ATOC not dark enough??

[Starquest aka AndyR]

Read an interesting review of ATOC on filmforce that made me think of something.... At the end, when we are supposed to feel the gravity of all the jedi getting killed - we dont.... I mean we dont really feel the sadness of jedi getting killed by machines... I didn't even notice it before, but I didn't care about them getting killed as much as I cared about seeing the main characters kick ass (and get their noggin lopped off).


here is a sample of the review (pay attention to the 2nd paragraph, its very relevant):


Episode II is a blueprint, and nothing more. It's up to us, the audience, to flesh-it-out and find the "truth" of its story, because Lucas either refuses to – or is afraid to – or cannot – commit. How so? During one of AotC's major battle sequences, he actually finds a way for girly-man-droid C-3PO to verbally apologize for action (and violence) happening on-screen. Defenders will argue that Threepio is apologizing for his own actions, which are suffered against his will. But that doesn't change the fact that the intensity of the scene is deliberately undercut by factoring unnecessary softness into the equation. If ever there was a testament to dramatic insincerity or conceptual uncertainty...

Would the forcible freezing and subsequent kidnapping of Han Solo in Empire play as well if Lando had cracked a one-liner in the Carbon Chamber? No. Attack of the Clones is chicken, which makes it difficult not to hold grave reservations about Episode III, which, conceptually, is supposed the darkest, harshest, and most mean-spirited of all Star Wars movies.

Bet it won't be.



agree? disagree?

link to full article: http://filmforce.ign.com/articles/359/359431p1.html

[darth_mcbain]

Well, he does bring up a good perspective with the whole Threepio thing. I agree and disagree with the article as a whole. I do think that Ep. II was quite a bit darker than Ep. I. And I do think the gravity of the Jedi's deaths hit me - when Yoda, Obi-Wan, and Mace are talking at the end... Where the heck are the rest of them? True not all died, but the scene with just those three in the room underscored the fact that there were major losses to the Jedi. I also thought Dooku brought a great amount of darkness to the movie. I loved his line to Yoda "This is just the beginning!" I take that to be figurative, meaning "This is just the beginning of the Dark Times." Much darker times are ahead.

But, I agree that the darkness could have been deeper. Threepio did bug me with his one-liners. I did think they were pretty funny, but given what was going on around them they were grossly out of place. It detracted from the severity that should have been the beginning of the Clone Wars. I wonder if might have saved the rating? A scene as long as that final battle without any comic relief may have made the MPAA look a little closer at the PG rating.

Hopefully Ep. III will be much darker without some of the corny humor.

[Doc Milo]

About his line about Lando cracking one-liners during Han's kidnapping, etc...

Did we not see C-3PO cracking jokes while they chased Boba Fett to the docking bay?

"Well, at least you're all in one piece. Look what happened to me!"

Artoo beeps and whistles

"Well, of course I've looked better!"

Heck, Threepio even apologizes in that scene too!

"He's only a wookiee."

I think people like to criticize what they percieve as flaws in this trilogy but turn a blind eye to those same "flaws" in the OT.

[darth_mcbain]

You know - that's a really good point Doc. I didn't really even think about that... It goes to show how much the OT is revered and can do no wrong (except for Greedo shooting first :) ) - yet the similar points in the prequels are ripped apart.

[Doc Milo]

It's not even a flaw, in my mind.

In very intense or very emotional scenes, there needs to be a bit of comic relief. Either by way of making it a part of the scene, or cutting away from the scene and showing something lighter.

Heck, even Shakespeare had his Falstaffs and Pucks...

[Jinn Fizz]

Agree with you 100%, I do, Doc Milo :thumbup

[imported_QuiGonJ]

yep.. Doc is right. "Come back here.. you're not even finished with me, yet." :)

Hmm, yet another parallel tween Empire and AOTC. :)

[Starquest aka AndyR]

Good point Doc. I was racking my brain trying to think of what 3po did during the carbonite/finale scenes, but couldn't for the life of me remember anything out of place...

Unfortunately I cannot watch the OT right now because I only have a projector that does not work with VCR's... I actually NEED a DVD of the OT... maybe I can make one on my pc and burn it to DVD... hmmm.

[Overflow]

when you see war scenes, you don't have time to get sad. if sadness gets you, you dead. on the battle field you just have to concentrate on doing o good job, you get to cry about the killed ones later. maybe that's why you leave the movie feeling kinda sad.

[Jedi Master Carr]

I agree Doc plus 3po made some smart remarks before Han was put in the chamber, like Now Chewbacca you have a responsibility to me, so don't do anything stupid, and he said a few otherthings but can't remember what, they guy is an idiot he is looking for flaws and a review like that I just ignore.

[Jedieb]

I had NO problem with any of 3PO's lines during the battle. They were pretty funny and brought out plenty of laughter in the theater. Doc's right, he was right there spouting off his prissy mouth during the carbon freezing scene; "He should be quite well protected. If he survived the freezing process." And he's whinning and complaining when Chewbacca is tossing Stormtroopers left and right. I think it would have been darker if we'd seen more scenes of Jedi dying, but damn, we saw one get blasted right off the balcony by Jango. Just how many did we need to see die? I thought the image of Obi-Wan checking for a pulse was very poignant and a powerful reminder that many Jedi had fallen in the battle. We got limb chopping and a beheading. How much more can a movie that Lucas partially aims at 12 year olds give us?

And remember, Greedo shooting first isn't OT, it's SE. ;)

[Doc Milo]

I wonder how long it's been since these reviewers have actually watched the OT. I think they're comparing something they've seen recently to the memories of the OT. But, because they love the OT, those memories are "edited." They only remember the parts they want to remember.

[JMK]

Yeah, they only carry the impressions the OT made on them when they were younger. They probably be surprised if they watched them again and realized how close the dialogue is and how thematically similar they are.