Wow, Citizen Kane is great

[JonathanLB]

Ok, pretty obviously Citizen Kane is great I guess, but I just bought it on DVD the other day, didn't bother renting it, I just figured I should own it as part of my collection.

I am glad I did buy it, though. It's a masterpiece. I wouldn't put it on my all time favorite film list necessarily, but I still thought it was a great movie and I see how it could be ranked right up there.

The cinematography, lighting, and script seemed most notable to me. Of course the acting was good and everything was good, but those three aspects most struck me as just "wow!"

It's pretty bad I hadn't seen this movie earlier, but what the heck, you aren't born having seen all of the world's influential movies, so you have to do your best to see them over time. This movie warrants a very full review and in depth discussion, though, so I will be spending some time on it.

The problem I had in getting through the AFI's Top 100 list was that I had originally thought, back when I was off school in April, "Well I can see 3 movies per day, so I should finish that thing in like 35 days I guess technically, somewhere around there, maybe 40 or 45 if I take a few days off here and there." But the problem was you get these really long movies like Ben-Hur, then they have a really long documentary, and you are up to 5 hours or 6 hours on a single movie and its DVD, then you write your review. Plus, naturally all of these AFI films deserve a few paragraphs about why they are influential or important to American cinema, not just simple reviews about whether they are good or not because most of them it is pretty obvious they are great, but it's your job as a film critic / buff / historian to describe how they shaped/changed film or why they are so important in history. So for that reason, I've found my progress while watching AFI movies is a bit poor, but I'd rather do a great job than a quick job.

Citizen Kane is definitely a great one, though. I was also noticing how it didn't win Best Picture either, some movie I've never in my life heard of did instead, and that just reminds me of how many times history proves the Oscars entirely wrong. Annie Hall did not survive as 1977's defining film; Star Wars did. That's not up for debate whatsoever. Nor is Citizen Kane's status as 1941's most influential film. Now of course people are free to debate the merits of any given movie and declare that Annie Hall is better (hehe, yeah... right), but historically speaking there is a right and a wrong and true and a false. One movie often clearly emerges the victor as time renders its own verdicts, which always prove more important than a decision made only 3 months after the end of the year.

Blade Runner, for instance, was not seen as a great movie in its time (1982), but that's because it simply was too far ahead. Ok it didn't help either that the narrated version was not something most people liked and the director's cut is, I understand, much better (although I've never gotten ahold of the original version -- I'd like to). Nonetheless, it was both a critical and a commercial dude. Yet it is today considered one of the greatest sci-fi movies of all time (and I put it in there too as one of my all-time favorite movies).

[CMJ]

I *told* you it was great Jonathan. :D

It's one of my all-time favorites...definitley in my top 10 or so.

[JonathanLB]

What makes a movie like that especially great is the ability to discuss the actual film in detail and interpret various aspects of it.

For instance, most people think discussing a movie is like this: "Yeah I liked it, it was good. I thought it was funny and it had some cool lines." "Hmm, well I really didn't like it because I thought the directing was pretty poor and the few bits of humor couldn't save it."

That's not real discussion. Real discussion is like, "Well I think that Kane's abrupt separation with his mother basically ruined his development and even with all of the money in the world, all he could give is possessions, not love, because he had none to give."

I just think it's great when you can really discuss the message of a movie and what the director was trying to accomplish, rather than many of my reviews where I really have nothing to say except what I thought of the movie's quality. I spend two paragraphs just talking about what was good and what was not good, so it's the rare movie indeed that allows me to spend a few extra paragraphs just analyzing the plot and messages.

[Jedieb]

CK is one of the best movies I've ever seen and a favorite DVD of mine. The commentary by Ebert is excellent. The Bogdonavich commentary isn't as good, but it's more personal. Bogdonavich and Wells were close friends and you learn much more about Wells himself during that commentary. That's a movie I could watch repeatedly and not get tired of.

I've always felt rather sad for the character of Kane. To have spent his entire life trying to buy love and acceptance but to end up alone in Xanadu the way he did. Surrounded by crates of things that ended up meaning nothing. The most valuable one being probably the cheapest (and one of the most famous props in movie history.) There are so many great scenes, lines, and performances that you could discuss the film for hours. It's a great movie to watch with movie fans.

I think I'll watch it again soon. It's been a couple of months and I'm kind of in the mood now.

[Jedi Master Carr]

I have seen the movie once, I probably should check it on DVD, its not one of my favorites but it is a very good movie. Lets do a little trivia, who is the real life historical figure that the character of Kane is based on?

[JonathanLB]

Well you gotta make it harder than that.

William Randolph Hearst, the great media mogul himself. :)

[CMJ]

My favorite touch in "Kane" is when Charles, Bernstein, and Leeland are looking at the Chronicle's picture of newspaper men...and although I don't know the dialogue word for ord it goes something like this....

*********
"The Chronicle is a great paper, look at that circulation."

"The Chronicle is a good idea for a newspaper."

"It's no wonder their circulation is so high look at who they have writing for them. You'll never hire those guys away."

"I wonder."

The we transition to the same newsmen.....

"Seven years ago I saw a picture of the greatest newsmen in the world. I was like a kid in a candy store. Now years later, I got my candy...all of it."

Photograph taken.

"Print an extra and send it to the Chronicle."

*************

I think that is maybe the best transition I've ever seen in a film.....

[JonathanLB]

I have yet to check out the other DVD material yet, but I need to do that today actually.

I'm trying to catch up on my movie review site today, I have a few reviews left to write, ugg ok like 7 or 8, and then I have to read over about 50 and edit them all, then post them, and hopefully I can get a few DVDs reviewed that I was meaning to do and get my Citizen Kane review finished.

[Jedi Master Carr]

Wow, I didn't think it was that easy :) Also I would use the word great with Hearst the man was a dispictiable person, he ruined people, he caused wars (the whole thing with Cuba was his doing, partly), he was a racist, an anti-semite, and he supported the Nazis during WW II. I think how Wells treated him his funny especially the whole Rosebud thing, but I will not go there ;)

[JonathanLB]

No I didn't say he was a great man, I said he was a great media mogul. Great as in powerful, larger-than-life, huge, significant, etc. Not morally great or whatever.

[CMJ]

I know what Rosebud is in reference too. :D

Welles was an evil man. ;)

[Jedi Master Carr]

Well I took great the wrong way there, no biggie, also as you can tell I am no fan of Hearst. Not sure if you know but he almost canned Kane, he gathered up all the Movie heads and tried to blackmail them from getting the picture released, well Wells still got it released but that could have been one of the reasons why it was not named best picture. Also I could be mistaken didn't Wizard of Oz and Gone with the Wind come out that same year, or am I getting my dates mixed up?

[Jedi Master Carr]

LOL CMJ, I think Welles was a genius there, it such a slap in the face to Hearst and of course only he, and his mistress, would understand it.

[CMJ]

Actually the story behind Kane's release is almost good enough for a "real" movie(was made ino an HBO one a few years back). I saw a hell of a documentary on it last year.

And Carr, your dates are off. "How Green Was My Valley" won the Oscar in '41. GWTW and "Oz" are '39 films.

[Jedi Master Carr]

Ok I wasn't sure what year it was released. And I have seen that movie on HBO it is great look at the movie and what happened behind the scenes.

[Jedieb]

While Hurst is the most famous person associated with Kane, he wasn't the SOLE inspiration. The character of Kane is actually an amalgom of several figures, even Wells himself! Remember the scene in which Kane is working at the paper and eating dinner? There's a line of dialogue that refers to Kane's appetite. That was about Wells. The building of the Opera house did not refer to Hears but another man who built a famous Chicago theater for similiar reasons. Then there's the character of Hurst's mistress. for years Wells actually regretted her connection to Marion Davies (sp?). Kane's mistress is portrayed as a clueless ditz with little talent. Hurst's real mistress, Davies, was a talented comedic actress who had a solid career before she met Hurst. She was loyal to him for years and even sold some of her assests when Hurst later had financial problems. The two never married because Hurst's wife would never go for it. Davies wasn't even able to attend Hurst's funeral.

Now as for trivia, does anybody know what the rumor is the REAL LIFE "Rosebud" referred to?

[CMJ]

I could post dialogue from Kane all day....

*************

"You know, Mr. Bernstein, if I hadn't been very rich, I might have been a really great man."

"Don't you think you are?"

"I think I did pretty well under the circumstances."

"What would you like to have been?"

"Everything you hate."

[CMJ]

Eb, Carr and I know....;)

[Jedieb]

That's such a great line CMJ. I missed the spot earlier in the thread where you said you knew what Rosebud may have really reffered to. That was just vicious of Wells wasn't it? Serves Hurst right.

Remember Bernstein's soliloqy about the young girl? And the confrontration between Hurst and Jebodiah after the election? There's just one great scene after another in that movie.

[CMJ]

Now you're taling Jedieb...

**********

"A fellow will remember a lot of things you wouldn't think he'd remember. You take me. One day, back in 1896, I was crossing over to Jersey on the ferry, and as we pulled out, there was another ferry pulling in, and on it there was a girl waiting to get off. A white dress she had on. She was carrying a white parasol. I only saw her for one second. She didn't see me at all, but I'll bet a month hasn't gone by since that I haven't thought of that girl."

************

Sine I first saw that film when I was 14 or so, I bet a month hasn't gone by where I haven't thought about the power of that line....

[Jedieb]

How do you feel about the character of Kane? I actually feel sorry for him. One of the most moving and tragic aspects of his life didn't even happen on screen but it still helped define the character to me. The death of his wife and son. Graned, it didn't look like his son was going to be a perfect gem;
"Is Dad Governor yet?"
but it does set the stage for Wells to die without any real family to comfort him. I think Wells killed off Kane's family to leave the character totally alone and befret of family or friends at the end of his life. That's another departure from Hurst who we all know had an extended family. Like his precious little gem Patty!:rolleyes

[CMJ]

I *think* you meant Kane Eb, right? :) Actually funny enough it was Orson that ended up alone at the end...

I definitely felt sorry for him. I mean he wasn't exactly a *good* man, but dammitt if I didn't see good in the guy. He just didn't know how to express it is all. The only time we really see him happy as a grown up is with his wife(in the beginning of the brilliant breakfast montage sequence), so I think you'r right about killing off his wife.

A very sad character....an incredible film.

[JonathanLB]

Well I am glad I started this thread. At first I didn't know if anyone would respond, but it's a great film and there is plenty to discuss.

CMJ, you just mentioned a few of my favorite quotes in the movie, although there a lot. It's a very quotable film. The screenplay is amazing, all very well written and carefully selected dialogue.

[Jedieb]

Yeah, I meant Kane, I fixed that a minute ago.

I don't know how alone Wells ended up. I've never read a bio, but he was working right up until the end of his life. He was a tragic figure in that the struggle with Hurst affected him for the rest of his career. He had plenty of friends and colleagues who admired him. But he never really returned to the power and influence that he had before the battle with Hurst. Bogdonavich had a great Wells' quote. About his own death Wells' said; "They're going to love me when I'm dead aren't they?" He had to scrimp and haggle to get movies made the decades after Kane. Remember the voice overs for that board game, Dark Tower or something like that? He did the voice of Magnum P.I. Robin Master several times, and was working on the Transformers movie right before he died. He did anything he could to raise money to make more films. He had nowhere to go but down after making his masterpiece at what, 25?

The proclamation, remember the look on Wells face when he opens the letter with the destroyed check and proclamation?

[CMJ]

"Old age. It's the only disease, Mr. Thompson, that you don't look forward to being cured of."

Oh yeah...AWESOME line!

Eb I think you mean when Leeland mails the Declaration of priciple's back to Kane, right? Great stuff. :)

Wells did work up till his death, but Kane ruined his ability to make a film without Studio's breathing down his neck. He *did* make some great stuff later, but I wonder how much he could have done with his freedom.

He had some "friends" to speak of...but alot of his "friends" didn't exactly like him...they more respected him then felt feelings.

[Jedieb]

The Magnificent Ambersons was his next film, and by most acconts it's an excellent movie. I've got Touch of Evil on DVD and it's pretty good also. I want to see TMA one day, but I've just never come across it on cable or a video store when I've been in a Wells's mood.

Yeah, when Leeland sends him back the proclamation Kane knows a part of his life is over. Firing Leeland and writing the negative review was Kane's ego trying to prove to Leeland that he was the "great" man that his proclamation spoke of. The torn check and the returned proclamation was Leeland's way of topping him by showing him what REAL character was.

I feel for the character of Kane because in some ways I think he was still the small boy trying to win the love of his mother. She doomed him the day she sent him away. He was on his way to the wherehouse to get his Mom's stuff (presumably Rosebud) the night he met his mistress. Man, one bad break after another.

[CMJ]

I think "Touch of Evil" is great! I mean one you get over the Heston thing. ;)

I saw the first half of "Ambersons" on Turner Classics about a year ago and loved it, but I had to leave. I've wanted to see it ever since.

[Jedieb]

The Heston thing is indicative of the day and age. Even today you see Hispanic parts being played by non-Hispanics (The Specialist), but back in those days it was rampant. Still, Heston is a great actor and he pulled it off.

[Jedi Master Carr]

Yeah Wells struggled for years he even did that Nostradamus movie to make money, and I think he played a villain in one of the Muppet Movies.

[JonathanLB]

I thought you guys really should check this out if you didn't already...

http://www.filmsite.org/citi.html

I don't usually give props to other film sites so much, but my god that site is insanely great. It wouldn't be that impressive to me, except that it is all done by ONE person!

I hope someday I have a site that is that great, but for now I will just stand amazed at it :)

You can find so many great, classic films reviewed on that site, but not just reviewed, actually analyzed. It's a great asset to the Internet and a great resource for finding information on classic old films.

Although everyone hails IMDB.com as such a great site, and it is, almost certainly the best movie site online, it doesn't eat up every bit of useful information. In fact, that site lacks a lot, or specifically it lacks anything but objectivity, so if you want to find actual analysis of a movie, you are best looking elsewhere. Filmsite.org is the best Website I have found for information on old films...

Although, I'm happy to say that my own movie site is having pretty pleasing results to my surprise. Without updates in about 7 weeks now, it has steadily increased traffic, for whatever reason, from in the 150 per day range (visitors) to 200+ almost every day now. I had a string of 8 straight 200+ visitor days, then barely dropped below two weekend days, but the last two days, I've seen a 250 and a 230, so I'm pretty happy that at least people seem to be checking it out.

I have 49 written reviews to add to the site here, hopefully tomorrow, and I have 8 more to write, again hopefully tomorrow (mostly). That is about 75 pages worth of writing, or in the typical format that books use, 100+ pages of reviews. That is all just done in the last 7 weeks too.

But the site should be undergoing a lot more significant additions than that here pretty soon. Especially next term, when I will be taking four day weekends each week (putting all of my classes on Tuesday-Thursday) so I can have time to finish up another book (and get college credit for it), and of course, review lots of movies. My goal currently is 10 movies/reviews per week. This week I will fall well short because I'm catching up, but the worst I do in a week is about 5, so... not horrible. I can always catch up on other opportunities also. I am excited about growing my site over the next, well, many years, but especially in the next year it will undergo some very sizeable additions. I'm closing in on 300 reviews already, which is pretty good. For me, the huge milestone is 1,000. I'd like to cross it in 12-16 months.

[JonathanLB]

I want someone to explain to me what I missed about "A Streetcar Named Desire."

I have watched it twice now, so I really don't think it could be from a lack of attention or anything like that, but the film just SUCKS compared to everything else on the AFI list. Not only that, but I've seen like 70 better movies this year alone. The critically maligned Formula 51 kept me more engaged, slightly, than A Streetcar Named Desire, which has, both times, nearly put me to sleep. It is boring, dull, there aren't any real plot twists, it lacks any innovative plot, doesn't have a clear message or theme, it's just trash. One of the most overrated films I have ever seen in my life. I can find redeeming qualities of other AFI films I didn't much care for, such as Close Encounters of the Third Kind (one of Spielberg's worst films I think), E.T. (ugg again to Spielberg), and 2001, all of which still earn 2.5 stars anyway, but I don't know what to say about Streetcar.

The acting is supposed to be so great? My god, Brando is good, I'll say that, but Vivian Leigh is grating and bordering on poor. I cannot stand her stupid way of talking, her idiotic dialogue, annoying character, nothing about her performance made me think any good thoughts at all. YES is YES, not "yaaaaaaaaays." You don't drag it out like that, it's just, "YES." THREE letters. Not 100. I wanted to shoot my monitor every time she attempted to pronounce such an easy word.

Oh boy, characters get mad at each other, Vivian tells another lie, nothing of any real value happens, blah blah, can I sleep yet?

Every OTHER classic has some VALUE to cinema, while this film just plain blows chunks. I'll still probably give it 2 stars, but I'm talking about how good it is supposed to be compared to how good it actually is. The AFI list is so great, why must it be tainted with nonsense like that. I could hardly stand sitting through two hours of that soap opera.

I also rewatched The Graduate and High Noon today, both of which I also hadn't reviewed despite seeing, but I'm a fair critic, so I try not to review a film I saw so long ago without re-watching it so I can make specific commentary. Anyway, though, I watched High Noon probably 10 times as a kid. It was one of my favorite movies and I've seen it like 10 to 15 times now anyway. I love it, great Western, one of the best ever. Deserves its place more than Shane, which I also really enjoyed but it's overrated and Ebert is ENTIRELY wrong in saying that Shane has aged better than High Noon. He must be an idiot, or he just didn't understand High Noon, because the theme of that movie will never age. It was just as relevant 5,000 years ago as it is today, and will always be just as relevant to humans. Shane, on the other hand, is simply a very good Western. It doesn't have a great deal to say to anyone besides that. Not the type of masterpiece High Noon is.

Of course I very much enjoy The Graduate, it's another classic, I'm just ticked that A Streetcar Named Desire is such a poor AFI film because I hate giving any movie on that list below 3.5 stars, but I give any film only what it deserves, I really don't care what it means to anyone else or what its historical value is, if the movie is no good, it's no good, and nobody can change that. No movie has ever been good or bad based on anything but what is actually in the film itself. You can't say a movie is actually great because of its importance, but the movie itself, well, sucks. It just doesn't work that way. Especially in 1951, when I am damn well sure they knew how to make great films because I've seen plenty of great movies from decades earlier, and if the best this director could manage is Streetcar, then dang.

I hope On the Waterfront, his other AFI film, is a lot better. Otherwise, that'd be a shame.

[Dutchy]

Everybody knows it, but few have actually seen it. The classic, the masterpiece and the best movie of all time. According to the critics, anyway. I really wanted to see it (just like I wanna see many other classics too), but I kinda couldn't. It was never released here on video. That is, with subtitles. It was available as an import video in some videostores, but I didn't wanna see it without subtitles. A year ago or so it was playing in the theater in a sort of classic rerun cycle. I went to see it two times, coz you rarely get a chance like this.

The movie starts with some spooky images and eerie music. It tells the story of Charles Foster Kane, a very rich newspaper executive, and is told in flashbacks. Directed, written, produced and acted by 26 (!) year-old Orson Welles. Yes, just 26. Amazing. I was very impressed how they managed to make him look like several ages (ranging from 25 to in his 70s). Welles' acting was excellent. Very convincing performance. Dorothy Comingore, who played his second wife, was a whole different story. Mediocre performance and unpleasant to watch. I didn't like her much.

After I saw it for the first time I read about it on the Net, like I always do. Among other things I read Roger Ebert's Viewer's Companion to 'Citizen Kane' (http://www.suntimes.com/ebert/greatmovies/kcomp.html) and I thought it was very interesting. Citizen Kane is especially famous for its technical achievements. It used several techniques for the first time which meant a great development of cinema. Things we nowadays don't notice anymore. In Ebert's article many of those things are explained. I advice anyone who's gonna see the movie to read that article in advance. It was nice to indeed find some of those things in the movie. Optical illusions for instance. Deep focus is where all thing visible are in focus. Things can look closer or smaller than they in fact are. When Kane walks to a window it appears to be much bigger and higher when he comes closer.

Citizen Kane. The big classic movie. How did I like it? I thought Welles did an excellent acting job. Beside that there's some great music and it's definitely beautifully filmed at times. There are some great achievements in cinematography. Even though we're used to quite a lot these days, you can still see its genius. The story was okay and it had a good structure. It's not a masterpiece in my opinion, but I didn't expect it to be either. The very best thing of watching Citizen Kane was the sheer fact that I finally saw it. Quite a thrilling experience I must admit. You'll find out that even Citizen Kane is a movie that simply starts and ends. I could tell this was a special movie, but now seeing it, it was just good. But, really cool I finally saw it. That's for sure.

[Jedieb]

I thought Comingore was outstanding. That entire cast was great. Most of them came from Wells' radio troop and many were making their film debuts. As for the character of Comingore, she was very convincing as a ditzy, unsophisticated, per WWII gal. The diction, her delivery, pretty typical of female performances of that era. Ebert's DVD commentary goes into great length about many of the technical aspects of the film. As for as Ck literature, I've heard the best book on the film is Paulene Kale's Raising Kane. I've tried to find it at my local library before but they no longer have a copy of it. I'm going to pick it up one of these days.

[CMJ]

I, like Jedieb, found the entire cast to be excellent. There's not very much that I didn't find great about that movie.

[Mu Satach]

You all are making me feel very un-knowlegeable. ;)

So many movies... so little time.

[JonathanLB]

Hehe, Mu that is always the problem.

I cannot find enough time to see all of the movies I must see here, not in the next year, but over the next four years I should be able to make it through them all. Still, it takes such a great effort now just to see all of these important films...

[Mu Satach]

I keep meaning to sit down and watch it, but every time it's on cable I always come in on the middle or something else is going on and I don't have time to sit down and watch the whole thing.

And I refuse to watch Kane in segments like that. I swear, I've seen the middle to end of Cat on a Hot Tin Roof so many times it drives me insane that I haven't seen the begining. But I love the ending. Elizabeth Taylor, Paul Newman... and some wicked mad cool lines in that thing. >=) *sighs*

Another one that's on my list to see is "All About Eve."

[CMJ]

Actually, I've managed to miss "All About Eve" too Mu.....:(

[Jedieb]

Betty Davis was just phenomenal. Coincidently, Mankewitz (sp?) wrote the screenplays for both CK and AAE. Talented bastard. :cool

[JonathanLB]

I need to see All About Eve too.

I admit that one of my major goals over the next four years, as totally insane as this may sound, is to see every film that has ever been NOMINATED for an Academy Award. I think that would give me an amazingly complete knowledge of film, and probably I'll be "well on my way" just after finishing the AFI's first two lists, the top 100 greatest movies and the top 100 comedies. That'll put a large dent in the remaining work.

Somehow I want to find a way to see all of the best foreign films too, but I'm not quite sure because I've found some great lists like, "Top 100 best sci-fi!" "Top 100 action movies!" "Best Westerns ever made!" but no "Best foreign films ever" lists. I'll figure it out somehow.

I just don't want it to be Amelie type nonsense, I hate that movie. I hope it is truly great stuff like Jean de Florette, or even its sequel, those types of movies are really good... Or, for instance, I just ordered TWO Akira Kurosawa DVD collections that I'll get for x-mas, but I had my mom order them. Hidden Fortress, Seven Samurai, and 5 other movies I think. Looks great, I can't wait to see them.

Eventually, adding to my study of film here through my reviewing, I want to pick a list of directors and see basically every film they ever made. Sometimes, I may not be able to get access to them all (Hitchcock has a few very hard to get titles), but I mean, as long as I can see 80 to 90% and all of their significant movies, then I'll be happy.

[Mu Satach]

Oooooooooooooo... Hitchcock... there's a director I'd like to see next to all of his work. When I was a little a little independant tv station would show reruns of his television show. That was as much freaky fun as the Twilight Zone and Outer Limits.

btw, regarding your quest to watch foriegn films...
If you're going to be watching any Felini flicks you should probably be aware that some of his movies are based on old Greek and Roman plays that we only have fragments of... so you might want to do a bit of research on what the film is based upon and a bit of roman and greek civ studies couldn't hurt either before you watch them, other wise you be sitting there going "wtf was that all about?"

I've studied Roman and Greek civ a bit and have read some of the plays his films are based upon... and I still sit there and scratch my head.

[JonathanLB]

Yes, good advice. A lot of movies really need brief explanations BEFORE watching them. Unless you want to be really complete about it -- watch the movie, read about it, then watch it again. I don't have time to rewatch each major movie I see, though, it would just not be effective.

Well I'm still working on my Citizen Kane review. It's onto four pages already (single spacing of course) because the darn DVD has so many great extra features, it has made the review quite long. I've not even really started the "writing" of my REVIEW of the film. I just have a page of notes and the other 2+ pages (onto the fourth) are just comments about the DVD and its features, plus comments about the film mentioned on the DVD.

I'll probably manage to get to around 7 to 8 pages by the time I finish my Citizen Kane review, maybe 10. A film this acclaimed is a special case and deserves a longer review than I'd normally give...

[JonathanLB]

I told CMJ I would post this and mentioned it to him earlier, but finally, at long last, here it is:

http://www.jlbmovies.com/CitizenKane.shtml

My review of Citizen Kane. It's about 16 pages long, 6,600+ words. It took about 20 hours in all, including watching the documentary feature, seeing the movie, editing it, writing it, posting it, etc.

It's my best review so far though.

[imported_Grev Drasen]

Although I have never seen Citizen Kane in full, I do know the meaning behind 'rosebud' and the reason for Hearst despising it so much.

After reading this thread, I think I'll go out and pick it up just to see what I am missing out on. I saw the HBO film about its creation, but didn't care much for it. Guess that is because I never actually saw all of the film.

And nice job on the review whoever it was that wrote it... I'm only halfway finished with it but so far it's seemed well written.

[Marcus Telcontar]

Well said it before - Citizen Kane is a great movie, maybe the best - but it bores me badly.Not my type of film at all..

And explain somethign to somone that aint that steep in CK knowledge - Rosebud referred to a real life person??? Explain???

[Turcyn Rorke]

'Rosebud' was supposedly William Randolph Hearst's code name for his wife's genitals. In the movie it was an object symbolizing lost youth and innocence.

[Marcus Telcontar]

Code name for his wife's genitals??????

:x

[JonathanLB]

What Solev said.

Primarily, it is just a symbol for his lost youth and innocence as I mention in the review, but supposedly it is also, ahem, the other part of what Solev said. That is still mostly rumor, but a well known rumor nonetheless.