More military RPs?

[Darth Viscera]

Please do not move this conversation to the Fleet RP forum. It is intended to gather interest for military RPs in general, and is aimed at more than just the people who frequent Omega Outpost.

(Convo has been edited to exclude the irrelevant)
Session Start (AIM - DarthViscera:TK sama): Wed Jun 12 11:07:52 2002
[11:09:21 06/12/2002 Wednesday] Darth Viscera: hey var, how are you? i haven't seen you at swfans.net in a while
[11:10:27 06/12/2002 Wednesday] TK sama: I'm doing fine. Just haven't had anything outside TSE to work on at SWFans.net currently.
[11:11:04 06/12/2002 Wednesday] Darth Viscera: ah, okay. i'm trying to figure out a way to revive military RPs there.
[11:11:23 06/12/2002 Wednesday] Darth Viscera: we're way overdue for an influx of new members in that department
[11:13:04 06/12/2002 Wednesday] TK sama: Let alone in any department after Ep II
[11:16:18 06/12/2002 Wednesday] Darth Viscera: maybe a violent attack by the Vong or some other foe could get rid of all major powers, set the stage for something that isn't reminiscent of a festering corpse?
[11:16:57 06/12/2002 Wednesday] TK sama: *Shrug* Or the Jedi can get off their lazy asses and reappear or not send childish little apprentices
[11:17:08 06/12/2002 Wednesday] Darth Viscera: truth
[11:17:51 06/12/2002 Wednesday] TK sama: I swear, their motto's "Live long, and lay back"
[11:18:27 06/12/2002 Wednesday] Darth Viscera: truth, unfortunately.
[11:18:42 06/12/2002 Wednesday] Darth Viscera: jedi are supposed to be aggressive
[11:19:00 06/12/2002 Wednesday] TK sama: Well, not really. But more aggressive than this!
[11:19:24 06/12/2002 Wednesday] Darth Viscera: agreed
[11:30:57 06/12/2002 Wednesday] Darth Viscera: anyways
[11:31:17 06/12/2002 Wednesday] Darth Viscera: do you agree that many smaller groups would lead to more action?
[11:31:34 06/12/2002 Wednesday] TK sama: As long as they've got competant leaders, yeah.
[11:31:35 06/12/2002 Wednesday] Darth Viscera: as opposed to a few giant groups
[11:31:47 06/12/2002 Wednesday] TK sama: heh.
[11:31:47 06/12/2002 Wednesday] Darth Viscera: alright, then let's build on that.
[11:32:00 06/12/2002 Wednesday] TK sama: Even a few raiders led by newbies would be kind of nice.
[11:32:43 06/12/2002 Wednesday] Darth Viscera: i could kill off DV and let the empire crumble. we could put a few people at the head of Republic ultra-militant groups.
[11:35:54 06/12/2002 Wednesday] Darth Viscera: can i have your permission to list most of this convo at swfans OOC?
[11:36:10 06/12/2002 Wednesday] TK sama: Go right ahead.
[11:36:12 06/12/2002 Wednesday] Darth Viscera: danke



It's a given that military RPs at swfans.net are dead. But let's not dwell too much on that, instead we should find a way to fix it.

The problem, as I see it, is the existence of uber-military powers. If we could scrap such groups and instead focus on new, much smaller groups, I think we could get some more activity. Each group could have one experienced RPer at its head, and say, 5 n00bs. Each group would be more on the level of, say, an Imperial warlord and his/her forces rather than what exists currently. So maybe 2 planets and two dozen ships would be an encouraged level for each new group to attain. (no bean counting, of course, I'm just trying to give you a visual aid to emphasize small)

We could, in effect, wipe the slate clean and make way for new opportunities. Everyone could be given a chance to engage in military RPs, and I feel this would better the community.

[Garrett Blade]

I heartily agree!

Whatever happened to the good old reconnaisance mission with a slight scrap between two people looking on the same planet? They never existed! That's what! Because everyone knows everything about everywhere and has ships left right and centre of the entire galaxy. Why not have us start with a single outpost - SMALLER than a base - on a planet, and start from there!

[ReaperFett]

TK sama: *Shrug* Or the Jedi can get off their lazy asses and reappear or not send childish little apprentices
Jeez, where'd you dig this one up Vis? :|





Althought not fully following the idea you have, and there may be a number of flaws that would need dealing with, it does sound a very interesting prospect
BTW, good to see you got permission and posted it:)

[Lord Gue]

What am I chopped liver? Ive called myself an Imperial Warlord for a while now, and you know I hire newbies faster than I can use a wet nap....

[TheHolo.Net]

*Shrug* Or the Jedi can get off their lazy asses and reappear or not send childish little apprentices This attitude is getting tired and worn. Its not really as true as those who preach it seem to try and make it out to be, but the fact that it keeps being said isn't doing any good in helping their cause. Complaining and whinning usually won't take one nearly as far as straight up communication and discussion will.

[Lord Gue]

I believe discussion and straight up communication lead to inactivity as well. Then Again Im one of the lucky few to be activly participating in a thread with an active jedi

[Darth Viscera]

Jeez, where'd you dig this one up Vis?

This one? That's Varlon.

@Gue
Yeah, that's so, but you're always running away. Not fun, but rather tedious. Since all groups would be basically equal in the strength that we suggest for this endeavor, there would be no need to run.

[Lord Gue]

Ok Visc, give me 500 or so odd ships and then Ill give you 2 and see how you handle it

But I get what your saying and Im behind it, better than that screwy clean slate junk....

[Darth Viscera]

Back to the subject at hand, please.

[TheHolo.Net]

I see it like this; The people who believe that to be true are too busy trying to force others to RP by their own terms and not working on a compromise. You try to force someone into something and yes, they will naturally resist, especially if its done in such a negative light.

[Marcus Telcontar]

*Shrug* Or the Jedi can get off their lazy asses and reappear or not send childish little apprentices


An attitude like that is one good reason why Jedi dont bother. Simply put, the Jedi are more than about if you bother to open your eyes and look, they simply are are doing what they want to do and roleeplaying for their own amusement and pleasure. What, you want Jedi to come out and play? Well how about.... talking to them and arranging it. The Jedi are berthed downstairs theres days, wont take much to go to Arcan IV forum and ask, would it?


No Jedi are going to do somethign because you want them at your beck and call. Maybe you should convince the you want to do something that they would like to join in. I would add that the Jedi are not interested in who rules games either.

[Lord Gue]

A friend of mine, who is a jedi, and was once part of GJO, and subsequantly quit for this reason, said herself that the jedi were much too busy sitting on there hands, and she hated the inactivty of it all

[Darth Viscera]

I should have edited out that anti-Jedi statement-it's distracting people from the small group idea, which should be the basis of attention in this thread.

[Marcus Telcontar]

A friend of mine, who is a jedi, and was once part of GJO, and subsequantly quit for this reason, said herself that the jedi were much too busy sitting on there hands, and she hated the inactivty of it all


Then that's her fault. No one is there to make activity for you, you GO out and make it for you.

[ReaperFett]

Any more comments in here NOT involving the proposal get deleted.

[Loki Ahmrah]

Back onto the topic at hand. I applaud this idea and think it will make fleet and military roleplaying far more accessable. On top of that, it will be so much more fun starting out small and developing. More satisfaction is gained that way. The more small groupos we have, the greater the chance is of engaging in small skirmishes etc. more frequently.

Let's get off the Jedi discussion here please. Two misinterpretations so far in this thread:

<LI>The Jedi Order is not a fleet group. For example, the clone army was for the New Republic, not the Jedi. Want fleet/military action, go to the New Republic, not the Jedi.

<LI>Let's not just get sucked into the fleet roleplaying concept. This is military on the whole. What about ground-based groups, lets also highlight that, make it as accessable as possible to accomodate for all roleplayer's tastes.

[Garrett Blade]

There's people in this thread who moan for things getting off topic, and they're the ones off topic!

Anyways - back ON topic.

If anybody's played strategy games such as Command and Conquer or even Age of Empires (in some cases StarCraft anf WarCraft), the most exciting thing about it (in my opinion) is the extremely small and limited forces you start the game with, which you use strategically and tactically in order to expand and explore, build and conquer. That whole process seems to happen far too fast here and the excitement of it is lost. If it were to be reset and slowed down, it would make for some very interesting and involving, not to mention fun, roleplays for absolutely everyone, not just the big groups.

[TheHolo.Net]

These comments pertain to the contents of the initial post, and are acceptable.

[Marcus Telcontar]

Small military groups are a good idea and sound interesting. As long as the resources they were allowed to handle were limited, that would be a real fine idea

[Loki Ahmrah]

Another thing that would be interested on the subject of resources is that we could establish which natural resources occur on the two planets each small group is in control of, not quantity or anything, just the type of resources available.

Then if one group wanted to begin producing something using materials they don't have, then trade routes would have to be established with one of the small groups that do posess said natural resource. That way the handling of resources could be carried out with limitations, fairness and fun. :)

[Darth Viscera]

Yes, I concur completely. It would be encouraged that the groups stay a certain size (as I indicated earlier) to keep things good for all groups involved. That way no stifling occurs.

[Marcus Telcontar]

Might even be a suggestion to make certain systems "free roleplay zones". If your intent on this idea, then Coruscant would be a good one to throw open to be like Tattooine - no group is allowed to hold it.

Worth thinking about

[Sanis Prent]

(Points to the confederacy)

What do you think I've been trying to do???

[Lord Gue]

Liver I tell ya sanis, Liver.....

This all looks very interesting, but may I interject that instead of Coruscant being free roleplay ground, it could stand as just a meeting grounds for all the groups ya know the senate and what not, since it doesnt hold that many great resources anywho...

[ReaperFett]

some planets would definately need to be free for all if we did this. It'd be unfair if all the good planets dissapeared

[Lord Gue]

Theres uncounted numbers of planets in the galaxy, heck theres even some fan fic planets yall could use if ya got bored, I mean its not hard to make stuff up instead of going after free reign planets

[Darth Viscera]

yeah, I concur. A few planets would be put aside as neutral.

[Loki Ahmrah]

Thing is Sanis, with the Confederacy. The groups were already established, having characteristics and whatnot. Personally, I would rather start my own small group that I can design myself, than have something handed over to me. Plus the Trade Federation is hardly what I'd call small.

I think having two planets for such small groups would be far too much. I don't even think the groups should own or have control of a planet first, but rather have a base or outpost on a planet and work from there.

[Sanis Prent]

Well in a sense, the Trade Federation isn't the same animal that it was at the time of the clone wars. Its more like a post-Versailles, Weimar Germany. Its slowly crawling out of the giant smoking crater it got planted in, but still keeps the kind of greedy aspiration that it had from days long gone.

[Loki Ahmrah]

On a side not, I think that if the superpowers are being set aside then I suggest we agree that either the Empire or the New Republic now have control of Coruscant and is the ruling body. This ruling body would be non-playable of course, but just so that there is some degree of control to the galaxy. Either that or make up a new governing body, something neutral that cannot be controlled or affected by any roleplayers.

[Marcus Telcontar]

:: Starts thinking about the NRSF once again ::

Seems to fit in rather well actually.

Oh, if there isa NPC government, I'd suggest New Republic.

[Sanis Prent]

Not to mention, there are a plethora of relatively unknown small groups within the confederacy that are able to be explored. So if you don't want to "fit a mold", you can still go your own way, to a large degree.

[Darth Viscera]

So we agree that the basic idea is workable, then?

[Loki Ahmrah]

I would agree with Marcus, the New Republic would be the better of the two non-playable governing bodies. Don't need the dictatorship ruling of the Empire on top of worrying about all other small groups. New Republic would be a more sane group to choose for this, plus like Gue suggested would allow for the smaller groups to debate in the senate.

And if that's the case, Sanis, once these exams are through, I'll gladly start a small group to join the Confederacy.

[TheHolo.Net]

This makes me wonder if I should open the base Confederacy forum up for posting, instead of just being a category….

[Darth Viscera]

yes, definitely the NR. Less stifling that way. Would the Confederacy groups be weapons producers?

[Lord Gue]

Im all up for new small groups and that, NR good idea

[Sanis Prent]

Confederacy groups could be practically anything they want to be...from weapons producers to corporations that use immigrant labor to make sneakers. As long as they're capitalistic on the robber-baron scale, they are good. They don't even have to agree all the time, thats what makes it fun is to disagree at times.

[ReaperFett]

Can I make an idea about the planets?


You have to have a reason for picking your first planets. Firstoff, it means that you dont get something like a heroic disiplined group controlling the criminal haven of Ryloth. Second, in a similar vein, it would mean that new groups would be able to attain apt planets.

[Lord Gue]

yeah, and what about storyline planets like Bastion, whos location was supposed to be hidden if I remember. Little things need to be taken into account maybe

[Marcus Telcontar]

You have to have a reason for picking your first planets

Does "we already are there count?"

No, serious question. If a group already has a number of planets, then are they goign to have to do away with them all and start again?

The Jedi have Yavin system, which is an appropriate place, plus Arcan IV. NRSF is Arcan IV and halfway through Xa Fel - when we get around to picking that RP up again. I would think the fact a fair bot of work has gone into getting what the NRSF has - and it will fit in with the proposal with minimal changes - would say that where they are is acceptible.

[Sumor Rayial]

I'm interested in this also. However another problem that I see is the 5 player for a group thing for fleets.

We don't have the players interested in fleets to have five players per group the way things were, and would be even more pressed if we were to go to many small groups. I would suggest groups having to have somewhere between 1 and 3 members if not any number and then their allowance about how many forces they have be proportionate to their number of members.

ex:
1 member=small pirate group or small militia force
2 members= large pirate group or larger garrison force
etc etc

It would increase to a point where you would need like 20-30 members to get something along the lines of TGE now.

[Sanis Prent]

I agree with Sums on group size relating to general power, and stated similarly in the clean slate discussion.

Keep in mind that I said GENERAL power...as in, a loose idea. Not to be adhered to strictly, etc

[Lord Gue]

wow, thats a great Idea sums, I concur whole heartedly

[Loki Ahmrah]

Agreed.

[Taylor Millard]

Okay...fr people who are just joining this discussion. Can I get someone to give me a brief recap. What's Vis talking about? What's going on? Small military groups? This is not the idea that was proposed earlier about breaking up the Empire is it?

Someone 'splain...please??

[Lord Gue]

way I understand it is we breaking up the military groups as they exist now and reform into a bunch of smaller groups that might hold one or two planets/baeses/forts whathaveyou. There assests would be determined by the amount of members they have. Umm, thats all I can think of, and if im wrong someone please correct me

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Taylor are you really too lazy to read this whole thread?! *I* did!

So, you're saying, Visc dies off..and the whole of TGE is thrown into disarray. :D My Character, Serena Laran, could become a sort of "Admiral Daala" character...randomly going around with a tiny group of ships (See the Bakura thread I HAVE YET TO POST TOO NOOOO I'M SO BAD! *ahem* Sorry about the mess.) and basically bashing the heck out of the NR?

Cool! I wanna!

[ReaperFett]

Does "we already are there count?"
Well, that's up to the people making the rules, but I'd say so

[Loki Ahmrah]

I'd say not at all. Why shouldn't the be allowed to keep their current planets, the Jedi Order is not a fleet group and should be unaffected. Besides it's not like Yavin, Xa Fel and Arcan IV will severely stifle the choices of the other groups. Remember the NR and Empire as playable groups would get scrapped if this goes ahead and their planets would be available again. Except Coruscant which would go to the NR.

TBH and TSE would likewise be unaffected. As for TSO, who still have a reasonable fleet and quite a few planets. I don't know, I don't knoiw why we don't just drop the fleet bit and focus on the Sith roleplaying. Naturally we would have to drop all our planets bar Corellia.

[ReaperFett]

Unless you splintered ;)

[Arlenia Tavira]

New character installed and ready :)

[ReaperFett]

I would suggest groups having to have somewhere between 1 and 3 members if not any number and then their allowance about how many forces they have be proportionate to their number of members.

ex:
1 member=small pirate group or small militia force
2 members= large pirate group or larger garrison force
etc etc
I do like the idea that just one person could still partake.

[Taylor Millard]

Originally posted by Lilaena De'Ville
Taylor are you really too lazy to read this whole thread?! *I* did!


So did I, but I didnt' understand what was being asked and suggested. Jeez Warren, gimme some credit here.

Now are we talking splinter groups here? C'mon, I hate that idea. I like being a part of TGE and TBH. I like TGE being a bigger group. Does that mean I like them controlling almost everything? Heavens to Betsy NO! I'm more of a fan of the smaller, fighting for control of the galaxy Empire.

If we're talking doing something like that, then I'm for it. But no breaking up and destroying everything. And, let's think about this guys, HOW would we implement this? We can't just say, "Okay, we're breaking this up, or that up." There's got to be a process to it and/or a story to it.

I've got an idea for TGE to be broken up, but I don't play the type of character who would lead a rebellion, and the person who does who Millard would follow does not RP at this time. Can it be done? Sure, but it'd take a lot of discussion and planning of it. And there's gotta be a process and discussions IMHO.

[Kelt Simoson]

Thats exsactly why the BWE/Order of the first group is in sleep statis right now...its up and going but noone has the time except me and my brother to run with it and you have to have more than 5 to run the place...for instance there are only me, my brother and possibly 2 others that can run it, a few others tried to join such as Charley but he ran out of time..thats why decent groups dont establish anymore more, to many people required to run it and even start it.

*Sieken*

[Arlenia Tavira]

Well if DV has to die, I want it to be in a confrontation with Anbira.

[Manfred]

New character up and runing

[Taylor Millard]

OKay before we go out and create never characters and everything. Can we decide what we're going to do first? Please?

'Cause I'd like to know. :huh

[Adm Garm Bel Iblis]

Waitaminute!!

I ignored this thread because no matter how you dress it up, it's still more fleet crap. As much as I love military storytelling and would participate in more if I had time for them ... I can't allow how I spend my time on here to be dictated by a handful of people. The bigger problem beyond the fact that they are poorly run is that I'd rather be allowed to choose who I RP with instead of having sometihng forced on me.

But now I'm hearing about the end of the NR and Empire as SWFans entities again!? And there people are talking about the death of their characters?

Huh??

It's starting to sound like whatever you guys are "deciding" in here is going to impact the board at large ... the very reason why most of us shun military RP in the first place. What's going on in here?

[Lord Gue]

wow, and litteracy hits a new low
Just jokin fellas dont jump on me, just read whats been said already...

[Taylor Millard]

If you make a recap post...Maybe we'll under stand it through all the bull-DO-NOT-SWEAR--DO-NOT-SWEAR--DO-NOT-SWEAR--DO-NOT-SWEAR-. Please. I'd love to know what the heck is going on.

[Adm Garm Bel Iblis]

This thread is way to monsterous and complex to sift through at this point. And it's apparantly also confusing as I'm not the only one I see asking "What's going on?"

I didn't care what you guys were talking about, but if it's going to infringe on the overall setting of SWFans and impact the RP of me and my friends ... now I care.

It boils down to this: If you guys want to run your military gaming in a sub-universe of SWFans, be pirates and warlords and mercenaries and whatnot ... Feel free. I can't imagine anyone would stop you. Just don't impose your group structures on the setting that the rest of us play in. Leave the NR and the Empire alone. And don't expect anyone to kill off their characters over it.

And if I misunderstood this rumor, please explain just what -is- the plan. I suggest that after 3 pages of back-and-forth, it's time to summarize what's been proposed and agreed on up to this point.

[ReaperFett]

nothings agreed upon, but a proposal sumamry would be nice

[Lord Gue]

just a note, when you say to leave the NR and Empire alone...
Seeing how the Diktat of the EMpire proposed this....

[Ryu Warusa]

wooo! Ok, I'm not touching this thread with a planet-long stick.

[Lord Gue]

could you actually heft a planet long stick?

[Adm Garm Bel Iblis]

That's my point ... VISCERA (or anyone else honestly) does not have the right to push his idea of how the SWFans Galaxy should be run on the rest of us. He's not the Empire. I can say with some conviction that his way of thinking doens't even represent everyone in TGE for that matter.

If he wants to make a new character who is an independent warlord to carry on these little wars ... or even if he wants to take a portion of the Imperial Navy to have skirmishes with these other smaller forces ... No problem. It's most defiintely a better direction for military-minded writers in general.

But don't rob the board at large from being able to play their characters as being in the Empire because they don't follow his gameplan.

Do your thing ... leave those who don't want to participate in HIS kind of "military RP" out of it. As long as it does not impose on others, do what you want however you want it.

[Lord Gue]

What if the Empire and NR became NPC run, so as you might be able to still rp as part of them, just with no major power...

[Adm Garm Bel Iblis]

Well I'll avoid whatever your defintion of "real power" is.

But if we can still write in that we have military forces under our command without being scolded for not being part of some phantom roster in the Omega Outpost ... I'd be okay with it.

And if those little groups don't run around planet gobbling so we have to keep double-checking the various ownership rosters before we can choose a setting ... sure.

[Lord Gue]

But if we can still write in that we have military forces under our command without being scolded for not being part of some phantom roster in the Omega Outpost ... I'd be okay with it.

That in itself entails a problem, as the porpouse of the small groups, as I understand it, is to give fleet rp a chance, and if The Empire is runing around with all its might and power that kind of kills off the small group idea IMO


And if those little groups don't run around planet gobbling so we have to keep double-checking the various ownership rosters before we can choose a setting ... sure.

I wouldnt see that happening at first, but over time thats what It might delve into...

[Sumor Rayial]

If I may suggest...

This is Viscera's idea. He knows what he's trying to say and the rest of us seem to be trying to fill in our own blanks before he replies. Let's stop making assumptions about what Vis is thinking about and let him give a larger summary of what he's thinking.

Then if we don't agree with a part we can comment and suggest changes if we wish.

[Lord Gue]

lol, good idea, I think ive been saying everything for a while now

[Saarrreeaa Meorrrei]

*sends them to their corners*

Visc has a valid IDEA, and I think its great of him to even think about proposing that TGE dissolves into splinter groups. I mean, hey, he could just DO it, it IS his group after all. But he's asking opinions about the idea first.

Garm, don't jump down throats if you don't have the decency to actually read the thread.

[Arlenia Tavira]

Garm, I would advise you to warm up some tea. Obviously your blood vessels are on the verge of bursting. Chill. Taylor, the same.

If the people at TGE, who have worked so hard to develop themselves since August 29, 2000, have to take one more for the team, then so be it. Clearly we're mature enough RPers to make that sacrifice to benefit the community.

With Vis out the picture (perhaps dead), the Empire would in a matter of minutes, perhaps mere seconds, dissolve into independant warlords each fighting for their own fiefdom. Coruscant, no longer supplied by more than 60 other planets, would soon become incapable of supporting 130+ million stormtroopers. It is at this point that individual warlords will flourish. The Rebels could rush in, clear the cloaked minefields, take out the Golans, sabotage the shields, and conquer Coruscant, which at this point would be running low on food.

Each warlord and their group would be very limited in their control of planets as per the common sense rule. Obviously we couldn't have a warlord going off and taking 5-15 planets, or we'd be right back where we started again. More like 2 max.

The conclave (which I believe has something like ~700 ships) would have to do something similar to get it to acceptable warlord levels, again regulated by the common sense rule.

And this is where the fun begins. Countless warlords seeded throughout the galaxy, all trained at Carida, means no stalemate and uber competition, of which RPers can partake. Carefree, casual military conflicts.

[Saarrreeaa Meorrrei]

I, personally, like the idea.

[Manfred]

What happens to the fleets of the dead empire and other small things of the such

[Arlenia Tavira]

Spread throughout warlord groups, regulated by the common sense rule.

[Manfred]

but wouldnt that requre enough warlords to cover all planets of the former empire, enough to be able to supply the fleet with the resources needed to keep it runing at least....

[Arlenia Tavira]

basically. most could be NPC, we'd just RP that they exist when we have to, ignore them the rest of the time.

[Serena Laran]

*eyes the ex-Imperial icily*

Pirate, eh?

I'm still leaning towards the Daala-ishness of my character...would be awesome to just pop out of hyperspace and blow the heck out of something. :D

[Manfred]

Well, im ready for this, seems like a very good idea and I give Kudos to the people that thought it up

[Arlenia Tavira]

*returns Serena's gaze, and winks at her*

Yes, pirate. What, you've never heard of the Invids?

[Loki Ahmrah]

I can't allow how I spend my time on here to be dictated by a handful of people.

Hence the reason this is open for discussion. You openly admitted to ignoring it earlier, the discussion hasn't come to a conclusion so don't start crying dictatorship, please.


The bigger problem beyond the fact that they are poorly run is that I'd rather be allowed to choose who I RP with instead of having sometihng forced on me.

That doesn't happen anymore. Fleet Roleplaying is much better for it, for further information, I suggest reading this (http://www.swforums.net/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=12952&perpage=20&pagenumber=1).


It's starting to sound like whatever you guys are "deciding" in here is going to impact the board at large ... the very reason why most of us shun military RP in the first place. What's going on in here?

Please be productive in your comments, rather than just criticize what is trying to be done, make suggestions. What would you like to see?


Leave the NR and the Empire alone. And don't expect anyone to kill off their characters over it.

No one is expecting anyone to kill of their characters. The Emppire and NR aren't being killed off, just that they're having their strength reduced. They don't have the members to be the superpowers they should be. The New Republic will overall be a non-playable group as a whole. people who play or want to play New Republic are free to do so but unless there are a lot more of you than their are currently, don't expect to be in command of enormous fleets and titanic ships. Same goes for the Empire.

However, the non-playable New Republic will be the ruling power in the SWFans Galaxy if all goes ahead as opposed to the Empire because the characteristics of the Empire wouldn't enable democracy. So be in command of a small band of ships, but unless you can amass the numbers don't expect to be the next Thrawn or Tarkin - play fair - it's not about power, it's about fun.

[Morgan Evanar]

I'm sort of warming up to this concept. Since the NR will be generally exibiting a non-agressive stance on planet gathering, this sets up a very interesting way to have properly sized skirmishes between ships.

I'd seriously consider some sort of participation in fleet roleplay.

Visc, I know that TGE would deffinately loose a few worlds to the NR: I'd like to know which those would most likely be.

[Sanis Prent]

Not a bad idea at all :)

[Arlenia Tavira]

Morg, everything that's not nailed down. The planets/systems that would appear to be nailed down are probably the major ones: Bespin, Coruscant, Carida, Agamar, Tierfon, Delteon, Thyferra, Balmorra, Yaga Minor, Kamaar, Circarpous, Obroa-Skai, Wayland, Duros, Phaeda. You have to factor in warlords wanting to set up their own little fiefdoms comprised of planets they used to own, etc. Planets that are nailed down would probably become Imperial fortress worlds, like what Carida turned into in the EU. Basically, the moats are filled, the drawbridge is up, and the water has been pissed in.

[Sanis Prent]

Though Coruscant would be some kind of neutral world thing....right?

[Arlenia Tavira]

Yep, as soon as it runs out of its 3 month supply of food. Shouldn't take too long.

[Taylor Millard]

I'm sorry, the idea was presented bad to me. You know, I don't mind the idea of smaller groups...it's Millard becoming a Warlord I don't like. And I'd prefer to not make him a politician of some sort either.

But here is my question. With Vis disappearing and assumed dead, aren't there enough people in TGE to assume command? People like Khendon, Fena, Charley whatever that second Imperial character of yours is...in the line of succession at TGE?

I'm glad there will be more fleet RPing out there, and I like the idea of a smaller Empire (I'm for the idea of a smaller Empire). ACtually now that I think about it...I can get Tomar back under Millard's command. :lol

*Stares at Laran.

Well looks like you got your third dimension now. :) Congrats. ANd will you be sticking around or nay?

[Arlenia Tavira]

Yes, but they would all be ineffectual, because Palpatine isn't running the empire through them, he's running the empire through vis.

[Taylor Millard]

Oh-kay...

I admit, I'm a little concerned with this. Am I being a bit concerned with my character? Sure. I like Millard, and I really would prefer to not create a new character or have to modify him too much to where I don't know who he is.

Maybe I'm too old school in regards to this, but what's going to prevent characters from deciding they don't want to RP this- and what's going to happen to their ranks?

[ReaperFett]

Yep, as soon as it runs out of its 3 month supply of food. Shouldn't take too long.
3 months? :)

[Arlenia Tavira]

3 IC months is substantially less IRL time.

[Taylor Millard]

Okay...here's my main question, and yes it's been answered but I just want to be completely sure about this.

TGE will be gone right? Back to all the warlords fighting each other for control of the Imperial Fleet. Or will there be an Empire, but no designated leader?

[Arlenia Tavira]

gone. Back to all the warlords fighting each other for control of the Imperial Fleet.

[Taylor Millard]

*Bites lip

Why do I hear the Unknown Regions call me again.

[Arlenia Tavira]

What, you wanta live forever?

[Taylor Millard]

No, but unfortunately about 3 years (SW Time) worth of ideas for Millard are now scrapped. Might as well sent Millard there and have him die there.

And no I'm not saying that we should not approve this idea because it frells up my character. I just don't like the complete idea. There should be an Empire at SWFans, imho.

[ReaperFett]

Why?

[Taylor Millard]

To which statement?

Why there should be an Empire: It's a part of Star Wars. It's been a part of Star Wars since 1977. EVen in EU it's still around (to my knowledge it is- haven't read any NJO books yet), even if it's weaker then the New Republic (which as I've said on countless number of times, I'm cool with).

Why ideas for Millard have to be scrapped: Well even if Millard is a Dark Jedi and TBH member, he's more Imperial than Force User. That's how I (OOC) like it and prefer it. That and I don't want him to be a warlord of any kind. That's OOC feelings.

Hey if I'm outvoted, then I'm outvoted. I won't leave SWFans, but I'll focus on other characters (Kazaar, Haman, Gorgja the Hutt)...

[Sumor Rayial]

I'm not sure why you are looking at the idea so inflexably Taylor. I'll admit I don't know a lot about your characters past. However from what you've said here you don't want to be a political character. Then don't. Hook up with someone who is and be their "military guy". If the plan goes as it's theoretically supposed to (I think) then we should be seeing a lot more call for people like that rather than politics.

There are always ways to find your niche even in a world where there seems to be no niche, you just have to look for it.


As for the Conclave. We can break it up no problem.

[ReaperFett]

From ROTJ-TTT and from TTT-Darksabre, the EMpire was fragmented into groups, like Isard, Zsinj, Teradoc and so forth

[ReaperFett]

Now, when the Empire fragments, some would leave and become pirates. Some would take a planet and settle. But some wouldn't want to split. They'd want the old Empire. They could go two ways. Either, they would try and hold groups together, hence going diplomatic, or the more power hungry option where they start taking out other groups, and trying to take their power also. COuldnt Taylor fit there?

[Taylor Millard]

Originally posted by Sumor Rayial
Hook up with someone who is and be their "military guy". If the plan goes as it's theoretically supposed to (I think) then we should be seeing a lot more call for people like that rather than politics.
There are always ways to find your niche even in a world where there seems to be no niche, you just have to look for it.


I got insulted last night for my character being called political and then the person calling Millard political unable to prove it. Drove me nuts, that's why I've been inflexible.

But that's a good idea with the mlitary advisor. Who knows. Depends if anyone wants Millard. lol

[Taylor Millard]

Originally posted by ReaperFett
Now, when the Empire fragments, some would leave and become pirates. Some would take a planet and settle. But some wouldn't want to split. They'd want the old Empire. They could go two ways. Either, they would try and hold groups together, hence going diplomatic, or the more power hungry option where they start taking out other groups, and trying to take their power also. COuldnt Taylor fit there?

I suppose he could. Depends on how it works out. The fragmentation does let Millard be a bit more focussed on his Force Training.

But it's again something I'll have to consider.

[Manfred]

Its wasnt an insult! Taylor is political, its just so meshed in with everything he does its kinda hard to show any single proof

[Taylor Millard]

Okay so here's my question. How is the Empire going to break up. Vis you have a story planned?

[ReaperFett]

Yes. He dies :)

[Arlenia Tavira]

Maybe he dies, maybe not. I'm not sure if I want to ditch a character I've been trying to develop for 2 years.

[Sanis Prent]

I think of it like the Empire is along the lines of the Roman empire. Now...think that the Visigoths have just charged up the palatine hill. Ok, the "Roman Empire" is no more. But, now you have the Holy Roman Empire (a Frankish/Papal alliance), then maybe Charlemagne's descendants in Germany, and Gaul (France). The H.R.E. considers itself "Roman", though its neighbors do not, and do their own thing. Then, you have Byzantium to the east, which considers itself the true Roman Empire. Now, far to the northwest, you have the British Isles, which are just so far removed from it all that they do something completely different. Now, the African states, which are absorbed by the Islamic Moors.

Okay, you have a jillion options of "what is the empire"...or "does it even exist". From only a historian's viewpoint, there is no empire. But now, ask the different leaders, and you might get a differing idea. Some might claim they are the empire. Some might claim that they are, and the other guy isn't. Some might not care, and some might just get swallowed up by other powers.

[Morgan Evanar]

I could see Taylor pulling something of a Thrawn, actually, if Visc were to die.

In any event, I think we all sort of agree on something: Coruscant should be pretty much neutral, something of a free trade zone, almost.

[Morgan Evanar]

Charley - very good point. We could have the Imperial collapse mirror that of the Roman's. And I think it would solve a lot of worries.

And Like I said, the NR would only grab maybe three or four planets - Most likely Bespin, since its so close to Sulis Van, and maybe a few others. But historically extremely pro-imperial places, such as Cardia, would have no interest.

[Lord Gue]

Oh! I claim British isles! lol
Why Not, im part of TGE and am in the UR already...

[Loki Ahmrah]

Sanis hit the nail right on the head with that analogy there. Taylor, just because there will be many squabling, power-hungry warlords that doesn't mean Millard should be any different. In fact his loyalty to the Empire should grow stronger; he could in essence become the strong backbone of a withering Empire. He doesn't have to see him and those under him as the true Empire, but rather would stay true to the Empire in hope that it will become as powerful that it once was. I think that would be far more exciting than just being part of the invulnerable superpower anyways. What do you think?

[Taylor Millard]

Maybe. Talk more. Again, I still see that as more Political than Militaristic. But 'splain more Gav.

And the Holy Roman Empire deal I like.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Taylor, your character ISN'T a Grand Moff or anything like that. What my idea was with Laran was to have her start fighting against the NR on her own, a sort of villigante justice. She is devoted to the Empire, maybe more than Taylor is, simply because she has no other side to her character. Without the Empire, she has nothing.

So, without being "political" she's going to work for the rebuilding of the Empire. With military strikes, she can strive to bring the squabbling Moffs behind her..and maybe become the next leader of the Empire.

Ooh, I like that idea. :D

[Taylor Millard]

I'm glad you were able to find a direction for Laran. God knows I wasn't helping. Just know you have an ally in Millard if you ever need one.

Or could we work out a deal? Millard might join you on that leave squabbling moffs alone. :lol

[Sumor Rayial]

I like what you said LL. Allow me to add my own thoughts/continuation on it.

A good deal of the fall of the Roman Empire was due to Constantine moved his court to the East to battle the Prussians. That took his focus off the west and it's constant attacks at the hands of the Germanic Tribes.

One way to run this idea out is to follow along this kind of line. If Vis does not want to kill off Vis just now, it could be said that he and a large TGE force head out to the outer regions to take on an incursion of the Vong and then "disapear" fighting them for however long Vis wants to keep "Vis" out of the main loop.

With Vis gone the "Tribes" some factions from inside TGE, some from the Conclave, some from NR, and some pirates start taking peices out of the still large but now leaderless empire while the empire that remained from what Vis takes runs around trying to figure out what to do and who the leader is.


Vis leaving and taking a large force would also give a way for some of the TGE's large forces to suddenly "disapear" from the equation so that there is a smaller pie to slice in any split.

[Morgan Evanar]

I don't like the Vong. At all. =p The concept is interesting tho.

[Sanis Prent]

Well, Constantine didn't move the capital due to battle the prussians. The prussians weren't around yet :p. He moved the capital due to the fact that the east (future Byzantium, and constantinople) was really where all the money was being made in the empire. It was prospering, where Rome and the west were not.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

..Charley...are you taking history right now? ;)

Lets not forget the fact that Constantine renames the capital "Constantinople," and creates the Bzyantine Empire as the first Christian Emperor. He also is responsible for the start of the Catholic church as we find it in the Middle Ages... intertwining the church with the government.

Wasn't such a hot idea. Leads up to the Crusades..again not a hot idea. :p But Constantine didn't know that would happen.

THIS tangent has been brought to you by Mountain Dew Code Red!! :lol *skips out of thread for the moment*

[Arlenia Tavira]

Sums, I like your idea very, very much.

[Sumor Rayial]

Morg:

Their wouldn't have to be any Vong threads neccissarily, just the mentioning of them as the enemy. It c ould be any enemy, I just mentioned them due to most knowing them and knowing that they have been portrayed to be a very powerful enemy.

LL:

Well we're both right sort of. I was more paraphrasing history. Constantinople wasn't actually made THE capital until the Byzantine empire. Constantine made it the Eastern capital along with Rome being the Western capital.

But for the sake of not writing out a huge post giving the history of the Roman Empire to the entire board I'll leave it that I at least got the idea across.

Vis:

Thanks. Figured it gave you a way of getting rid of Vis for a while without actually killing him.

[Admiral Lebron]

Back to Kamaar with me then. Create some nifty little technologies. Probably help most rouge admirals interested in anything but my death.

[Lord Gue]

I feel a very cold day on Hoth about....
A very cold day indeed...

[Arlenia Tavira]

Gue, you'd have to ditch your SSD.

[Lord Gue]

not my baby! My pride and joy! That ships been with me since my humble beginings....
But If I can get Hoth back, the planet it was built over....
I shall make my sacrifice in the name of a good game.
Erm, what of my ISD? hehe

[Arlenia Tavira]

ISD is definitely kosher. More than 2 of them would be unkosher, I think.

[Lord Gue]

Well, since its really my Moffs, ill just "Requsition" it then
BTW, when does this whole death of Visc thing begin?

[Arlenia Tavira]

Originally posted by Arlenia Tavira
Maybe he dies, maybe not. I'm not sure if I want to ditch a character I've been trying to develop for 2 years.

[Lord Gue]

Ok, when would we start the whole division of the empire thing?

[Arlenia Tavira]

I dunno, soon

[ReaperFett]

lets all be in agreement first;)

[Admiral Lebron]

Can I keep a Leviathan II? Or 4 of them?

[Sanis Prent]

How big are they

[Arlenia Tavira]

1km a pop, if I remember his specs.

[Taylor Millard]

The dispersal of ships is something that will have to be discussed. How many does Vis take with him (is he is doing the disappearing act), stuff like that.

[Arlenia Tavira]

Probably about 90%. I would just leave enough to outfit the active officers with warlord fleets for the long trip (probably 1 or 2 star destroyers and their escort groups per officer), probably. This is something that I'm thinking would be kosher for each warlord group.

And Gue, no inheritance for you, so erase that from your mind this instant. In the event that the proposed does in fact take place, Imperial pre-warlord funding to you will be kaput.

[Taylor Millard]

I say get a whole copy of the Imperial fleet and send it to the mods. Work with them over what gets taken and what doesn't.

My suggestion is that alot of the heavy Star Destroyers go too. The big ones and all that stuff...but that's up to the mods and you to decide. imho.

[Lord Gue]

inheritance? if your refering to me gaining ships from all this, I hadnt thought of it in fact. But if the Imperial fleet would remain and be divided up I see no reason to get rid of the 2 ships I have now...

[Arlenia Tavira]

Originally posted by Taylor Millard
I say get a whole copy of the Imperial fleet and send it to the mods. Work with them over what gets taken and what doesn't.

My suggestion is that alot of the heavy Star Destroyers go too. The big ones and all that stuff...but that's up to the mods and you to decide. imho.

A copy of the latest roster (before anti-bean counting rule went into effect) is still in the TGE shipyards forum. If I recall correctly, there are something like 450 medium star destroyers, and then the 20-odd SSDs. Probably about 10 Imperial-class Star Destroyers total would be distributed to the TGE members, about 1 or 2 per each, as well as several small escort ships (Lancers, frigates, flurries, pickets, light cruisers, etc) so that there would be about 9 small escorts for every 1 impstar, which nicely enough goes along with the Imperial star destroyer group organization.

Gue, if you're trying to say that you're going to keep your SSD and an ISD too, to boot, I really doubt that will be the case. You'll not be able to profit from this in an Itala-like way, so don't even think about it.

[Lord Gue]

Well, as Radon Monty has never actually produced a build thread for his ship Ill be keeping my SSD as my only vessel and to keep any hope of competition I have with the other warlord factions

[Arlenia Tavira]

no, you won't be keeping an SSD.

[Lord Gue]

If I lose my ships, then get nothing back in compensation then its a bunch of crap on me isnt it, no I think my SSD stands

[Arlenia Tavira]

Because it utterly rapes the idea of the new clean slate, that's why pretel not.

[Lord Gue]

well leaving me stranded in the UR without any ships totally rapes me, thats why im against the taking of my ship

[Arlenia Tavira]

Use the ISD.

[Lord Gue]

Sure, since Radon was working for you when he built it show me a build thread
:evil

[Arlenia Tavira]

Who/what is Radon? No, wait, I don't even care. Use the ISD, because you're not getting an SSD.

[Lord Gue]

lol, no no, if we gonna do this scienticifal ur gonna prove that an ISD exists before I use it

[Sumor Rayial]

Gue if your going to be running your own group by your self then you'll have absolutely no way to support an SSD and an ISD.

From what I'm gathering (and support for that matter) a group of one person will get maybe 2 planets. There is no way you could support the crews of an SSD and ISD along with their fighter and trooper complimants. That's with a skeleton crew.

Basically NOONE short of a group under the new idea with... say 5-6 members... could support an SSD and ISD.

[Arlenia Tavira]

Fine then, go without an ISD, but you're still NOT going to have an SSD. You can have an ISD like all the warlords, be they Republic or Imperial, or you can go shipless.

[Lord Gue]

Umm, ive been runing my group for a long time now, and if all ya got is an SSD 1 planet has plenty of resources to support 1 SSD. the ISD was just recently introduced into my fleet.

[Sumor Rayial]

One planet will NOT support an SSD unless the planet is devoid of any inhabitants to consume the food produced on the planet, but then you don't have anyone to produce the food.

[Arlenia Tavira]

Umm, ive been runing my group for a long time now,

Irrelevant.


and if all ya got is an SSD 1 planet has plenty of resources to support 1 SSD.

Liar.


the ISD was just recently introduced into my fleet.

So use it, and stop trying to be the annoying iconoclast.

[Lord Gue]

I will when you start using plain english, theres absolutly no reason to use those damn words unless you wanna look smarter than everyone and have a need to show them up

[Sumor Rayial]

Actually the word he used is correct and there is no "lesser" word to explain it's meaning without possibly misconstruding his meaning.

[Arlenia Tavira]

So the only reason that you claim you'll keep an SSD is to be vindictive about other peoples' choice of words? How poor.

And largely irrelevant. Are you done stonewalling?

[Lord Gue]

wait for it...



wait for it...




wait for it...



wait for it...



ok, now Im done

[Sanis Prent]

What most are neglecting to remember is that rosters (with the exception of the super ships) no longer matter. There are no build times, build lengths, and no real need of a true roster. Now for the large ships, you still gotta RP building/acquiring them. Aside from that, you all have some degree of common sense, greater or lesser. Start using it.

[Lord Gue]

god I hate brad pitt....

and id like some clarification on that please, lol.
You may have noticed I pm'd ya before I read this

[Sanis Prent]

Exactly what do you need clarifying? Its all pretty simple, and if you need anything else on the matter, you can likely find it in the Fleet Forum's Clean Slate discussion.

[Lord Gue]

Excuse me, I sent ya the Pm to LL. I dont understand how to build ships, is it like how we used to build DS's in the days of yore? I read the thread, and as much as I hate the screwing up the rps, Ill live with it. Just want to understand it better

[Sanis Prent]

There's simply no building involved. Assume all ships you can support are "there". Now, if you try to do something ridiculous like have some kind of grand imperial battle fleet while owning one planet...yeah, we're gonna call it BS. But if you act with common sense, its really simple. Think of it like a normal duel...but not with Jedi, Sith and lightsabers, but with admirals and starships.

[Lord Gue]

and let me clear up one of my own misconceptions right now since ive got your ear....

No taking of someone elses's planet without there permission?

is that real?

[Sanis Prent]

Yes.

[Taylor Millard]

Kinda helps ya know? Makes more interesting an RP, plus it's fun. Or supposed to be, I suppose.

[Manfred]

Not really, I liked how ya never knew when getting into a conflict if you were going to win or lose. Now ya not only have to have permission to attack, but permission to conquer, so from the begining you either already know youve lost and/or won. Takes the fun out of fighting over planets.

[Taylor Millard]

Bah I say bah. The most fun I've ever had with RPs is when I know the beginning and know the end. But the middle fills in the fun. You never know what will happen there.

[Adm Garm Bel Iblis]

Alright, well... I've read the thread over now that I've finally got the time. I made it a point to reread my own as carefully and objectively as possible... and I'm lost on why I got the reaction I did, but whatever.

Military RP on this board is finally about to make sense. Congratulations. I hope it lasts. I just need a few clarifications still.

Who makes the decision on what is "nailed down" as you put it?

There is actually a fairly long list of planets that the NR would want to liberate from Imperial hands. It has never been the NR's policy to expand by force or crush their enemies. They would not do it for the "traditional" reasons like resources or power, but to free the people living there from Imperial tyrrany. Coruscant chief among them because it is the best place to hold the Senate and other administrative duties for all of the member worlds. Obviously Carida and Imp-rule friendly worlds would stay. But Ithor? Just one example.

This internal break up would give them just the opportunity they've been waiting for. I'm still unclear on what happens to those worlds?

I assume TSO is not breaking up like TGE is. Right?

Before I left the fleet arena, I "built" a new class of ship called the Republic Class Command Carrier. I just thought it was an interesting idea to have an SSD / MC-150 equivalent ship of different design to revolve operations around. Seeing the exact same ships all the time was getting boring.

I'd like to use it again if I got involved in a military RP. I never planned on using it on the front lines regardless. (Just like the Executor never engaged directly at Hoth) And if the opposing player in the thread objects to it, I won't use it at all for that RP.

[Taylor Millard]

Well I think that's something to talk to the mods about. I think right now we need to see what all is going to happen and then go from there.

Perhaps make a lising of the groups that are going to come out of it, then begin saying where the territory is.

I personally thinkg Coruscant should go to the New Republic. But that' sjust me.

As for the Republic Class COmmand Carrier, that's another thing for the mods to decide.

[Liam Jinn]

Right, so the NR goes to non-playable, what about NRSF? Will that still be playable? And if so, what fleet does it use? It would be using the NR's and that would be pointless.

If this breaking up of the Empire thing is going to happen, then will the NR fleet be downsized as well? How about NRSF be issued a small number of ships from the exsisting NR fleet and the rest of the fleet just not be playable?

[Adm Garm Bel Iblis]

Well the size of respective fleets is a moot point now that we've abandonded the build rules and adopted the fair play/common senes system. I'm not worried about that.

I am thinking it's safe to say that the size of the force under one's command only really matters when you are going to be in a military confrontation against another player in a non-scripted battle.

I see no reason why someone can't RP being in the military of the NR or even one of those Imp factions unless they are doing something drastic that requires mod intervention or attacking one of the other recognized groups.

[Sanis Prent]

(gives a Fonzie-style thumbs up to Garm)

[Khan Surak]

I don't think anyone's really noticed, but I've been gone for three months or so. Anyway, I am glad about the changes and you won't hear any griping from my corner.

DC still retains only one planet and a limited fleet. We're that small militant group that a couple of you seem to need to stir things up a bit without getting your own hands dirty. Don't get me wrong, we have no problem with that. :)

I'm really glad about the changes. Fleet rping is a lot less complicated now. And there are other ways to take a planet besides military action. I'm not going to give away any of my brilliant ideas :D , but there are ways.

Oh yes, and if anyone has any ideas for an rp involving Death Fleet or Dayark Corps, please pm me. We're pretty much open for the time being.

[Jehova Eaven]

TriOp isn;t important... ignore us, Don't take any of our ships... even though we don't have any large ships. After someone takes my Interdictor off my hands. So... howe about taking planets that aren't claimed by anyone? Could I take those without... permission? :: blech :: I hate that p word.

[Arlenia Tavira]

Thyferra, Bespin, Balmorra, Kamaar, Carida.

All nailed-down worlds, each commanded by a different warlord.

[Sanis Prent]

Jehova, just make sure you RP it out, and there shouldn't be a problem.

[Admiral Lebron]

Yay Kamaar! Khan, PM when you get a chance please.

[Jehova Eaven]

ah ok, no problem. danke Sanis.

[Adm Garm Bel Iblis]

So when is this thing happening? Are you guys making a story out of it? What thread should I be looking for if it is? Or is it just being done behind the scenes?

[Khendon Sevon]

Edit (again, again): this sounds cool, count me in ~ as long as I get to be a Warlord, myself :)

wouldn't be fitting for a Vice Diktat to just become chop liver.

[Marcus Telcontar]

Vis ~ Got an idea that you might be interested in. It involves Coruscant and Vis's disappearence




Lets see... NRSF disposes of any warship, just uses resonable NR ships for it's purposes

Stays nailed to Arcan IV, Yavin

Becomes a more covert ops group, to suit the nature of the threats.

Oooooh.... now this is really posing a few damn good possibilities. I could quite well imagine a covert ops against a pirate group or a local Warlord. Maximum sneakage.

Sorry - just thinking out loud here. I really can see some quite nifty possibilities opening up.

[Admiral Sokolov]

New Imperial Warlord ready to do...... something.

[Taylor Millard]

Be patient. We are almost ready for you. :)

[Lord Gue]

lol, and another one jumps aboard

[Admiral Lebron]

I feel special. I'm already my warlord self.

[Adm Garm Bel Iblis]

I welcome the chance to help out with any RP revolving around this major event. I would love to participate in the return of the NR. Feel free to PM, IM, or email me.

[Arlenia Tavira]

Yeah, you can be at the head of the NR fleet that goes off and disappears in the pursuit of the Vong :p

[Serena Laran]

*smacks Arlenia* Not helpful!

[Arlenia Tavira]

No, I'm being very serious. A Yuuzhan Vong invasion force arrives, the empire sends 99% of its fleet after it, the NR zilch? I don't think so. The NR will send a large fleet after it, just like the empire, the only problem is that the empire will be a lot harder hit, having sent a proportionately larger force compared to its size. Why? Because the imperial command structure is centralized. Less democracy means more ships at an immediate command.

So we have a very depleted empire, a less depleted NR (which still has the military capacity to take Coruscant), and warlordism in both states, but more dominant in the empire. And so, maximum flexibility, maximum feasibility.

[Khan Surak]

Then the Vong are neutralized? Or just routed to muster their forces again and attack periodically?

[Arlenia Tavira]

Presumably they're chased into their own galaxy, and about 4,000 very pissed off NR and Imperial ships follow them through in order to open up a can of whoopa$$ on their god, lama war something or yun yahoo or whatever.

[Khan Surak]

:lol I think it's Yun-Yammka... maybe.

[Master Yoghurt]

Originally posted by Arlenia Tavira
With Vis out the picture (perhaps dead), the Empire would in a matter of minutes, perhaps mere seconds, dissolve into independant warlords each fighting for their own fiefdom. Coruscant, no longer supplied by more than 60 other planets, would soon become incapable of supporting 130+ million stormtroopers. It is at this point that individual warlords will flourish. The Rebels could rush in, clear the cloaked minefields, take out the Golans, sabotage the shields, and conquer Coruscant, which at this point would be running low on food.

Each warlord and their group would be very limited in their control of planets as per the common sense rule. Obviously we couldn't have a warlord going off and taking 5-15 planets, or we'd be right back where we started again. More like 2 max.

The conclave (which I believe has something like ~700 ships) would have to do something similar to get it to acceptable warlord levels, again regulated by the common sense rule.

And this is where the fun begins. Countless warlords seeded throughout the galaxy, all trained at Carida, means no stalemate and uber competition, of which RPers can partake. Carefree, casual military conflicts.

Ok, suppose I should add my comment (as a mod and representative for the NR playing Ackbar). I like this idea a lot. A more fractionalised military allows for frequent skirmishes. It is also good to see an increasing interest for realism and fair play in fleet roleplay. Thumbs up.



A Yuuzhan Vong invasion force arrives, the empire sends 99% of its fleet after it, the NR zilch? I don't think so. The NR will send a large fleet after it, just like the empire, the only problem is that the empire will be a lot harder hit, having sent a proportionately larger force compared to its size. Why? Because the imperial command structure is centralized. Less democracy means more ships at an immediate command.

So we have a very depleted empire, a less depleted NR (which still has the military capacity to take Coruscant), and warlordism in both states, but more dominant in the empire. And so, maximum flexibility, maximum feasibility.

Sounds good :)

[Sanis Prent]

Well, I could send Admiral Sargast on that, since I practically never have time to RP him anymore.

[Morgan Evanar]

I won't be participating in the initial conflict, but look for someone to show up after the fray.

[Khendon Sevon]

One problem... wouldn't the fleet be commanded by TGE's best and brightest? why wouldn't Taylor, myself, Gue, Viscera, Lebron, etc. go with the offensive?

I'm sure we could find a cool reason, like peace brigade interception of their shuttles or something...

[Lord Gue]

actually If a Vong invasion occured I would be involved as I attacked them in at least two threads over time when they were still played round here. Maybe this could be my chance, as a private citizen, to merge back into the Empire of the known galaxy...

[ReaperFett]

Depends. The NJO time NR had many generals who weren't near oneanother. Wedge took Borelias, for example, while Kre'Fey and Iblis were in some other place. Also, there could be a retreat, or the generals may decide to not be in the forward attack, or their fleet could be wiped and they flee.....



And so on :)

[Khendon Sevon]

Alright, good. Everything seems to be set, then.

[Admiral Lebron]

If you need an Admiral send Viscera as he always was one to be present at times of action. Possibly Sanis's inactive admiral?

[Jedi Neo]

Seems like a good idea..

I think it could work. As long as it is interesting, it should rekindle peoples intrust (the real problem)

[Lord Gue]

Well, whens this thing gonna happen? We all seem pretty much agreed and I know theres a few of us just itchin to get started...

[Helenias Evenstar]

How do the geeks say it... w00t?

Well overdue and very welcome.

[Zasz Grimm]

This is indeed very interesting. I however do not Fleet RP, but would gladly get involved in it if possible. Could I possibly join in somehow?

[Darth Viscera]

Yep. Go to the TGE board, post in the recruitment forum, and a member of TGE will likely take you on.

[Lord Gue]

Why apply to TGE...
If TGE is gonna....
hmmm

[Admiral Lebron]

Is this ever gonna happen or what?

[Grizwaldy]

Well Khendons already got 1 RP taking place after, so I suggest we get this thing moving..

[Tsavong Lah]

It has begun
http://www.swforums.net/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=318116#post318116

[Darth Viscera]

okay, i'll do it when I get time. It's a rather big deal, and i want to see i do it right.

[Darth Viscera]

I'm writing it. I'll post it all in Storytelling when it's done. No assistance (in the form of RPed vong or otherwise) is necessary. I can write my own exit.

[Morgan Evanar]

Okies... like I said, I just don't have time to participate right now.

[Darth Viscera]

You guys can just RP that it's already occurred. FYI, the following will happen in the RP:

1.~1,000 NR ships will be lost in a battle against the Yuuzhan Vong
2. A week later, ~3,000 Imperial ships are involved in a campaign that begins with the defense of Imperial Center. The Imp fleet wins at Coruscant by hiding the amount of defenders present and trapping the Vong fleet. The Imp fleet (with DV aboard) then pursues the vong back to their galaxy, and contact is lost with the normal galaxy.

You can use that in your RPs when you need to write about what happened.

[Darth Viscera]

Let me say again, Gue.

You getting to keep your SSD is NOT part of the deal. You will not weasle your way into profiting from everyone else's sacrifice, not while I have air in my lungs!

Hell, everyone at swfans has sacrificed so much in order to try and get fleet RPs back on schedule. I had to give up my own empire, that I've built for 2 years! And then you come along, trying to forsake everyone OOC, dragging your SSD around like it's 30 pieces of silver. Your selfishness in this matter is astounding! :mad

[Lord Gue]

Yeah well, as I found out that some of the warlords are keeping more than one planet without the memberage to do so I refuse to give up my SSD likewise.

[Mr Wednesdaydale]

You just don't get it, do you? The planets don't enter into a damn bit of difference. Yes, each warlord keeps anywhere from 1-3 planets. It does not entitle you to a SSD. End of story.

If you want to play like that, you can kindly do so at TRF or wherever you go. No other warlord has been allowed to support a ship that large, and there's no reason whatsoever that you will be, either.

[Lord Gue]

1-2 planets smart guy, I had believed it was one, but its 1-2 and the rule is still not adhered to. End of story yourself, im quite tired of arguing with you.

[Taataani Meorrrei]

Then leave, because the only way you are going to get that SSD, is on some other RP board. Thats not the same as negotiating a number of planets. A SSD is a massive ship. 10 planets, and you might be able to support ONE. Three planets, forget it. The warlords are able to field an army of spitballs and paper clips, at best. No bit of common sense would then allow you to roll in with a warship like that.

The whole point of the new rules is that the numbers can be fudged...within reason. It keeps people from quantifying the rules, and as you like to do, loophole them. Yes some have been allowed more than the "stated planet amount". The reasoning is that their planets are sparsely populated, not cosmic metropoleis like Coruscant and the like. Its the same reason why an acre of land in Alaska is cheaper than an acre of land in D.C. That is an acceptable adjustment, within the terms of common sense. Allowing you to use a super star destroyer is not.

[Lord Gue]

No, my refusal to let go of my SSD is not on the subject that I can field it, its on that I had it before and now that I see that u can get away with not giving up some of your stuff, then i refuse to give up mine unless you do.

[Anbira Hicchoru]

Then you won't be RPing in fleets here. That SSD might as well be a flying wad of origami. Thanks, bye.

[Sean Piett]

I'd like to note that, despite what Gue so frequently reminds us, he has NOT had that Super Star Destroyer forever. In FACT, it was never legitimately built. 'The Hope' was a ship of his design from the days of the Imperial Empire. After a while, the Tenchi-Muyo design turned into an illegitimate Super Star Destroyer.

[Lord Gue]

Not Quite, Back when I built it, it was an accepted design, then a new fleet RP rule came out where all new designs were to be scraped, thats when my ship, the size of an SSD and with comperable arments, was legitimatly formed into an SSD for realism and continuity.

And as for u mr. big shot:
Suck it, suck it long and suck it hard

[Anbira Hicchoru]

Your asinine insults aren't going to change anything, Gue. You're still not getting that SSD. Why you couldn't use an ISD like every other imperial is beyond me. Nobody else is acting like a fool and making ridiculous demands. There's just no reason to allow your SSD to be RPed here, and thus, it won't be.

[Admiral Lebron]

Gue take the ISD and shut up.

[Sean Piett]

Hmmm... I'm wondering, could the Imperials maintain a very small piece of Coruscant? Call it Imperial District, or something? Even a small, underworld base from which to lead small attacks on the NR? It would be a good proving grounds between NRSF and anyone who was interested in ground-based military actions for the Empire. Plus, the base wouldn't be invincible, so if someone roleplayed finding it, then they could overcome it with general ease. Only thing is, noone could attack it right away. Not until there were enough attacks to draw notice. I'd certainly enjoy myself in this sort of roleplaying.

[Admiral Sokolov]

Hey, I'd love to command ground combat. That's my specialty. :) That's a great idea Sean.

[Sean Piett]

*Rubs his toe into the ground*

Aww, shucks! Thanks!

[Lord Gue]

I agreed to the ISD believing the rules would be followed, and ur taking of superfulous planetary bodies is against it, thus I am against it and will remain so until justified. and in conclusion, bite me

[Sean Piett]

Then go hook up with Ceel and tell him you're joining up

[Telan Desaria]

Herr Unteroffizer GUE:

It has been justified on more than one occassion...Any posts I see, given thjat it is the ruing of this body, with an SSD in it, will be ignored. By me, at least.

Take the ISD...

or you'll have one planet, a lot of stubborn and igorant diligence, and no way to get out the UR ever again.

Thank, you and good night.

[Admiral Lebron]

I'm going to RP that I have some men on Couruscant. A small cluster of troops running black ops and whatnot on the planet.

[Sean Piett]

Hmmmmm... Well, we've gotta figure something out. Why aren't you on AIM?

[Admiral Lebron]

I am. Lemme add you

[Zak Rakvon]

A very good idea!

ALL HAIL THE IMPERIAL FEDERACY!

[Sean Piett]

Yes! Federacy, federacy, oi oi oi!


Huzzah