the show and defend his statement is typical Limbaugh. Limbaugh rarely grants interviews or takes part in one on one discussions. He simply doesn’t do well when he has to defend his statements in front of an audience or other commentators. Hell, back in 93 he was booed on Letterman. The highlight of the interview coming when Letterman called him a gas bag and got a huge laugh from the audience.

Limbaugh isn’t backing down from his comments. Part of the reason he’s resigning is because he simply doesn’t want to have to face some of the journalists he’s accused of ‘race pity.’ It’s easy for him to make his arguments on his radio show where he screens his callers and controls every aspect of the show. Plus, now he gets the added benefit of holding himself as a victim of the liberal media. Which is completely ludicrous.

There are plenty of things that you can call the media. Call them lazy, sensationalistic, and sloppy. But to label the majority of them as liberal is simply false. Is there any major broadcast network that has as strong a liberal bias as FOX has a conservative one? Is there ANY form of media that is as overwhelming liberal as talk radio is conservative? Yes, there are major newspapers with liberal editorial slants, but there are also major newspapers with conservative editorial slants. Both sides get their say. Limbaugh tried to use a tired old argument to criticize a player he doesn’t like and got burned in the process. He has no one to blame but himself.

Race is an important issue in the NFL. In the last couple of decades the NFL has made great strides with regards to black coaches and quarterbacks. Men who for years were DENIED opportunities are now getting their shot. It’s a sign of progress that Tony Dungy can get fired from the Bucs and find himself coaching the Colts a few months later. He’s on the coaching carousel. There’s nothing wrong with football commentators and journalists being pleased with these advances. It’s normal to praise trailblazers and perfectly acceptable. It sure as heck isn’t a liberal bias. Does anyone here think George Will would deny the importance of Jackie Robinson because he’s a conservative? Does praise of Robinson’s accomplishments and significance belong solely to liberals? Of course not!

Is everything perfect in the NFL? No. The current NFL policy of requiring teams to interview African Americans for coaching vacancies is a bit heavy handed and has some flaws. The Lions shouldn’t of been penalized for going after Mooch. That’s who they really wanted and token interviews are only going to insult black coaches. If Limbaugh had addressed that issue then he could have made some valid point and sparked an interesting discussion. But that’s NOT what he did.

I love it when McNab screws up. But I do so because I HATE the Eagles. That’s a legitimate sports bias. I’ve ragged on Quincy Carter for 2 years now, because he’s SUCKED! People are giving Carter props now because he’s PRODUCING. Sports is like that. Criticism and praise come from PERFORMANCE, not the color of the player’s skin. If Carter continues to play well under Parcell’s guidance than I’ll be the first one to admit I was wrong about him. If and when I change my mind about Carter it’ll be because he’s won some games and played well. NOT because he’s black and I’m under the influence of the liberal sports media.

Limbaugh lost his job because he accused admirers of McNab of overrating him solely because of the color of his skin. If he’d bother to do some research he would have found plenty of white sports writers who have taken shots at McNab during the years. Especially this season with the poor start the Eagles have gotten off to. Exactly what writer can Limbaugh hold up as evidence of this false ‘race pity’ praise of McNab? How many of us here on this very board have made positive comments about McNab, Vick, or McNair? Did we do it because we felt sorry for the black QB? Hell, how many of us have taken shots at Kordell Stewert when he’s played like garbage? A BUNCH OF US HAVE! We weren’t afraid to criticize him because he was black. We ragged on him because he played poorly and praised those other black QB’s because they played well. END OF STORY.

In the end, Limbaugh got what he deserved. Now he’s cutting and running. It’s rather cowardly for him to quit when one of his statements gets him in trouble. Instead of standing up and fighting, he’s running away because he knows he can’t back it up. But this is typical Limbaugh. I knew he’d eventually get in trouble, but I never imagined he’d wuss out before the fight even started.

Now, I’ve got to get back to putting that pool table together. And remember, just like life, the game’s not over until the WHITE/MAN ball drives every colored ball OFF the table. Leaving the BLACK/MAN ball as his last victim! (Sorry, I had to get one last cheap joke in. Plus, Boomerang was a pretty good movie.)

[JMK]

Just so everyone is clear; who exactly are you guys talking to? o_O

[Charley]

You, Eb, and Carr.

[JMK]

Hmm, I can't speak for others, but you're going to call me a 'hypocritical tool' for calling him a loud mouthed idiot who *maybe* resigned because things were getting too hot for his castmates, which by the way, he's admitted this afternoon is the exact reason why he resigned?
Wonderful work guy.:thumbup

[Pierce Tondry]

Now, I’ve got to get back to putting that pool table together. And remember, just like life, the game’s not over until the WHITE/MAN ball drives every colored ball OFF the table. Leaving the BLACK/MAN ball as his last victim! (Sorry, I had to get one last cheap joke in. Plus, Boomerang was a pretty good movie.)

Plus, I don't care. You have about as much tact as the Iraqi Information Minister, and the two of you probably discuss how best to deride and insult things over breakfast. After your wonderful posts in this thread the amount of people who take Limbaugh seriously dwarfs the amount of people who take you seriously by thousands. If you called into any radio show and said what you had said in this thread, be the show Limbaugh's or otherwise, you'd be ridiculed after two minutes by any sane member of the listening audience.

I decide to post in the BO forum for a change of pace and this is what comes of it. 'scuse me while I go back to RPing in a fit of disgust.

[Taylor Millard]

Hell, back in 93 he was booed on Letterman. The highlight of the interview coming when Letterman called him a gas bag and got a huge laugh from the audience.

Booed and cheered. And Letterman didn't call him a gas bag.

The question was, "Do you ever wake up in the morning and just think you're full of hot air?"...meaning, 'Do you ever think no one's listening to you.'

That's a legitimate question not an insult. Rush knew this and took it as the former, not the latter.


Limbaugh isn’t backing down from his comments. Part of the reason he’s resigning is because he simply doesn’t want to have to face some of the journalists he’s accused of ‘race pity.’

In my own humble opinion, Rush is saving the face of ABC/ESPN. He knows that if he made his comments on his radio show, he'd have people boycotting his show (some people probably all ready do anyway) then it would only affect his show.

Because he made the comments on ESPN, he's affecting ESPN not just his show. There for, he's resigning so ESPN won't be affected (remember Al Sharpton said he'd have a protest in front of ABC? You don't want that at all). So Rush is taking the "higher road" imo...saving the face of the network so their ratings won't be affected.


There are plenty of things that you can call the media. Call them lazy, sensationalistic, and sloppy. But to label the majority of them as liberal is simply false.

Partially true. Newsrooms are pretty much split down the middle. Or the ones I've been in are.


Is there any major broadcast network that has as strong a liberal bias as FOX has a conservative one? Is there ANY form of media that is as overwhelming liberal as talk radio is conservative?

Ever heard of CNN?

[Jedieb]

Well I've finally had a chance to go over and read everybody's posts. A lot of people are upset because I've made fun of Limbaugh by substituting 'Fat', for 'Lim.' Ya know what? I apologize. It was satire. Yes, people often get away with comments about those being overweight when similiar comments about race or gender would cause an uproar. My repeated weight jokes at Limbaugh's expense were in part constant references to Franken's book. In fact, many of the jokes that I've made have been references to ones made by comedians about Rush for YEARS. Is Dennis Miller a hypocritical tool when he says; "It's ironic that someone with such a slow metabolism has a name like Rush." That's making fun of Rush's weight. Even though Miller has gotten more conservative in his old age, does anyone think he'd take that joke back? How many times have we laughed at comedians like Miller and Carlin when they tell public figures to 'F' themselves? In the next weeks we'll probably see a few political cartoons on this Rush incident. If one of the artists draws a portly Rush, is he being a hypocritical tool?

Part of the irony behind Franken's book is that Rush shows a total contempt for people who are different than him. For people that he perceives as being weak. Yet the man obviously has his share of vices and weaknesses. Now look at the stories about him being investigated for illegally purchasing pain killers. Do you really think the late night comedians aren't going to have a field day with this? Do you really think none of them will include jokes about Rush's weight?

In the end, I don't dislike fat people, I DISLIKE LIMBAUGH. So if you're overweight or have people you care about then I'm sorry my jokes offended you. Take away every Fatbaugh comment I made and every fat joke and what I said about Rush stands up pretty well. He got what he deserves. Good riddance.

[Jedieb]

"Do you ever just wake up in the middle of the night and just think to yourself, "I am just full of hot gas?" David Letterman '94

Yeah, I was waaaay off on that Letterman reference. :rolleyes

[Wei Wu Wei]

Well, to be honest, I agree that Limbaugh's statement was poorly worded, but he has a good point. There is a stereotype that says African-Americans are good at sports. Just like most people assume Asian kids are geniuses in school.

[Jedieb]

Yeah, those are common stereotypes. But Rush's comments weren't really about that. If he had just said that McNab was overrated and backed it up with stats or game film then he'd have a case. If he had addressed the NFL's policy regarding minority hires he could have opened up an interesting discussion. One that the guys on Countdown HAVE had on the past. But that's not what he said. He went straight to the old cliche; liberal journalists have elevated him because he's black. That's a croc. Imagine if you're a sports reporter who's been covering sports for years. You go to games, interview atheleres, pour over game film, travel with the team all over the country. You interview the guy after good and bad games. After all that time and effort you make up your mind that he's a quality QB. Then Limbaugh comes along and says the real reason behind you calling McNab an MVP candidate is not his performance, but your white guilt. That's just ridiculous. That's why so many sports writers started taking shots at him this week.

[Taylor Millard]

Originally posted by Jedieb
Yeah, I was waaaay off on that Letterman reference. :rolleyes

Thanks for the correction. It'd been 9 years since I'd seen the interview, but I did remember when it was asked.

Looks like I was only one word off of it.

I would like to point out there's a difference, imo, about Letterman saying Rush is a gas bag and Letterman asking Rush if he wakes up in the middle of the night wondering if he's "full of hot gas".

My point made earlier still stands. It was a legitimate question, not an insult.

[Ryla Relvinian]

I just think that, after reading most of these comments, it's really sad that all the ammo you can find to berate Rush Limbaugh is either based on his weight or some other petty phrases he has made to begin a discussion. There is no political discourse, no intillectual debate, and no "I see your point, but let's agree to disagree..."

The point is this: Rush said what he said because it was correct. The media was looking for a successful quarterback and he also happened to be black. Where, exactly, is the racism in that statement? It's the truth. Some people, however, simply can't stand an argument on their own without playing a race card, and that, frankly, is sad.

All this from the party of tolerance.

It's a wonderful example. Thanks for sharing, guys. :)

[Charley]

^^^

End of thread.

[Jedieb]

The point is this: Rush said what he said because it was correct. The media was looking for a successful quarterback and he also happened to be black. Where, exactly, is the racism in that statement?
Actually, it was far from correct. Again, he said a Pro-Bowl, MVP caliber, fantasy football gem, highest paid player in the league, multiple NFC East Champion QB was overrated because the media had elevated simply because of his race. I don't even like McNab, but saying that Rush's own co-workers have been praising him for years now simply because he's black is offensive on several levels. It's offensive to McNab, it's an insult to the integrity of all the sports journalists who've evaluated McNab as a successful QB. Remember, this includes the same journalists that Rush was working with. The same one he now says he's trying to help protect by resigning.

As for the racism, I've said I don't it was overtly racist, just wrong. But someone might want to tell McNab that Rush wasn't being offensive. Because he apparently took quite an offense to being told that much of the credit he's received these past few years wasn't because of his play, stats, wins, or leadership. It was just because the media was looking for black guy to prop up. McNab looked crestfallen at his press conference. And he handled himself with a hell of alot more class than Rush. I give him credit, because if they'd been aimed at me I would have gone off on a tirade that would make Jim Brown seem timid.

One more thing, it was Rush who played the race card here. His statement came totally out of the blue. No one on that set was talking about race. Rush did this all on his own.

[Jedieb]

BTW, there are rumblings that Rush's maid isn't just making statements. She have worn a wire and kept several e-mails from Rush detailing his requests for illegal meds. Who knows where this will go, but if his luck continues to slide it's going to be a field day for Limbaugh bashers. :)

[Jedieb]

http://espnradio.espn.go.com/espnradio/radio?id=1627941&rate=28&format=wmp

http://espnradio.espn.go.com/espnradio/radio?id=1628889&rate=28&format=wmp

[Jedi Master Carr]

Talk about total PC you see I saw those jokes as satire and I don't care what you think. Actually I don't make fun of his weight I make fun of him being a loudmouth idiot. He has said so many stupid statments is ridiculous. He is the worst conservate heck I don't think he represents conservatives. Do you he has said that FDR is the worst president of the 20th Century. What kind of man would say that I mean what was the alternative support the Nazis (because without Roosevelt or Churchill or Stalin the Nazis would have won IMO). I am sorry my opinion of Limbaugh will never change he is a loudmouth idiot and I happy he resigned.

[Jedieb]

a loudmouth idiot.
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH! You called him an idiot! you should be ashamed of yourself. :rolleyes

[JediBoricua]

Thanfully I don't get Limbaugh's show here, but I was seeing him on ESPN when he said that stupidity...

Really I cannot understand how can some people defend him.

End of the day, McNabb is a great quaterback, period. A man that plays a game aftre breaking a leg, and throws what, 4, 5, touchdowns is nothing short of great.

[Jedieb]

Actually, he threw those touchdowns in the same game he broke the leg! But if someone wants to say he's overated because of his race their ignoring the praise AND criticism that's been dished out to black QB's these last 10 years. Black QB's like Akili Smith and Kordell Stewert have been raked over the coals for years. These guys are now being judged on their PERFORMANCE.

[Charley]

Cordell Stewart isn't exactly a great QB. He is a jack of all trades, and master of none. And this is coming from a Steelers fan.

/derail

[Jedi Master Carr]

Yeah but each were one time said to be great QB's. Smith was touted as the second coming as I remember and now he is considered a bust. Stewart's stock has been going up and down so much its ridiculous, although now I think he has reached the bottom and won't escape that.

[Jedieb]

Cordell Stewart isn't exactly a great QB. He is a jack of all trades, and master of none. And this is coming from a Steelers fan.
Exactly my point! Stewert has been inconsistent and has disappointed the Steeler faithful for years. And sportswriters across the country have been critical of him for years. No one gave him a free pass because of the color of his skin. He got praise when he showed flashes of brilliance, but whenever he reverted to inconsistancy people would get all over him.

Look at Jake Plummer. For every person who has sung his praises you can find someone who thinks he's overrated. He's gotten 2 big time contracts now and he's got a LOSING record as a starter. After his first 2 games this season his critics had even more ammunition. Now imagine if McNab had Plummer's numbers. Rush would have held him up as proof of his theory. But does anyone here think that Plummer got these great contracts because of his race? Probably not. I say he got them from a combination of things;
Great 4th quarter comebacks
He played his college ball at Arizona so that endeared him to the fans
He obviously has one of the BEST agents in pro sports

It's Plummer's performance, both good and bad that has driven sportswriters' comments of him. NOT HIS RACE. And the same thing is true of McNab, McNair, Akili Smith, Charlie Batch, Carter, and other modern day black QB's. Sportswriters don't give these guys free passes because of their race. They praise them when they're good, and slam when they stink up the joint.

[Jedieb]

And now players and coaches around the league are starting to weigh in. I think anyone is going to be hard pressed to find a player or coach that's going to think Rush has been treated unfairly.


PHILADELPHIA -- Some NFL players were still upset Thursday at last weekend's comments about Donovan McNabb that caused conservative commentator Rush Limbaugh to resign from ESPN.


On "Sunday NFL Countdown," Limbaugh said the Philadelphia Eagles quarterback was overrated because the media wanted to see a black quarterback succeed.


"You can have your opinion, but there are certain things that are sensitive that you have to adhere to and certain lines that you don't cross," Carolina Panthers quarterback Rodney Peete said. "And I think he definitely crossed that line with that particular comment."


As one of McNabb's closest friends, Cleveland Browns wide receiver Kevin Johnson offered another view.


"He's disappointed," said Johnson, a teammate of McNabb's at Syracuse. "He has done everything right as a player. He's been a perfect role model. He has done everything that you would ask him to do as an NFL quarterback."


Limbaugh resigned from the show Wednesday night.


Rev. Jesse Jackson told The Associated Press on Thursday that Limbaugh's remarks were "a painful insult."


"It is not true and it is demeaning to the black athlete," Jackson said in a phone interview from California. "It is wrong to suggest that the hard work of black coaches and black quarterbacks are breaking in by the gratuity of the media."


In 2000 Tennessee's Steve McNair became the second black quarterback to start a Super Bowl.


He said the fans always treated him fairly and he was surprised the issue of race has resurfaced.


"Until this episode, I thought it was gone," he said. "Evidently, there will always be a small portion out there. That's just people's opinion and how people look at different things."


Dallas Cowboys coach Bill Parcells said Limbaugh's opinion doesn't "represent how the majority -- the high majority" of people involved in the game for a long time think.


"I know it doesn't represent anything near what I think," he said.


Washington Redskins coach Steve Spurrier was far from agreeing with the overrated part of Limbaugh's opinion.


"They didn't give him all that money because he's an average quarterback," Spurrier said. "He's one of the best in the league."


Many Redskins players took issue with both the premise and conclusion of Limbaugh's statement. They felt McNabb is indeed worth all the attention he gets, and they wondered what on earth race has to do with it.


"Who's Rush Limbaugh to make a statement like that?" linebacker LaVar Arrington said. "He needs to stay in his area of expertise because clearly he's out it. That's one of the most asinine comments a person can make. It shows his IQ level in football."

[Jedieb]

Today's opening segment on NFL Sunday Countdown was unlike any other in the show's history. It was a somber introduction with each of the show's hosts addressing the week's trials and tribulations. The most eloquent coming from Tom Jackson. He was obviously upset and at one point was so emotional I thought he was going to get choked up. Each analyst expressed regret for not confronting Rush and his insertion of race into a football discussion. The very people that Rush said he was trying to spare embarrasment spoke in unison and criticized his comments on last week's show.

To top this off, here's an article from ESPN's web site. It does of good job of showing just why Rush failed here and why he has himself to blame for what's happened to him.


In a Rush to make a big impact
By Ralph Wiley
Page 2 columnist


How did we come to yet another "Yikes!" moment in NFL broadcast history? Who's guilty of what here in the Strange Case of Rush Limbaugh? The usual suspects are there: pride, ego, greed, power, hubris. But where does this episode stack up between Jimmy "The Greek" Snyder's lame and obtuse history lesson and Howard Cosell's "That little monkey!" naivete.


Rush Limbaugh has made his career out of stirring up controversy.
There was Rush Limbaugh, and then there he wasn't, resigning, quitting on his stool, so to speak. I wasn't glad about it. I wanted more. I wanted to hear Rush talk more football, just so I could laugh, and say, "What's my name?" while piling up the points in front of my friends and colleagues. I didn't want Rush to quit. I wanted him to stand in there and be forced to take it for the full 12 rounds. See how bad it would get -- like when your friend keeps double-or-nothing raising against your pat straight flush.

It had seemed such an inspired move, hiring Rush in the first place, in the pure-numbers universe. Hard to move your number northward in today's cable universe -- hey, let's bring Rush Limbaugh to ESPN's "Sunday NFL Countdown" team, along with Michael Irvin. Some matchup, huh? If that don't fetch 'em, I don't know Arkansaw! Or Florida. Or talk radio.

Along with the mainstays Chris Berman, Tom Jackson, and Steve Young, Rush would ride 'em, rope 'em, and brand 'em. And after three weeks, the ratings did bump up 10 percent to a whopping 2.2 percent of the universe of 87.6 million households. Rush's last show drew a 2.4 -- not killer, but improved. But improved wasn't enough for Rushamon. He was going to take a big bite out of this apple. What you saw was ego beginning to run toward amok, not just on Rush's part either; yeah, ego is part of it, part of it everywhere and with everybody with few exceptions in this business, in my experience. Success, pure-numbers-wise, breeds ego. I'm just trying to explain it to you without prejudice. I'm not here to pile on Rush. No need. No room, anyway. I'm here to examine what he said, and in doing so examine the reaction to it.

***** ***** *****


It's a tricky thing, the peculiar anthropology known as professional sports expertise and knowledge. Espousing it is like any profession. Sure anybody can have an opinion and get it right one time in two. Or three. But it's the accumulation of knowledge, instinct, expertise, experience, gut feel, that gets you included among pro sports analysts. It's like baseball, in a way. For a game or two, or 10, a Triple-A'er can hang out with the big boys, when they are just clearing their throats, just getting in some swings, not going all out.

Anybody can pick winners on a pregame show, for a while; but that is not true professional knowledge, that is not noticing the telling nuance on the fly, bringing the little-known decisive moment or fact to life. It's what they pay people like me for. There's no other reason. It's not because they love me so much, or because they know I'll bring in a half-point's worth of ratings, and I don't believe that it's because I'm black, although you'd have to ask the media I work for. All I know for sure is, when the pro begins to apply his knowledge, in whatever occupation, then comes the separation. Just like what color you are, it's not something you look down and notice when working.

In the interest of full disclosure, let me say Rush Limbaugh e-mailed me as this pro football season started, was complimentary of some things he'd read that I'd written about the NFL on Page 2. I e-mailed back, saying I was looking forward to hearing his take on the games, and that a truck driver had once told me, 10 years ago, when I was out on tour with a non-sports book that was poorly titled "What Black People Should Do Now" -- I was going for an ironic title there, but cut it too fine, and people read it literally, and thus the book failed -- that he thought Rush and I had a lot in common (except for key fact I didn't point out to the truck driver; Rush could afford a private jet, and I couldn't). One key here. I didn't tell Rush whether the truck driver had been white or black (he was white; but the telling point is, you were curious, weren't you?), because in this case, it shouldn't matter.

If only Rush had kept on e-mailing me, then I could have told him, "Not McNabb. Wrong dude. If you want to make that point, you should say ..."

***** ***** *****


Rush was going along OK, picking winners and losers, giving opinions, just like anybody else who'd been lucky enough to be picked to be on an NFL pregame show. I ought to know. I've been there myself.


After leading the Eagles to two straight NFC title games, Donovan McNabb got off to a very slow start in 2003.
The first week, right out of the box, to prove himself, and establish his presence with authority, Rush picked a road dog, the Patriots to beat the Bills in Buffalo. The Bills won 31-0. The next week, Rush picked the Patriots to beat the Eagles in Philly. This time, New England won. So far, Rush is batting .500, (the pro analyst will bat .550 -- .750 in crunch-time -- and there's the difference) -- which is about like everybody else; hitting and missing, picking winners, giving opinions about who can play and who can't, and at which level the good player becomes mediocre. It was clear, at least to me, Rush had sources (I know he had sources in and around the league; he mentioned consulting one of them about something I had once written about life at NFL training camp, whether or not it was authentic; this source told him it was; so Rush complimented me; the key here is Rush had to ask if it was authentic. I don't have to ask whether, say, "Playmakers" is authentic).

Here's where the lightning struck.

I'm just speculating now, but maybe it occurred to Rush, or to Rush's ego, on a completely logical level, as large egos begin to see logic, that he had not yet been Rush, that he hadn't yet made an appropriate impact. Rush is a mover and a shaker of public opinion, a big-number guy, a drink-stirrer; once he really starts rolling, being Rush, the viewership bump would really spike; the way he does that is by being controversial, plucking emotional strings.

Plus, Rush had a speaking gig coming up, delivering the keynoter to a gathering of broadcasters in Philly the first week of October -- Thursday, Oct. 2, to be precise. That would be four days after Rush said, "Sorry to say this, I don't think (McNabb) has been that good from the get-go; I think what we've had here is a little social concern in the NFL. The media has been very desirous that a black quarterback do well, black coaches and quarterbacks doing well. There is a little hope invested in McNabb, and he got a lot of credit for the performance of this team that he didn't deserve. The defense carried this team."

Rush, or his sources, or both, apparently don't think that much of the skills of McNabb. On the other hand, some people do. Jon Gruden, probably the top offensive talent evaluator in the league right now, raved about McNabb from that same get-go, the Senior Bowl of McNabb's senior year out of Syracuse. Gruden raved about what a great pro McNabb would be. Loved him. McNabb has since made Pro Bowls and twice played in the NFC Championship Game and two years ago finished runner-up as the MVP of the entire league. And he isn't even 30 years old.

Even in that ill-fated NFC title game loss, he was directing an inspired drive against the Tampa Bay defense, one of the best of all-time, until he threw a pick-and-go to Bucs cornerback Ronde Barber inside the Tampa Bay 10-yard line. McNabb has the skins on the wall, but that does not absolve him from critiques of his performance, informed or not.

The discussion was about like it is with all NFL quarterbacks, on balance, so far pretty normal. But it was the insertion of McNabb's race as a factor favoring his media coverage, and as a factor in the host institution (the NFL) and its reaction and support of McNabb, was purely political. And that, not sports, is what Rush does to inflame the populace and bump his numbers. Period. That's what he does. So we can't act all surprised. Rush couldn't lay back and just be one of the boys talking ball and still be Rush. And he just had to be Rush. He had to try to turn it into an anti-affirmative action, hot-button debate about the liberal media that would inflame the part of the audience that expects such inflammation from him, and thrives on it.

Here's where the lack of football knowledge hurt Rush. His point could not be covered in a football sense, which made suspect his further speculation that the media and the league favored McNabb, and therefore all African-American quarterbacks. But, God help us, if he had chosen Kordell ...

"Sunday NFL Countdown" had suddenly become "Meet The Press." Or maybe "Triumph of the Will." Or at least of the Rush.


If Limbaugh had chosen Kordell Stewart as his example, the debate would've been more interesting.
The Eagles were coming off a bye week, after looking pretty lame, McNabb included, in home losses to Tampa Bay and New England, not coincidentally the last two Super Bowl champion defenses. The 0-2 Eagles were going to Buffalo, itself coming off a loss to the Dolphins in Miami, no doubt looking to get well. And remember, the Bills had looked good that first week. And Rush has that speaking engagement coming up in Philadelphia ... hmmmm ...

In a perfectly logical marketing move, but perfectly naive football move, Rush went on the air and basically did what Rush does. He decided to do a power move, and use McNabb to make his point, figuring McNabb would be down in flames again, and Rush would not only be hotter on ESPN, but also in Philly to, you will forgive the expression, crow about it.

It was completely logical, not what he said, but the fact that Rush Limbaugh would say it. Completely logical -- except for the football part, and the social part. What he said was, in fact, incorrect. I'm not talking about right and not right. Guys (and gals) are right and not right about football every weekend on ESPN. I myself think, for instance, Kurt Warner is overrated, but I am not going to add a theory that Warner is being propped up by the league and the St. Louis media because he is white. But would I, or anybody else, think it? Do we see ourselves and our own fates personified by who's under center? This is where Rush insinuates himself, into your less-than-better self. His point, if pressed, would be that he was talking about what's in the media's mind and hearts, which you can throw into question about basically anything.

Rush could have been content with staying with picking scores, evaluating performances, calling into question players' abilities, and helping "Sunday NFL Countdown" enjoy that ratings bump until the cows came home, and it would have been no problem. But, simply put, that wasn't enough for Rush. He had to be the bell cow. He calls into question McNabb's abilities and the intentions of the NFL and media covering it, pitting both against the white male majority, essentially, then sitting back and watching a bomb go off. He was incorrect, but people are incorrect in evaluating football players virtually all the time.

The only question is, was he correct about the "Social Concern" part?

The great thing about text, even in an audio/video sound-bite world, is that sometimes it's the only way to closely examine truth and falsehood.

Being correct has gotten a bad name, because all somebody has to do is shout "political!" in front of your correctness, and suddenly it's a bad thing.

Now if Rush had e-mailed me, I would've told him, "Rush, if you want to generalize about unspoken feelings about black quarterbacks, I'd advise against it. But, hey, you're you and you're gonna do what you're gonna do. I'd wait until I had a speaking gig in Chicago, if I were you, then you can questions Kordell Stewart's abilities until your heart's content. At least you'll be right about the football part."

Even if Rush had kept reading his Page 2 R-Dub & Road Dog NFL columns (he probably did) he would at least have been delivered of the opinion that the Eagles were lacking in areas around and other than McNabb. But Rush didn't do that. Or worse, he did, and then flew in the face of it, rendering any prior compliments to me moot. He chose to go after Donovan McNabb and make him the anti-affirmative action baby.

Wrong guy. (Whew!)


Jackie Robinson was equipped to handle any "social concern" that arose.
McNabb was the wrong guy to pick. Or, the right guy to pick, if you don't have much of an agreement with Rush's methodology.

McNabb is the right/wrong guy for the same reason Jackie Robinson was the right/wrong guy. Among the best of the young African-American NFL quarterbacks -- Steve McNair, Daunte Culpepper, Michael Vick and McNabb -- if we insist on breaking them down that way, McNabb might be the least QB-skills gifted among them, just as among Jackie Robinson, Henry Aaron, Willie Mays and Roberto Clemente, Robinson might have been the least skilled as a baseball player. But Jackie was still plenty gifted enough to be a Hall of Famer. But he was even more, and I sense the same in McNabb. The others are accomplished (McNair has been to a Super Bowl, two AFC title games; Vick has already won a playoff game at Lambeau Field, something no other opposing quarterback has accomplished, Culpepper has been in an NFC title game), but not necessarily verbal. They cannot defend themselves in the clinchés of little verbal political games nearly as well as they play football; they could not come back and spar with the likes of Rush or his quoted material being thrown in their faces for rebuttal. But it was no problem for McNabb to rebut it.

"I'm sure he's not the only one who feels that way," McNabb astutely said in a news conference, a few days after surprising some, but not the people who really know pro football, by leading the Eagles to a 23-13 victory over Buffalo, and taking some of the steam out of Rush's stride. "But it's somewhat shocking to actually hear that on national TV." (So, McNabb had identified the nerve that Rush works for a living, admitted it was there, and then expressed shock one would let one's worse self be on public display.)

"... A free ride from the media in Philadelphia? That's a good one." (McNabb exposed Rush's lack of knowledge of sports media by locale, by reminding us that in Philly he had been booed on draft day, and that Philly fans boo everyone from Mike Schmidt to Santa Claus, let along Donnie McNabb, and that the Philly press, like the New York press, only worse, treats every game outcome as if it were the pivotal battle for World War II, and if you lose; you're a bum).

***** ***** *****


Let us crush two notions with one stone. First is the notion that quarterbacks are paragons of intelligence who hang in the pocket until the last minute to deliver passes in their down time from composing sonnets and concertos and writing motivational speeches for businessmen and splitting the atom. Oh, please. Really.

Four of the five best quarterbacks ever were Johnny Unitas, John Elway, Joe Montana and Steve Young. Of the four, Unitas might have been the best football player. Definitely he would have score the lowest on the SAT. There are mushrooms that would have scored higher on the SAT. Unitas was no genius. No book genius. No verbal genius. As far as being "pocket passers," the term is used for white quarterback in media; but that is simply the classic quarterback pose if that QB is on a team good enough to consistently form an impregnable pocket around him.

You can't be a pocket passer while the defense is sending sellout blitzes at you. Then you must adapt, modify, improvise. Then you must play football.

Every great quarterback has been able to run, white or black, at one point or another, until they either got too old or too busted up to do so. This is football, people. These are not the wheelchair games. Unitas would be 40 yards downfield flying in front of his ball-carrier running a reverse, throwing cross-body blocks. Fran Tarkenton must have run 200 miles behind the line of scrimmage alone. Montana ran like the wind. Elway was a runner, as was Young. This is no new phenomenon, because black quarterbacks do it.

What is relatively new is the spiked degree of difficulty of the position, with all the exotic blitzes and speciality edge rushers and size and speed of the defenders today. Charlie Ward, Heisman Trophy quarterback of Florida State and point guard on the Seminoles basketball team, decided to play in the NBA and forsake football, the game at which he had true genius, because of the beating required to play the position. "I've seen what happens," Ward said, alluding to several Florida State quarterbacks being greviously injured in practice while he was there. The rise and proliferation of black NFL QBs since Doug Williams won the Super Bowl in 1988 has more to do with the increased degree of difficulty of the position than any "social concern."

There are only a small number of people who can actually physically and mentally -- like combat, it has more to do with fortitude and cunning than intelligence -- play quarterback in the NFL. And there are not that many. There are more Ron Jaworskis of any color than John Elways of any color, with Elway being the standard of QB play.

To me, Steve McNair is the closest thing out there to the standard that is John Elway. We do find it interesting that Jaworski always says you must run the game from the pocket. It serves his own playing style and memory, his own persona, and ego. That's exactly the feeling that Rush preyed upon. We all vicariously play through the people on the field on NFL Sundays -- reflecting our own unique frame of reference. If they look like us, are we more likely to root for them?


Peyton Manning has plenty of critics -- but is that because he's a white, pocket passer?
Is there an undercurrent of false knowledge that does discriminate against the likes of a Peyton Manning? Again, to the trained eyes, and not even to every trained eye, but certainly to mine, Peyton Manning is a great quarterback. The fact that he has not won a playoff game -- yet! -- speaks more to the quality of the team around him than to Peyton. People say, "Yeah, he could never beat Florida when he was at Tennessee." Believe me, if Peyton had played for Steve Spurrier at Florida, or at Tennessee, they would have beaten Phil Fulmer at Tennessee, or Florida. But there is an undercurrent of false hipness and currency to a media perception about Peyton Manning's supposed shortcomings. Is it based on the color of his skin? Absurd, I know, but is it? That's what Rush was preying on.

You can have a pro like Kordell Stewart or a collegian like Carlyle Holliday, who either are too mechanical (Stewart) or have little or no feel for the position in the pro style (Holliday), but who are very mobile. And you can also be not the most mobile (Manning) and have a total feel for the position. Black and white have nothing to do with it. But do not think Peyton Manning is not a tremendous athlete. His father Archie was the best athlete I had seen at the position, before Elway came along. For some reason, even the Colts' own kicker thinks he knows better, is hipper to some better way of both playing QB and coaching. Mike Vanderjagt not only knocked Peyton, he knocked his coach, Tony Dungy, who is of this black faction that Rush cut out of the mob and claimed was getting a leg up on other coaches from the league and the media.

The Colts are now undefeated, going into Tampa Bay on Monday night. Regardless of the outcome of that game, there is little question that barring the unforeseen, within the next year, and then for the next five years or so, Manning and Dungy will play for the right to go to the Super Bowl a time or two, maybe even three. Dungy is stoically building another championship-level defense, just as he built the one in Tampa Bay, this time to complement the higher offensive skills of Manning. It's not a matter of the media or the league wanting or not wanting either one of them to do well, Rush. People (media is, surprisingly, made up of people) who cover the individual teams always want them to do well, whether they pretend objectivity or not; they want to cover good teams, winning teams, they want good teams to represent them, and the players and coaches who get hired in the NFL -- getting hired being key, and this is what Rush was leaning toward, who gets hired, and is this affirmative action? -- they either get it done, or they don't. The media does have its shortcomings. Propping up undeserving minorities is not one of them. Not after they are exposed as having shortcomings, anyway.

Fascinating.

***** ***** *****


McNabb said it was shocking.

Yeah? Wait until Donnie finds out that performance has nothing to with the so-called "social concern" Rush was talking about. Whatever somebody is accusing you of doing, nine times out of 10, that's what they are guilty of doing. McNabb can't play quarterback any better than Willie Mays played the outfield. And yet there were major-league teams, who were in the business of baseball, who did not sign Mays after trying him out. Now that's a social concern. All McNabb can do, for the time being, is play, and be glad to have the opportunity to play, because it didn't have to be that way. But it will be interesting to see what McNabb does in future years, how this impacts him.

How do I know this? Sometimes ESPN.com will sponsor a chat, and invariably, with all the good sports questions that come in to me, there will be some that, how shall I say this, express "social concern." They accuse me of being racist, talk of how I and some of my occasional writing styles bring down the quality of writing for good educated people. Invariably, I will post one of those replies in the marathon chats, just to remind, not the readers, but myself, that some people can't get past color to performance, no matter what you do, no matter how well you perform. I know that I have forgotten more about composition than any of the hateful posters and their descendants will know in their lifetimes. And yet I end up defending my credibility again and again simply because of a trait I can't even see unless I look in a mirror.

That's the wrong Rush did, not to ESPN, not to the media, but to McNabb, McNair, Dungy. It's no matter, "moot" as McNabb said, that Rush can say he was simply questioning the so-called liberal media. Black coaches and quarterbacks who do not perform at the championship level in the NFL will be replaced soon enough, just as white ones will. But why foster resentment against the good black coaches and quarterbacks who perform, simply to get more attention from manipulated viewers of the very same media whose intentions you decry?

Rush's speculations were intriguing.

They were born of ego and power, and prey on suspicions and fears.

The great thing is that I can write this as well as think it.

I'm sorry Rush left so soon.

But to say "No mas" was the smart move.

It was about to get ugly.

Rush picked the wrong guy.

And I wish it was as simple as that.

Ralph Wiley has written articles for Sports Illustrated, Premiere, GQ, and National Geographic, and many national newspapers. He was one of the original NFL Insiders on NBC. His many books include "Serenity, A Boxing Memoir," "Why Black People Tend To Shout," "By Any Means Necessary: The Trials and Tribulations of the Making of Malcolm X" with Spike Lee, "Dark Witness," "Best Seat in the House" with Spike Lee, "Born to Play" with Eric Davis, and "Growing Up King" with Dexter Scott King and the children of Martin Luther King Jr. He contributes to many ESPN productions, and bats cleanup on a weekly basis for Page 2.

[Jedi Master Carr]

Great article that sums up everything for me.

[ADarksideJedi]

He is great I love listening to him he is no and I repect again not the least bit racist!HE is the only free voice in this country!Some guys just are trying to shut him up!and I hope they never do the day we lose him will be the day we can stay goodbye to freedom of speech!Anyway that is all for tonight I got to go to bed soon!Bye!JM:zzz :crack