NFL Week 12

[Figrin D'an]

Sunday, Early

San Diego at Miami
Minnesota at New England
Cleveland at New Orleans
Buffalo at NY Jets
Detroit at Chicago
Jacksonville at Dallas
Cincinnati at Pittsburgh
St. Louis at Washington
Atlanta at Carolina
Tennessee at Baltimore

Sunday, Late

Kansas City at Seattle
Oakland at Arizona
Green Bay at Tampa Bay
NY Giants at Houston

Sunday Night

Indianapolis at Denver

Monday Night

Philadelphia at San Francisco

First game kicks off at 1PM Eastern... all picks must be in by then.

Some very interesting playoff positioning games this week. San Diego/Miami and Indy/Denver should be great games. Phily/San Fran on Monday Night should give us an idea of just how much the rest of the Eagles team will be able to step up to compansate for the loss of McNabb. The winner of Green Bay/Tampa Bay will control their own destiny for home field advantage in the NFC. And, we'll see how Kurt Warner fairs retaking the helm of the Rams against a pretty good Redskins secondary.

[Taylor Millard]

Sunday, Early

San Diego WIN at Miami

Minnesota at New England WIN

Cleveland at New Orleans WIN

Buffalo at NY Jets WIN

Detroit WIN at Chicago

Jacksonville WIN at Dallas

Cincinnati at Pittsburgh WIN

St. Louis WINat Washington

Atlanta WINat Carolina

Tennessee at Baltimore WIN

Sunday, Late

Kansas City WIN at Seattle

Oakland WIN at Arizona

Green Bay at Tampa Bay WIN

NY Giants WIN at Houston

Sunday Night

Indianapolis at Denver WIN

Monday Night

Philadelphia at San Francisco WIN

[imported_Blade Ice]

I'll give this a shot it may be a little late in the game but so what.

Sunday, Early

San Diego (wins) at Miami
Minnesota at New England (wins)
Cleveland at New Orleans(wins)
Buffalo at NY Jets (wins)
Detroit at Chicago (wins)
Jacksonville (wins) at Dallas
Cincinnati at Pittsburgh (wins)
St. Louis (wins) at Washington
Atlanta (wins) at Carolina
Tennessee (wins) at Baltimore

Sunday, Late

Kansas City (wins) at Seattle
Oakland (wins) at Arizona
Green Bay at Tampa Bay (wins)
NY Giants (wins) at Houston

Sunday Night

Indianapolis at Denver (wins)

Monday Night

Philadelphia at San Francisco (wins)

[Jedieb]

WINSan Diego vs Miami
Minnesota vs New England WIN
Cleveland vs New Orleans WIN
Buffalo vs NY Jets WIN
WIN Detroit vs Chicago
WIN Jacksonville vs Dallas
Cincinnati vs Pittsburgh WIN
WIN Atlanta vs Carolina
WIN Tennessee vs Baltimore
Green Bay vs Tampa Bay WIN :crack GAME OF THE WEEK BABY! :crack

WIN Kansas City vs Seattle
WIN Oakland vs Arizona
WIN St. Louis vs Washington
WIN NY Giants vs Houston
Indianapolis vs Denver WIN


Philadelphia vs San Francisco WIN

I may switch some picks around. I'm really unsure of that SD/Miami game. Lucas has shown improvement and the Fins are at home, but will it be enough to beat a tough and well coached Chargers team?

[JMK]

Lucas has shown improvement and the Fins are at home, but will it be enough to beat a tough and well coached Chargers team?
You bet it is!!!


Sunday, Early

San Diego at Miami (W)
Minnesota at New England (W)
Cleveland at New Orleans (W)
Buffalo at NY Jets (W)
Detroit (W) at Chicago
Jacksonville (W) at Dallas
Cincinnati at Pittsburgh (W)
St. Louis (W) at Washington
Atlanta (W) at Carolina
Tennessee at Baltimore (W)

Sunday, Late

Kansas City (W) at Seattle
Oakland (W) at Arizona
Green Bay at Tampa Bay (W)
NY Giants (W) at Houston

Sunday Night

Indianapolis at Denver (W)

Monday Night

Philadelphia at San Francisco (W)

[Taylor Millard]

That Green Bay/Tampa Bay's a real tough game to call.

GB normally doesn't lose twice in a row, but they're 0-7 I think in their last trips to TB. If this was at Lambeau...GB hands down.

[Ishan Shade]

Sunday, Early

San Diego (W) at Miami
Minnesota at New England (W)
Cleveland at New Orleans (W)
Buffalo at NY Jets (W)
Detroit (W) at Chicago
Jacksonville (W) at Dallas
Cincinnati at Pittsburgh (W)
St. Louis (W) at Washington
Atlanta (W) at Carolina
Tennessee at Baltimore (W)

Sunday, Late

Kansas City (W) at Seattle
Oakland (W) at Arizona
Green Bay (W) at Tampa Bay
NY Giants (W) at Houston

Sunday Night

Indianapolis at Denver (W)

Monday Night

Philadelphia at San Francisco (W)



----
I'm calling it here and now boys...Farve will end that 0-7 streak at Tampa.

[sirdizzy]

San Diego
New England
New Orleans
NY Jets
Detroit
Jacksonville
Pittsburgh
St. Louis
Atlanta
Tennessee
Kansas City
Oakland
Green Bay
NY Giants
Denver
San Francisco

[Jedieb]

Here's some news for JMK:


DAVIE, Fla. -- Miami Dolphins receiver Cris Carter says his kidney function slipped to 20 percent when he was in the hospital earlier this month, but he's back near 100 percent and may soon get clearance to return to practice.


I still think Carter can have a HUGE impact with the Dolphins. The import thing is to get him in game shape and familiar with the offense for December and the playoffs. His quick comeback, poor Monday night game, and subsequent hospitalization really shot down my idea of his being a contributor to Miami's cause. But if he can get up to full speed by the end of the season he could be a great 3rd receiver for Fiedler to get the ball too. Anything that can help keep defenses from bunching up at the line against Williams is a plus.

[JMK]

Yeah, I heard that his kidney was down to 20% and it had to have had an effect on his first game back in some way. The Dolphins IMO have an underrated receiving core. Guys like Gadsen (replaced by Carter) McMichael (still a rookie remember) Chambers are all very talented receivers!

[Daiquiri Van-Derveld]

1. Miami

2. Patriots

3. Saints

4. Jet

5. Bears

6. Jaguars

7. Steelers

8. Rams

9. Falcons

10. Titans

11.Chiefs

12.Raiders

13. Packers

14. Giants

15. Denver

16. 49ers

(oy!)

[Lilaena De'Ville]

BLARG *brings out the blind monkey and spins it around before sending it towards the wall of games*

San Diego at Miami WIN
Minnesota at New England WIN
Cleveland at New Orleans WIN
Buffalo WIN at NY Jets
Detroit WIN at Chicago
Jacksonville at Dallas WIN
Cincinnati at Pittsburgh WIN
St. Louis WIN at Washington
Atlanta at Carolina WIN
Tennessee at Baltimore WIN

Kansas City at Seattle WIN
Oakland WIN at Arizona
Green Bay WIN at Tampa Bay
NY Giants WIN at Houston


Indianapolis at Denver WIN


Philadelphia at San Francisco WIN

[JonathanLB]

Miami
New England
New Orleans
NY Jets
Detroit
Jacksonville
Pittsburgh
St. Louis
Atlanta
Baltimore

Kansas City
Oakland
Tampa Bay
NY Giants

Denver

San Francisco

[sirdizzy]

its the prime time jinx for the sunday night game

denver is 7-0 during the day and 0-3 in primetime

indy is 6-2 during the day and 0-2 in primetime


stay tuned for more exciting news same bat channel same bat station

[jjwr]

Sunday, Early

San Dieg(W)o at Miami
Minnesota at New England(W)
Cleveland at New Orleans(W)
Buffalo at NY Jets(W)
Detroit at Chicago(W)
Jacksonville(W) at Dallas
Cincinnati at Pittsburgh(W)
St. Louis(W) at Washington
Atlanta(W) at Carolina
Tennessee(W) at Baltimore

Sunday, Late

Kansas City(W) at Seattle
Oakland(W) at Arizona
Green Bay at Tampa Bay(W)
NY Giants(W) at Houston

Sunday Night

Indianapolis at Denver(W)

Monday Night

Philadelphia at San Francisco(W)

[Sene Unty]

Sunday, Early

San Diego at Miami (W)-Lucas is going to come out an play!
Minnesota at New England(W)
Cleveland at New Orleans (W)
Buffalo(W) at NY Jets
Detroit at Chicago (W)
Jacksonville(W) at Dallas
Cincinnati at Pittsburgh(W)
St. Louis(W) at Washington
Atlanta(W) at Carolina
Tennessee (W)at Baltimore

Sunday, Late

Kansas City(W) at Seattle
Oakland(W) at Arizona
Green Bay at Tampa Bay(W)
NY Giants(W) at Houston

Sunday Night

Indianapolis at Denver(W)

Monday Night

Philadelphia at San Francisco(W)

[ReaperFett]

Miami
New England
New Orleans
NY Jets
Chicago
Dallas
Pittsburgh
Washington
Atlanta
Baltimore
Kansas City
Oakland
Green Bay
NY Giants
Denver
San Francisco

[Jedi Master Carr]

San Diego at Miami W
Minnesota at New England W
Cleveland at New Orleans W
Buffalo at NY Jets W
Detroit W at Chicago
Jacksonville W at Dallas
Cincinnati at Pittsburgh W
St. Louis W at Washington
Atlanta W at Carolina
Tennessee W at Baltimore

Sunday, Late

Kansas City W at Seattle
Oakland at Arizona W
Green Bay W at Tampa Bay
NY Giants W at Houston

Sunday Night

Indianapolis W at Denver

Monday Night

Philadelphia at San Francisco W

[imported_Ambrose Braeden]

I know they suck right now...but I just hope that the cowboys win next weekend...

[sirdizzy]

not going to happen, maybe not again this season or next

[Figrin D'an]

Dallas will win on Thanksgiving... they always win that game.

[Taylor Millard]

Originally posted by sirdizzy
not going to happen, maybe not again this season or next

I'm gonna disagree there but I'm biased being from Dallas. :p

I think they'll win the THanksgiving game and the two Washington games.

[imported_Ambrose Braeden]

i hope they do...that will make them win at least 5 games...

[Figrin D'an]

Sunday, Early

San Diego (W) at Miami
Minnesota at New England (W)
Cleveland at New Orleans (W)
Buffalo (W) at NY Jets
Detroit (W) at Chicago
Jacksonville (W) at Dallas
Cincinnati at Pittsburgh (W)
St. Louis at Washington (W)
Atlanta (W) at Carolina
Tennessee at Baltimore (W)

Sunday, Late

Kansas City (W) at Seattle
Oakland (W) at Arizona
Green Bay (W) at Tampa Bay
NY Giants (W) at Houston

Sunday Night

Indianapolis at Denver (W)

Monday Night

Philadelphia at San Francisco (W)

[imported_Ambrose Braeden]

:throws up hands:

We lost...

[Nathanial K'cansce]

Sunday, Early

San Diego
New England
New Orleans
Buffalo
Detroit
Jacksonville
Pittsburgh
St. Louis
Atlanta
Baltimore

Sunday, Late

Kansas City
Oakland
Green Bay
NY Giants

Sunday Night

Denver

Monday Night

San Francisco

[dbn]

San Diego
New England
New Orleans
Buffalo
Chicago
Dallas
Pittsburgh
Atlanta
Baltimore
Tampa Bay
Kansas City
Oakland
St. Louis
NY Giants
Denver
San Francisco


Dallas lost last year to Denver--the boys had a late rally but not good enough win.
The way my boys are playing this year -- I have a feeling they will lose again to Washington to a score of 5 to 3 .. lol!'

[sirdizzy]

of course dallas lost to denver, the league refused to let the dallas defense have tanks

[Jedi Master Carr]

A lot of wierd games today. Miami is crushing SD. Cleveland is beating New Orleans (are they falling apart) the Rams start Warner and they are currently losing. Pittsburg is losing to Cincinatti by 1 point (who thinks the winner of that division might be 8-8) man some wild games.

[jjwr]

Wow there were a ton of upsets, the Cowboys won, the Ravens won......I can see a lot of .500 records this week or worse!

[Jedi Master Carr]

I am at .500 now after Detriot loss, two of my picks though are winning at the moment, the Chiefs should win, Seattle looks awful. GB I have no clue it should be a close game.

[jjwr]

I'm also at .500, had a few of those games gone the other way I'd be looking at 3-7....ouch!

[Nathanial K'cansce]

I am 3-7 for the early games.

[Figrin D'an]

Only one person has less than 6 losses so far...

[Figrin D'an]

OMG!

Mike Vanderjagt hits a 54 yard field goal in the snow to tie the game for Indy!

[Figrin D'an]

And now a 51 yarder into the wind to win the game in OT!

[Figrin D'an]

oh boy... this was a bad week for just about everyone...


Week 12 Results (minus Philadelphia/San Francisco):

Taylor Millard: 7-8
Blade Ice: 7-8
Jedieb: 6-9
JMK: 8-7
Ishan Shade: 6-9
sirdizzy: 5-10
Lady Daiquiri: 7-8
Lilaena De'Ville: 7-8
JonathanLB: 8-7
jjwr: 7-8
Sene Unty: 7-8
ReaperFett: 10-5
Jedi Master Carr: 6-9
Figrin D'an: 6-9
Darth Snack: 5-10
dbn: 8-7


Updated season results to come after MNF.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

DAMMMMMMMIT!

*tosses that game down into the ground and kicks dirt at it*

*kick kick kick* :grumble

[Figrin D'an]

Alright... I need to vent about this...

As a lot of you probably saw, Warren Sapp took a pretty cheap shot on tackle Chad Clifton in Bucs/Packers game today. It was a legal hit, and no flag was throw, but it still makes me livid...

Before anyone says that I'm ticked solely because a Packers player got hurt, let me be clear... this has nothing to do with the uniforms that players wear. This has to do with sportsmanship and not wanting players to get severly hurt needlessly.

On the play, Favre had throw an interception, and the Bucs corner, Kelly, was bringing it back. Clifton and Sapp were outside the opposite hash marks, and neither was in a position to effect the play. Clifton was slowly jogging in the general direction of the play, but had all but stopped when he saw the play headed out of bounds on the opposite sideline. Sapp, at this point, speed up his run, slammed into the side of Clifton, and put the tackle on the ground hard. Now, because the play was still active, it is considered a legal hit. No arguement there. However, Clifton was in no position to affect the play, in anyway. After the play, Clifton lay motionless on the turf for 10 minutes, and had to be carted off on a backboard. Meanwhile, Sapp paraded around on the sidelines, grinning and laughing, like he had just won the Super Bowl.

After the game, Packers head coach, Mike Sherman, found Sapp and told Sapp point-blank that he felt it was a cheap hit on Clifton. The two exchanged obscinities, then Sapp attempted to get into Sherman's face and pick a fight with him. Later, in the lockerroom interviews, Sapp said about the confrontation with Sherman that if he "didn't have a kid and a conscience, that (he'd) have given (Sherman) an a**-whooping right there on the 30 yard line."


Football is a physical game, and players do get hurt. One never likes to see it happen, but the nature of the game is one that makes such things inevitable. My problem in this situation, is that a player was lying on the ground, motionless, had to be taken off the field on a stretcher, and the guy who hit him not only showed no concern, but laughed and jawed about it with his teammates.

Last week, Pittsburgh quarterback Tommy Maddox took a shot to his back, and lay on the field motionless for nearly 15 minutes before finally being taken off in an ambulance to the local hospital. The Titans player that hit him, linebacker Keith Bulluck, remained on the field throughout the scary scene, and was the first person to give Maddox words of encouragement as he was being taken off the field. A mark of good sportsmanship and concern for a fellow player following a potentially life-altering injury. Sapp chose to be the antithesis of that attitude in a very similar situation, and then had to further pump his ego by saying he would have punched out a coach.

I lost a lot of respect for Warren Sapp today. He's a big talker, and always has been, but he always backed up his talk with good play on the field, and seemed to respect the game and his fellow players. He didn't do that today. He let his on-the-field emotions get out of control, and another player now has to needlessly pay the price.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

I totally agree. I hope they fine him.

[JonathanLB]

Before a few of the late games, I was having a good week actually.

I still think I did pretty well. Should finish at 9-7 and that's not "good," but under the circumstances (many upsets), I'd say, eh, not bad. I've avoided having a losing week for quite some time if I remember. I'm happy about that.

Well I called the Bucs and the Ravens, those were two very tough ones and I just ended up picking the right side of the coin, hehe. As for the Lions... they are retards. My god, LOL, I swear I'm so idiotic for ever picking them. How stupid.

[ReaperFett]

I THINK I'm top :)

[Daiquiri Van-Derveld]

:Poke Fett

:mneh

[Figrin D'an]

Yeah, according to my numbers, Fett has taken the lead by one game at the moment.

I picked the Redskins to beat the Rams, but on pretty much every other "close" game, I was wrong... I wanted to pick Indy over Denver, but when I saw the weather forcast for the weekend called for snow in Denver, I couldn't bring myself to pick a dome team in those conditions... oh well. Taking Green Bay was out of sheer blind loyalty... I had a horrible feeling about that game all week. I never imagined San Diego would get beaten that badly. I thought it would at least be a hard fought game. The same thing with the Bills/Jets. Then, of course, the choke artists known as the Giants and the Jaguars reared their ugly heads again this week. The entire league is parity run rampant... I can't recall a season in which it was as tough to pick games week in and week out.

[Jedieb]

What a wretched week. I should have known better about the SD Miami game. I'm 0-4 with the fins over the last 4 weeks. Curse you Lucas!

As for Sapp, I don't think he'll be getting ANY kind of fine. Being a Bucs fan I'm probably biased. I saw the hit real time and I didn't see anything wrong with it. Sapp had no way of knowing if there was going to be some kind of cutback. He did what he was SUPPOSE to do. Defensive players are suppose to become aggressive blockers on turnovers. Look at Favre, he busted his butt to hussle down and prevent the TD. Why shouldn't Sapp have gone all out to help his teammate score a TD? As for the celebration, I think he was celebrating the turnover more than his hit. It was a big turnover, and helped put the nails in Green Bay's coffin. I don't think Sapp had ANY idea that Clifton was hurt. He was just celebrating a big play by the TB defense. Sherman's reaction was understandable. He saw one of his players go down to a serious injury and get carted off the field so he didn't appreciate any kind of celebration. Throw in the tough loss and yet another series of injuries in a long season filled with him and I can understand his reaction.

Both sides were justified in their responses. But singling out Sapp for doing what he was suppose to do is unfair.

[Jedieb]

Marty Morningweig(sp?) is an imbecile. Forget that he cost me a game, how dense do you have to be to win the coin toss and give up the ball just so you can get the wind? Then he gives the bears another down just to try to prevent a 50+ yard FG against the wind he thought was so deadly! That's one of the worst coaching decisions I've seen in years. Then we have Warner. Another shot to my week. He played well, but he continues to make mistakes that devastate his team. 2 turnovers that killed scoring opportunities. Washington did dominate that game by running the ball, but the Rams should have been able to squeak by with 6-14 points from those two possessions. Uggh, what a brutal week.

[Figrin D'an]

Originally posted by Jedieb
What a wretched week. I should have known better about the SD Miami game. I'm 0-4 with the fins over the last 4 weeks. Curse you Lucas!

As for Sapp, I don't think he'll be getting ANY kind of fine. Being a Bucs fan I'm probably biased. I saw the hit real time and I didn't see anything wrong with it. Sapp had no way of knowing if there was going to be some kind of cutback. He did what he was SUPPOSE to do. Defensive players are suppose to become aggressive blockers on turnovers. Look at Favre, he busted his butt to hussle down and prevent the TD. Why shouldn't Sapp have gone all out to help his teammate score a TD? As for the celebration, I think he was celebrating the turnover more than his hit. It was a big turnover, and helped put the nails in Green Bay's coffin. I don't think Sapp had ANY idea that Clifton was hurt. He was just celebrating a big play by the TB defense. Sherman's reaction was understandable. He saw one of his players go down to a serious injury and get carted off the field so he didn't appreciate any kind of celebration. Throw in the tough loss and yet another series of injuries in a long season filled with him and I can understand his reaction.

Both sides were justified in their responses. But singling out Sapp for doing what he was suppose to do is unfair.

I'm going to respectfully disagree, and now that I have seen the replay again, I will do so even more vehemently.

I am now going to go so far as to say that the hit was NOT legal, for two key reasons.

1) Sapp launched himself towards Clifton. His feet left the ground, and he threw his body weight into a blindside hit. The NFL, in it's rules changes 4 years ago, specifically outlawed that type of hit, using ones body as missile to slam into a defenseless player. The rule was mainly instituted to to protect receivers, but it was written as an all-encompassing change, affecting every player at every position.

2) The hit was helmet-to-helmet. Watch the replay again, and it is clear that Sapp lowered his helmet, and slammed it into Clifton's, causing his head to snap back. That, in itself, is a finable action


We're going to see if the league office has the guts to enforce these rules when it comes to all players, not just wide receivers and quarterbacks. It was not only a cheap shot, but it was clearly illegal, and Sapp should be fined and suspended. End of story

[Jedieb]

I think there's a good reason why the hit didn't receive a flag. Full speed it just didn't look that bad. You've got to keep your head on a swivel during run backs. I think Sapp was taken aback because he saw the hit as legal one. There was no flag and plenty of officials following the play. The celebrating was perfectly understandable. You're at home in a big game and your defense has just come up with a huge turnover.

Still, I haven't seen the replay, I just saw the play at real speed. If it was helmet to helmet then he'll probably get a fine. But in the heat of the game, it didn't look illegal, to me or the refs.

[Figrin D'an]

Well, that's why Gene Washington reviews the tapes from each game each week and doles out fines and suspensions. The officials don't always catch everything, and there are many instances in which a player has received a fine and/or a suspension for a play that was not flagged during a game.

Be it in the heat of the moment or not, it still is not an excuse. Players around the league have be warned about launching themselves into defenseless players and leading with their helmets. Sapp should have known better, and he's flat wrong if he thinks it was a legal hit.

[Ishan Shade]

This week was indeed a wreck, although I did feel that it was a good week of football.

[JMK]

It was a good week indeed, as my Dolphins CRUSHED the Bolts! >D Just as I said they would!

[Jedieb]

If only I'd listened... I'll pick them to win next week and they'll probably lose against the Bills 'cuz their on the road. So that would mean I'd be 0-5 with the Fins over 5 weeks. D'OH!

[Daiquiri Van-Derveld]

Its nice to have some company down in the cellar ;) Welcome aboard, boys! :D

[Jedieb]

To respectfully disagree with Figrin (because he’s been more than polite in stating his position) I have to stick with my earlier position. The dust is settling, and it looks more and more like there isn’t going to be a fine and that there SHOULDN’T be. The league looked at the hit and there will NO fine. Also, all the analysts that I've seen are saying that the hit was legal. Sean Salsbury and Ron Jaworski have said it was a perfectly legal hit. Jaworski said that that’s what happens on turnovers. Monday Night Countdown is coming up and I bet you that that crew, made up of former players, will probably see the hit as legal and part of the game.

As for the post game altercation, Sherman isn’t as innocent as I thought. I saw a replay with sound and he was actually cursing at Sapp from the get go. Why you would want to curse Warren Sapp out after a game is beyond me. I think it’s horrible that the hit resulted in a season ending injury to Clifton’s pelvis. (The numbness was not a spinal injury.) But it’s part of the game. If I were Sherman, I would have been pissed off too. Today, Sherman doesn't think there should be a fine for what happened after the game. It looks like he just wants it to go away. Bottom line, I don't think there's going to be any action by the league. But this is the kind of thing that could make a playoff game between these two teams all that much more heated.

[Figrin D'an]

Deep down, I had a feeling that the league would not fine Sapp. I still disagree with that position, despite that the league ruled not to enforce a fine and that a lot of the ESPN experts are saying that it was a legal hit. I think a very dangerous precident is being set through this. The league has been cracking down on "projectile" hits (ie. launching oneself into a defenseless player) and on helmet-to-helmet contact over the past few years. So far this season, there have been three major instances of fines/suspensions for helmet-to-helmet hits. All of those have been by defensive backs on wide receivers. The league is effectively saying that the rule is position-subjective, and that it will protect against those type of hits when they come against quarterbacks and wide receivers, but not when it is against the rest of the players on the field. That is, frankly, disturbing.

Sherman didn't handle the situation all that well, but I do give him credit for one thing... he stood up for one of his players that couldn't stand up for himself. He had the guts to tell Warren Sapp, to his face, that it was a cheap shot and that he celebrated unnecessarily. That will resonate with his team, and I expect Green Bay players to want to play that much harder now for Sherman.


I'm not going to drag this out further, because it's all but a moot point now. But, I'm standing by my statement... I think the league made the wrong call, and I think that the experts are flat wrong when they say that it was a legal hit. I think the rule is being unfairly interpretted and biased towards a particular subset of NFL players. Call me crazy, call me a zealous fan upset because someone on my team got badly hurt, but I'm drawing the line on this matter, and taking a definitive stand, unlike some of the media pundits.

[Jedieb]

Okay, you're a "crazy," "zealous fan upset because someone on my team got badly hurt, but I'm drawing the line on this matter, and taking a definitive stand, unlike some of the media pundits." Just kidding. :D

I've seen the replay a few times, and it still doesn't seem like the helmet to helmet hit you're describing. The injury was to Clifton's midsection, not his head. I also didn't see Sapp launch himself. He went after Clifton and laid him out. His hit was no more vicious than that devasting block Ray Lewis laid on a Denver defender earlier this season on Monday night. Those ESPN "experts" were mostly former players that have all been in the same situation. They have all been in similiar situations on both sides of the ball. I bet Tom Jackson has some fond memories of taking people out on INT returns. Jawarski talked about keeping his head on a swivel whenever he threw one of his 150+ INT's. People play with abandon on INT's. Look at what Favre did on one of those picks. He ran full tilt and saved a TD by making a great tackle. He didn't do that by being cautious. It's a vicious game to begin with. Anytime that someone of Sapp's build gets a running start and nails someone who doesn't see him coming there's a chance that player is going to get hurt. These guys are just too big and fast to think that who can enforce rules that are going to protect everyone.

I'd say that 90% of the people outside of GB and their fans don't see anything wrong with the hit. Take Figrin and me out of the equation because we root for each team and most NFL and football fans probably think the hit was legit. You can't make a rule that tells players they can't hit someone on INT returns because they aren't looking at him. They might as well start playing touch.

Meanwhile, they Eagles have just scored a TD and taken a 7-0 lead. WTF?

[JMK]

Are we surprised given what's happened this week????? :x

[Jedieb]

Make that 14-0 thanks to Brian Mitchell. That guy has been a quiet star for years. He's a special team monster. The Niners are starting to move the ball now. Let's see what the Philly D does with the unexpected lead it's offense and special teams have given it.

[Figrin D'an]

Originally posted by Jedieb
Okay, you're a "crazy," "zealous fan upset because someone on my team got badly hurt, but I'm drawing the line on this matter, and taking a definitive stand, unlike some of the media pundits." Just kidding. :D


Gee... thanks. ;)


I honestly think its more split on the "cheapness" of the hit... I've seen articles on some newspaper websites saying that the hit was uncalled for. Some do say the hit was legit, but it seems to be rather split.

Anyway... I saw what I saw... I saw a projectile hit and leading with the helmet. I know other people saw it differently. I still think it's a very troubling call by the league office. Last season, Gerrard Warren made a very similar hit on Mark Brunnel, a blindside, launching hit after an interception. He was fined and suspended. But, I guess because Brunnel is a quarterback, he falls into a category protected by this position-subjective rule interpretation. I see a lack of consistency, especially when the league has specifically changed rules in recent years to crack down on those kinds of hits.

Essentially, I would have no issue with the hit itself if Sapp had remained planted on the ground and made a shoulder pad hit. Playing agressively and physically is one matter. Laying out a player with a malicious hit is another..

Like you said, though, the matter is all but closed. If the two teams meet again in the playoffs, I expect there to be some cheap shots taken by both sides. I don't condone such attempted retribution, but it probably will happen in one way or another.

And now the Eagles go up 21-7... good grief, where is Jon's blind monkey when I need it... it would have been a better strategy this week.

[Jedieb]

Holy crap! 21-7! Detmer is playing like a friggin' stud! There's no way SF was expecting this kind of effort from the Eagles. Crazy league. The one team you would have thought would have suffered the most by losing the QB and they beat up one of the conferences better teams on their home field. They've still got a whole half, but I don't think SF wants to try to play catch up late in the 4th against that Philly D.

[JMK]

The NFL is one wacky league. It seems we may as well just flip a coin to see who wins!

[Jedieb]

Cats and dogs living together, mass hysteria!!!

You know what team I'm starting to like more and more? Atlanta. Think of the recent Superbowl runs by the Pats and the Ravens. They turned it on in the middle and late portions of the season. They rode their hot streaks all the way to the Superbowl. Who's to say Atlanta couldn't do the same? That defense is a lot better than people think. Nobody wants to try to defense Vick in a playoff game. They've beat some pretty good teams. At 7-3-1 they're in perfect position for a wild card, especially since they're in the NFC. If SF goes on to lose tonight they may even have an outside shot at the division. Here come the Falcons...

[Jedieb]

28-10
The Eagles are now officially handing the Niners their testicles. Did anyone pick them tonight? The Bucs have got to be loving this. And the aforementioned Falcons are now only going to be 2 games out if the Niners can't find a way to come back.

[Jedi Master Carr]

Problem is Atlanta isn't in the division with the Falcons :p they are in with Tampa so I am not sure there. I am disapointed with my Chiefs, we should have beaten the crap out of the Seahawks, instead our defesne returned to our previous state and gave up too many points. Of course it didn't help that somebody decided not to give the ball to Holmes at the end of the first half we would have won if they had because Green Threw and INT and Seattle went down and scored a TD that was a 14 point swing. I have no clue what to expect from them the way they are going they will be 8-8 they seem to win every other week. I am still hoping for 9-7 which would at least be a three game improvement from last year maybe we can get better defensively next season I can only hope.

[Figrin D'an]

San Francisco looks completely overmatched in this game. They had one good drive, but beyond that, they've been totally outplayed on both sides of the ball. This is the exclamation point to a very messed up weekend in the NFL.

[JMK]

And a week filled with freakish injuries. Now Philly's second string QB is carted off the field. If the Niners are going to come back it had better be right now, but it looks unlikely with the Eagles in the red zone again......and touchdown.

And so another team that looked like a contender will drop to 7-4 and now have identical records to Miami, Indy, Denver, Oakland and San Diego. The only teams with great records left are TB, GB and evidently, Philly.

[Jedieb]

I'm still trapped in last year's divisions! They're probably not going to catch Tampa, but that tie with Pitt gives them a better win percentage than the Saints. Plus, they swept the Saints so they've got them beat for a playoff spot. Right now the Eagles would actually jump ahead of GB for the #2 seed in the NFC because of tie breakers. Tough week for GB all around.

Detmer has gone out with a dislocated elbow but the Eagle offense just keeps on rolling with Feely throwing a TD pass. Now the Niners have struck back with another Owens TD, but at 35-17 it may be too little too late.

[Figrin D'an]

Yeah... Tampa Bay at 9-2, Green Bay and Philadelphia at 8-3, and then a slew of teams at 7-4... the stretch run is going to be crazy...

BTW... that scene after Detmer went down was one of the best demonstrations of sportsmanship I've seen in quite a while. Having not only all of his teammates, but a lot of the 49ers players meeting him on the field, patting him on the back for a very impressive game... that shows a lot of class amongst the 49ers organization.

[Figrin D'an]

Week 12 Results:

Taylor Millard: 7-9
Blade Ice: 7-9
Jedieb: 6-10
JMK: 8-8
Ishan Shade: 6-10
sirdizzy: 5-11
Lady Daiquiri: 7-9
Lilaena De'Ville: 7-9
JonathanLB: 8-8
jjwr: 7-9
Sene Unty: 7-9
ReaperFett: 10-6
Jedi Master Carr: 6-10
Figrin D'an: 6-10
Darth Snack: 5-11
dbn: 8-8


Updated Season Totals:

ReaperFett: 108-68
Jedieb: 107-69
jjwr: 106-70
Jedi Master Carr: 106-70
Sene Unty: 105-71
sirdizzy: 105-71
JMK: 104-72
Darth Snack: 99-77
dbn: 97-79
Figrin D'an: 97-79
JonathanLB: 96-80
Lady Daiquiri: 77-71
Lilaena De'Ville: 76-54
Taylor Millard: 62-56
Ishan Shade: 18-12
Blade Ice: 7-9



Ugh... the Brit is in the lead... what's going on around here?!

;)

[Jedieb]

We BOTH crashed and burned with 6-10 weeks, that's what happened. Well, 6-10 and still only a game out, I should consider myself lucky. Rough week for just about everybody, except the evil Brit. His time will come...

[Sene Unty]

Evil brit with his knowledge of American football! DAMN HIM! :D

Stupid 49ers! I shouldn't have picked them to win that game! Who would have thought that Detmer would be able to come in and win that game?!?!?!

[JMK]

No one saw that coming Sene, last week that is. After Sunday's games & upsets had wrapped up, then maybe few people could have seen it, but only on chance and not by logic!

[Jedi Master Carr]

It seems us Americans know nothing about football or our own box office something really weird is going on :p Also since there are two games on Thursday shouldn't we put the contest up early? Unless we don't count those two games.

[Sene Unty]

Yeah I was thinking the same thing Carr. I think we should count those, but only for Americans!:D

But seriously we should do them.....god knows we all need them!

[Jedieb]

I think we should have the next contest up by the end of the day to give people a chance to get their Turkey Day guesses in as early as possible.

[ReaperFett]

It's good to be king ;)

[Lilaena De'Ville]

:) I don't even know where I stand percentage-wise. :) Thats ok. I'm not winning. :( Shame on SF :cry

[imported_Blade Ice]

*plots to take out ReaperFett *

Dam colts I hate them.

[Daiquiri Van-Derveld]

I say we bump Fett off and divy up his wins. Who's with me? >D