Are we going to lose the B.O. battle?

[Jedieb]

As the the revised numbers start to sink in AOTC's Memorial Day performance seems more critical than anyone previously imagined. Can AOTC match TPM's 21% decline over the same time frame (number taken from boxoffice mojo)? If AOTC doesn't match that hold then we may not only be saying good bye to dreams of $500M, but we could be losing the battle for #1 film of the year. A Star Wars first! It may seem hard to believe that a SW film that many (but obviously not all) SW fans believe to be superior to its recent predecesor could fail to match and even surpass the box office performance of that predecessor(TPM). But you know what this has an eerie similarity too?

ESB

That's right folks. Remember how you walked out of that theater thinking you'd seen an even BETTER SW movie than before. You scratched your head in wonder later that year when ESB failed to top ANH. Then ET comes along and you wondered what was wrong with the country and the movie going public. How could ESB NOT shatter all of ANH's records? It was so much darker and deeper. It had romance, comic relief, better effects, and a great new character called Yoda. Now over 20 years later we find ourselves in an eerily similiar situation. For many fans that sentence above could be used to descrive AOTC to a tee. And if this holds true for AOTC, what does it bode for EP3? There isn't going to be any ROTJ Ewok inspired pick me up there. It's going to get bloodier, moodier, and darker. "The last SW film ever" mantra may not be enough to counter the somber story ahead. The irony is that many SW fans will cherish it and put EP3 at the top of their list, but it's B.O. performance may be the weakest of all SW films.

But if I had to pick between breaking B.O. records and getting SW films that I enjoyed more because they stayed true to the story GL enviosned all take lower numbers in a heartbeat.

[JonathanLB]

"This is a crisis!"

Eh, Memorial Day Weekend should be good. Don't lose hope yet.

[JMK]

The mere fact that we're even having this discussion is somewhat discouraging news.
But I suppose there is a way to put a positive spin on this. If everyone that sees Spider Man sees AotC, we're in good shape because I strongly believe that AotC will have much better repeat viewing scores than Spidey.

[Jedieb]

"This is a crisis!"
LOL!!:lol

[Quadinaros]

I don't think that ESB was immediately perceived as a better film than ANH. I just think it withstood the test of time better and has become the fan favorite. I believe mass audiences still consider ANH to be the best Star Wars film.

I was only 8 when I saw ESB and I was actually somewhat disappointed with it. Only as I grew up did I come to appreciate its merits. Anyway, I guess I'm getting off topic... :|

[Jinn Fizz]

Originally posted by Jedieb
But if I had to pick between breaking B.O. records and getting SW films that I enjoyed more because they stayed true to the story GL enviosned all take lower numbers in a heartbeat.

Amen, Jedieb, amen. I was entertained, impressed, moved, overjoyed, and satisfied beyond belief. That's all that matters to me in the end. :)

[imported_QuiGonJ]

I see the media has done their job well... fear they have given you.

I should have marked the link, I'll try to find it, but Spidey had it in their theater contracts to hold Spidey on the big screens til after Memorial Day. I think that has affect the numbers somewhat.

[imported_QuiGonJ]

Ah, here it is:

http://www.showbizdata.com/contacts/picknews.cfm?id=29322

[Jedi Master Carr]

Yeah I saw that, so after Memorial Day I guess Spiderman will really fall, I guess. But I won't worry about it I know for certain that AOTC will win the WW battle, Spiderman just won't do well in Europe, Australia, etc. Look at this way Spiderman made 13 million in its first weekend compared to 64 million for AOTC that is about 6-1 margin and that margin will probably stay like that, AOTC will make 500-600 overseas while spiderman will do 300-400 that 100-200 million difference should be enough to put AOTC at 1 WW unless HP does great overseas again.

[jjwr]

Am I the only one that thinks Spiderman is gonna start dropping bigger and bigger after Memorial day? It'll have been out for a month and I have to believe that most of the people who want to see it have seen it already.

It should start to lose theatres and all the new releases(including AotC) should really start to affect its grosses.

I know a lot of people who went to see Spiderman this past weekend because they thought EP2 would be packed and they're wiating till next weekend at the earliest before trying to see EP2.

After the huge openings I could see Spiderman starting to fade much quicker, but with such a huge start even 40%+ Drops from here on out(after Memorial day most likely) will still be giving it big weekends.

[JonathanLB]

I think we will win the box office battle in North America vs. Spider-Man, but if you want to look at it positively, just try to think about the staying power. An $80M opening actually makes me think we have more chance at great staying power than an $86M opening, no question about it. With an opening at $86M, it's kind of like, well, I suppose it *could* hold as well as TPM maybe, but with an opening at $80M, which is really not much different than $64.8 in 1999 dollars, I know it can be done because it already WAS done just three years ago by another Star Wars movie, lol.

Nothing to worry about. I remember I was rather worried about TPM actually, at first, I was thinking, man, I hope this film does really well but I just don't know. The opening was so far below what I thought it might be (though my expectations were unrealistic because I didn't understand how the box office worked). Now, I think we are going to look back on this 5 months from now and sorta laugh and think, "Hehe, we shouldn't have doubted Star Wars. It's Star Wars!!!"

"I believe mass audiences still consider ANH to be the best Star Wars film."

Hmm... I am not sure I would agree with you there. I really think ROTJ was the most popular among the non-geek crowd. At least especially among the younger Star Wars fans, ROTJ is easily first, ESB is easily last. I never cared for ESB as a kid, thought it was boring and a letdown, but now it's my favorite of the OT. It's not boring at all, so I don't know why I thought that, but kids have a really poor attention span sometimes...

I wouldn't say ANH is resoundingly considered the best by the public. I'm guessing it would be very split between the five films right now. It's "cool" to say that ESB is best, though. Hayden says it's his favorite film of the OT (at Celebration II he said this). If you want to sound like "you know what you're talking about," you are supposed to say that. I of course think that is absolute nonsense because ESB is my 3rd favorite now, but whatever. Anyone can like any SW movie the most and that doesn't make them a less informed fan. A fan certaintly has the right to think ESB is the least of the saga, if that's what they believe. I would say it'd be too bad if they didn't appreciate it because it's such a wonderful film, but that's ok. Nothing we can do about that, can't force them to love it ;)

AOTC will do Star Wars proud, whether or not it beats Spider-Man. Everyone I know so far thinks it's a better film and people are really into it! That's all we can ask. I mean, here is a film that the fans love and the public is loving too. How can that be a disappointment to our saga? It has done Star Wars proud already just by its quality.

[JMK]

I think ANH is still universally considered THE Star Wars film. Didn't the SE re-release in '97 do the best of all of them? If so, then that isn't a surprise. It's not because it had the most changes, so people wanted to see them all, its because they like it the most. Whenever my parents think Star Wars, they think ANH, they think bun hair, walking carpets and everything else that goes along with ANH and the first SW movie.

[Doc Milo]

I'm new to this Box Office analysis game, but it seems to me that with AotC opening on 1500 fewer screens, there may have been people who went to the theater to see AotC, but found that it was sold out. They then decided to see Spiderman. So, in a way, AotC having fewer screens may have helped Spiderman's box office from having a massive fall-off... Could this be?

[Jedieb]

I agree with JMK. ANH is considered the definitive SW film for most movie goers. There's a reason it was the first on the AFI list. They can try to pin the ANH label on it, but for the casual movie goer, ANH means very little, it's Star Wars, the first and the original. The SE's were a good example of this. The difference between the B.O. results is striking. Star Wars nearly doubled the take of ESB and ROTJ. Star Wars has something going for it that no other SW movie has, it's a stand alone movie. It's a simple story and you don't need to know ANY backstory before you sit down to watch it. ESB has the cliffhanger, Jedi has to resolve it, TPM is a setup movie, and AOTC has tons of things going on in it that leave you wondering what's going to happen next. ANH's B.O. has always been the one to beat. You adjust the numbers and figure in the limited number of screens that it played on and its impact is just mezmorizing. It opened at #2 just behind Smokey and the Bandit with only a handful of theaters playing itPlus, being the first never hurts. It's re-release in 78 was just sick. I don't think you'll EVER see a film re-leased a second year in a row and make the top 20 that second year.

But I digress, we won't know how AOTC is going to hold up until we can see next weekend's numbers. As for theater demands, no one makes stricter ones than Lucas. Theaters playing AOTC have to hold it for at least 6 weeks I believe.

[JonathanLB]

You cannot say that just because ANH: SE made the most at the box office, it is therefore the most popular film of the OT. ROTJ killed ESB on the first release, and the reason that it didn't beat ESB on the SE release is simply because it was the last film.

If they had re-released ESB first, then ANH and ROTJ, it would have been an entirely different story.

The SE grosses follow a very obvious patter: first made the most, second made the second most, third made the least. That's what happens when you re-release three films like that.

Very few people consider ANH the best SW film, in relationship to how many people there are. You are suggesting that "most," as in 50% or more, think ANH is the best Star Wars film and that is simply incorrect. According to most polls taken, more than 50% think ESB is the best film, but those were polls among fans, so again, I think that overall, right now, the 5 films would share pretty equally with TPM and ROTJ having less than their share, ESB and AOTC probably having more than their share.

[Dutchy]

Originally posted by Jedieb
As for theater demands, no one makes stricter ones than Lucas. Theaters playing AOTC have to hold it for at least 6 weeks I believe.

4, I believe.

Oh, this is an interesting reading: 'Attack of the Clones' Lands $6 Million Short of Fox Estimate (http://www.boxofficemojo.com/articles/news/?id=020521sw.htm).

[Jedieb]

Most SW fans put ESB at the top of their list, but most film goers put ANH at the top of their list. IMDB is a perfect example of what I'm talking about. ANH is the ONLY SW movie that's in the top ten. There's a test of time for you. As for the SE's ROTJ actually opened HIGHER than ESB, but still fell short of it. And the B.O. returns for ESB and ROTJ SE's were not that far apart, but ANH outdistanced them by a significant margin. It's still the most widely recognizable SW movie for most filmgoers. Most filmgoers aren't die hards like us. They put ANH at the top of their SW lists more often than not.

[JonathanLB]

ROTJ did not open higher. ROTJ had about $16M in its first weekend, ESB had $22 million. Not sure where you got your information, lol.

[JonathanLB]

If we lose this box office battle, then I hope Spider-Man whoops Titanic. I suppose it has a chance, actually. That's scary, but if it kept holding up extremely well...

$300 million before Friday, actually, and then this weekend it could make $50 million for the four-day period, or at least another $40-45 million, then it'd already be more than half way there and still running ahead of Titanic :) lol.

[JMK]

Regardless, ANH is absolutely the SW movie that most casual moviegoers recognize and cherish the most. There cannot be any argument to that. Everyone remembers the first of everything the most. Everyone remembers their first love, everyone remembers their first home run, parents always remember their child's first word, movie goers remember the first star wars movie. And I think that regardless of what order the SE's were released in, ANH still would have made the most because it resonates the most with the public. Die hard Star Wars fans do not make up relatively large percentage of society, so you have to realize that there are million who have had the greatest impression made on them by ANH.

[Dutchy]

Originally posted by JonathanLB
If we lose this box office battle, then I hope Spider-Man whoops Titanic. I suppose it has a chance, actually. That's scary, but if it kept holding up extremely well...

$300 million before Friday, actually, and then this weekend it could make $50 million for the four-day period, or at least another $40-45 million, then it'd already be more than half way there and still running ahead of Titanic :) lol.

If it keeps dropping 37%-ish, it won't come even close. :)

[JonathanLB]

I know, it was a joke ;)

"There cannot be any argument to that."

Well, I disagree with you there. MOST people do not think ANH is the best. Most is 50%+ and that is simply not accurate. If you asked them what movie had the most effect on them of the 5 SW films, I am sure most everyone would say ANH, but if you asked them what was their favorite movie, among people who admitted they HAVE seen all 5 movies (otherwise, it's not a fair poll), then I think you'd find the numbers very split.

[Marcus Telcontar]

I'ld say the chances of Spider Man winning the year are quite good. A travesty, as I dont believe Spider Man is actually really that good, but still a definate possibility

[JMK]

Ok, but how many people are voting on IMDB that aren't Star Wars fans? When a poll for Star Wars pops up on the net, the news spreads like wildfire and every SW fan with a computer heads over and votes. If you took all SW fans' voting away, a very different picture would emerge, I'm sure.

[JonathanLB]

That is true too, lol. IMDB voters are weird, they just are. They do not reflect the public's opinion on movies at all. I've seen a lot of downright awful films getting great ratings and nobody in the real world, i.e. outside of film geeks, would actually enjoy them. Other times, very good, high grossing movies are getting in the 6-range, and that's not realistic either. Ask the average person if they enjoyed Independence Day and they'd probably say, "Yes, that was a really fun movie!" Sure it's not deserving of any top 100 or even 400 lists, lol, but it is a fun movie that most people enjoy. The intellectual elite call it trash that is unworthy of their high tastes, but in reality, despite some of the corny dialogue and very unoriginal plot, it's definitely a solid three to three-and-a-half star film that is at least good entertainment.

I realize that being film buffs here, a lot of people do probably like saying, "Independence Day was crap!" Well it really wasn't. It really was enjoyable entertainment, and almost everyone agreed as the film had wonderful staying power and did very well worldwide. I would only give it 3 stars I think, but it's a fun film. IMDB voters don't think like that. They are like, "Well this film is for the masses, it gets a 3/10." LOL. Then they see some utterly stupid independent film and give it 10/10 because nobody else has seen it and therefore it's good, apparently.

[Dutchy]

Originally posted by JonathanLB
That is true too, lol. IMDB voters are weird, they just are. They do not reflect the public's opinion on movies at all.

I disagree. The IMDb Top 250 is one of my favorite movie lists. It gives quite a good section of the most popular movies. It's not the AFI list, but it's not the highest grossing movies list either. I really like it.


I realize that being film buffs here, a lot of people do probably like saying, "Independence Day was crap!" Well it really wasn't. It really was enjoyable entertainment, and almost everyone agreed as the film had wonderful staying power and did very well worldwide. I would only give it 3 stars I think, but it's a fun film. IMDB voters don't think like that. They are like, "Well this film is for the masses, it gets a 3/10." LOL. Then they see some utterly stupid independent film and give it 10/10 because nobody else has seen it and therefore it's good, apparently.

Well, I liked ID4 as well. Definitely a good example of a good blockbuster movie. Like MIB as well, for instance. A bad example for instance is Armageddon.

I don't think people name independent movies coz nobody else has seen them. They just have different tastes in movies. I myself watch quite a lot of small movies too, but I watch and like big movies as well. With the latter it's mostly being entertained, while with smaller movies it touches more on an emotional level.

[Marcus Telcontar]

The IMDB list is very good IMO. It indicates fairly accuratly what the really good movies are and with such a large voting frame, it's resonably valid.

And may I say ID4 was crap. Do not mention that foul stench in my presence again

:p

[JMK]

The case can be argued that "tasteful films" and "entertaining blockbusters" don't belong to be mentioned together, nevermind rated together. You can't compare a movie like ID4 with something like Fight Club or The Green Mile because they have different ambitions. You can't look at a list and say that so and so movie is better than this movie because the IMDB says so. They're all rated on the same 10 star point system. Someone who places entertainment value above story or acting and vice-versa can't be asked to rate different types of movies on the same scale. They would give ID4 something like an 8/10 purely based on the thrill a minute factor, while a "film buff" would give it 1 star because the story was soooo done, and the acting was questionable, and the dialogue was written by a 13 year old. It's not realistic to rely on lists like that. You have too many people crtitiquing too many different things.

[JonathanLB]

"Well, I liked ID4 as well. Definitely a good example of a good blockbuster movie. Like MIB as well, for instance. A bad example for instance is Armageddon."

Yeah, exactly, I could not agree with that more. lol.

As for ID4 being a 1/10 to a film buff or whatever, I disagree with that. You just have to appreciate different films on different levels. In the case of ID4, I compare it to other big summer blockbusters and how much fun I had while seeing it. I recognize that it didn't have a very good script, a lot of the acting is pretty, well, questionable, although I like Will Smith (good screen presence). The plot has been done a million times, gee, aliens invade earth, humanity strikes back, etc. Though I thought in ID4 it was particularly well done. More well done than the movie itself, though, was the amazing marketing. That, to me, stands as probably the greatest marketing of the entire 1990s: showing the white house blow up. That was absolutely classic, and love it or hate it, that scene in the movie is a significant one in movie history. People remember that scene, like they remember first seeing the T-Rex in Jurassic Park, or like I think they will remember Yoda fighting in AOTC for instance. Those rare screen moments only come along so often.

[JMK]

Well that's the problem; most people don't think about what they want from a movie. When I saw ID4, I was expecting to be entertained and to leave with an earache. Mission accomplished, I was satisfied, and I liked the movie, and it makes a terrific DVD. But if you're the type that has to be entertained by every movie in the same way that ID4 or Jurassic Park entertained you, then you're going to be sadly disappointed. People have to keep an open mind about what type of movie they're seeing, and what drove the makers to make it in the first place. To entertain? As a social commentary? As an emotionally charged story, or something else altogether.

[dbn]

I think Attack of the Clones will be a slow successful movie, in the eyes of the media, and in the end we will see a number we all can be happy with. I still think we have a good chance of seeing AotC going pass the 500 million mark, it may not do it before the end of this month or next, but somewhere close to September.

We know that after Memorial day weekend, spider man will start showing on less screens, and Attack of the clones will be able to be seen on more screens after 3 weeks, when Lucas or Fox believes that people had a chance to see AotC in high quality theaters, and time to relax that rule to let anyone play the movie. By this it should increase the ticket sells for AotC:)))

I guess I am not worried at all, and feel we are setting on a time bomb with AotC, when more and more people are talking how good it is. We will see a marathon race to the finish, and after Spider-man sprinted out from the blocks. Soon it will start losing it's pace, and I feel AotC will jog right pass it :)

Saying this, I cannot believe how well Spider-man is doing! I thought it would make as much as the other Comic book movies, but to see it about ready to cross the 300 million mark..WOW!! I will only watch it when it comes out on dvd, because I am not that much of a Spider-man fan, snd I don't want to help it anymore at the box-office...lol!!

[JonathanLB]

Good call, DBN, you're a good Star Wars fan :)

Don't help Spidey, he's the enemy! ;)

[Sejah Haversh]

Well, one reason Spider-Man has doen so well is because it was well produced. And incredibly accurate. I mean, when Stan Lee is one of the executive producers, you know it';s going to be good.

It was so true to the original stoyline, and I loved it for that. The effects were fun, and I thought it was a well-made movie. But mainly, it followed the book.

Comic book fans love that. They hate seeing a story they know and love get warmepr, twisted,a nd made into crap by a director and producer. That didn't happen in Spider-Man. IT retained its fun and innocence, and portrayed some of the biggest events in the series (Sans Venom, that's for the sequel).

And though Star Wars is insanely popular, Spider-Man has been around for SIXTY YEARS! Imagine the fangase, evein if only slight readers, that it would have. HE was Marvel's flagship character for a logn time, until that rather pathetic guy called Wolverine stole the show. Really, he's got claws folks, yep, that's about it... Superman did well in the box office, and so did Batman, but Spider-Man was held to the original, and has been apprecitated for that. The characters were great, and so was the plot.

I see AOTC passing it in the box office eventually, but it might take some time. I've seen Spider-Man once, and AOTC twice, and will probably see Spidey again because I really liked it.

[JMK]

Spider Man's been around for 60 years? Are you sure about that? I thought he was a product of the early 60's?

[Jedieb]

Yeah, Spiderman was created by Stan Lee in the 60's. It's characters like Batman and Superman that are in their 60's. I think my point still stands about SW:ANH being the most recognizable and popular of the SW movies. There's not much more I'll say, just look at JMK's post, that covers it. I really think that AOTC and EP3 are going to be less kid friendly than ANH, ROTJ, and TPM. But you never know, the action may offset that and 9 year olds may love seeing Anakin self destruct.
"Mom, can we go see Anakin fall into that boiling pit of lava again? PLLLLEAAASSSEEE MOMMY!!!" :D

I'm curious to see how Spidey does overseas. It's a good solid self contained story. Is it just going to come across as another American comic book movie?

[Jedi Master Carr]

I suspect it won't do great or anything it may make somewhere between 300-400 which is okay but not great or anything. I say that because only two comic book films have made more than 250 million overseas (I won't count MIB because I don't see it as a comic book film) Batman and Robin and X-Men and that has been it the others have done poorly, I know Batman struggled to make 200 overseas and actually Batman and Robin was the only one to cross the 250 barrier I guess because of Arnold being in it and at the time he was very popular in Europe. That is why in terms of WW Spiderman will probably end up being 4th behind AOTC, LOTR, and HP 2 all of which will kill it overseas.

By the way I read that AOTC beat LOTR's box office record that was cool to hear maybe Marcus can fill us in on that.

[JonathanLB]

I think Spider-Man was created in 1964, though don't quote me on that. I was also always a big fan, well before I was a Star Wars fan, in fact.

I loved Spider-Man the movie, it was really tight I thought. Saw it twice... I'll buy the DVD and no doubt watch it many more times.

As for Wolverine, he has personality man!!! He also has the ability to regenerate really quickly and he's a true badass. He's the man. Yeah I like Spider-Man better, though, always have. Still, Wolverine rocks. I'd love it if when I got sick, it would be for 10 times less than the normal human. So my 24 hour bug would be over after a nap, or if I was to get incredibly, extremely sick, which would normally last a week (this has happened two times to me I think, once about 4.5 years ago, then another time perhaps 7 years ago), then instead I'd be sick less than a day and that would be it.

I haven't been really sick in ages, though, I am absolutely positive my immune system is much stronger than most people. For instance, my sister has a really weak immune system and she gets sick a lot, yet I have almost never thrown up from being sick (a few times from alcohol lately, lol, but that won't happen again...). I'm no Wolverine, though, not that tough ;)

I think what Jedieb says about Episode III is probably right. I'm not thinking that film is going to do good repeat business at all, even though I think fans are going to LOVE it and critics will be more warm to it than either TPM or AOTC (not to say they'll love it, but some might). Still, even fans like myself who have seen TPM a ton of times and now are seeing AOTC many times might find it very difficult to watch such a depressing film over and over again. It DOES depend on how Lucas handles it, though, and I admit I'd rather see him make it almost as dark as possible, even though that is like saying, "I wish he'd make a movie that won't be popular with little kids and mass audiences." Ok, true enough, but I WANT to see SUPER dark because only then does the light have true meaning!

I'm imagining, if he really wants to go all out, seeing Naboo taken over by Imperial forces (or at least forces friendly to the newfound Empire, or to Palpatine) and I am imagining seeing this beautiful planet we have come to love from two films, a planet that represents peace and prosperity, being entirely torn to shreds, fires blazing over the rooftops, buildings collapsing, civilization practically ending on this planet. That would be a striking image. Then Amidala killed right before Anakin or him holding her as she dies, something super powerful like that, and then he goes on a fit of rage and starts kicking some major butt ala Tusken Raiders. Then I see Jar Jar being killed somehow too, perhaps in a final stand on Naboo, and Mace Windu dies gallantly while defending the Jedi Council and his way of life. Yoda escapes with Obi-Wan and the two of them have some depressing conversation about how centuries of peace and justice have come crashing down around them and how the son and daughter of Anakin now hold the key to the future of the galaxy.

Man oh man, they could make that movie quite easily one of the 10 most depressing films ever made (I hear Requiem for a Dream is right up there, LOL; haven't seen it yet though).

Still, I personally think Episode III is going to rock. I just hope I don't cry in the theater, how lame would that be ;)

[Sejah Haversh]

Ack, sorry, my mistake about Spidey's age. I'm trying to recall too much old comic book crap I haven't read in five years, so, my bad. Sorry about that, folks.

And yeah, Woverine's got personality, but, still, he's, well, overused.

[jjwr]

Spiderman first appeared in 1962 in Amazing Fantasy #15. 5 Months later in 1963 the Amazing Spiderman series started. This august will be his 40th anniversary. Not quite 60 years but a lot :)

Wolverine....ahem...sucks ! :)

He's gotta be the most overused character in Marvel, he's ok but so much of his personality is forced it gets old real quick. I really don't mind him that much but I hate it when they force him down the readers throats, he has his own title but they also focus on him in the other books as well....heck the movie might as well have been called Wolverine, also starring the X-Men!

Marvel knows Wolverine is popular with its fans but the general public doesn't really know Wolverine or the X-Men so there really wasn't a need to focus the whole movie on him, sadly its what they've been doing for so long I don't think they gave it a second thought. Hopefully #2 will have a slightly more diverse feel to it. Wolverine was great in the movie and Jackman is awesome, but there are so many X-Men it would have been nice to see others get a bit more screen time.

[JMK]

Another factor is that so much of Wolverine's past is talked about, how he came about, his fragmented memories, his origins, Weapon X etc. None of the other characters have that kind of interesting back story, so it's natural that the movie exploit that and focus on Wolvie rather than say, Jean Grey.

[jjwr]

But they hardly touched the backstory, a few flashbacks was it. The majority of the X-Men they chose for the movie have pretty vanilla backgrounds, Cyclops + Jean were originals and were picked up early in life, Storm was a thief in Africa before Chuck found her....not a lot to work with. What I would have preferred is another half hour on the movie and some fleshing out of all the characters.

[Jedi Master Carr]

yeah X-Men 2 comes out next year, rumor has it than they are adding Nightcrawler, Iceman's role is going to be expanded and Angel/Arc-Angel will have some kind or role in the film. The villains are suppose to be the Sentiles. My biggest hope is they make a longer movie this time an 1 30 minutes was just way too short.

[JMK]

They did a few interesting flashbacks, but Xavier did promise to help him figure out his past and make sense of the images in his head.

I agree with JMC though, an hour and a half is not long enough to do all these great characters justice.

[Sejah Haversh]

I'm just royally steamed at the treatemtnGreen Lantern has been getting, Bombarded with BAD writers. And I'm sorry to you Cross-Gen Comic readers, but RON MARZ SUCKS AND IS A ROYAL JERK! I've met him once, have no desire to ever do so again.

And there was supposed to be a GL movie starring Mel Gibson as Hal Jordan (the classic Green Lantern) but DC, in one of their dumber movements, decided to can the project because they got the new, crappy guy.

GRAH! Why can't they do anythign right? They did Spider-Man right, and I liked it a lot. They need to do something else right!

[dbn]

Here is something to think about for the numbers game.
I was talking with a theater worker, and they were telling me that workers are not aloud to see Attack of the Clones until a week after it is released. So, who knows--maybe we see a boost this weekend from theater works as the fans:)))

[Dutchy]

Originally posted by dbn
I was talking with a theater worker, and they were telling me that workers are not aloud to see Attack of the Clones until a week after it is released. So, who knows--maybe we see a boost this weekend from theater works as the fans:)))

Yeah right, as if they are gonna pay for it. :)

[Jedieb]

Back to the whole "why ANH is the most popular" subject. Compuserve is running your typical, "What's Your Favorite" poll. Here are the early results;

My favorite Star Wars movie so far is...
Episode IV: A New Hope. 38%
Episode II: Attack of the Clones. 28%
Episode V: Empire Strikes Back. 14%
Episode I: Phantom Menace. 11%
Episode VI: Return of the Jedi. 9%

Damn, what's a 25 year old movie doing at the top of that list?

:rolleyes

Said it before, I'll say it again; ANH is always going to be first and foremost in the minds and hearts of most casual film goers.

[JMK]

And by a significant margin. It's ahead of a movie that JUST came out. Think about it, 28% is likely as high as AOTC will get in this poll, the only place it will go is down, like TPM has.

[Jedieb]

I actually expect AOTC's numbers to go up a bit in the next few days as more SW fans crash the poll. But a year or two from now I think it will do quite well in future polls and typically score a top 3 spot. I think it'll hold up better than TPM.

Here's some depressing info. This is what www.the-numbers.com is projecting for Spidey and AOTC:

Spider-Man $450,000,000
Star Wars: Attack of the Clones $400,000,000

Ye, of little faith or are they on target?

[flagg]

AOTC must not fall to Spidey. We can't let that happen, we won't let that happen and we can't let that happen! :)
It's not enough to see the film multiple times. You must also encourage others, even non fans, to see AOTC. The critics and media have tried to put regular moviegoers off the film, so it's up to us to get them to see it. I've told two co-workers already that they have to see it. You must do as much as you can, too.
Face it, AOTC needs a HUGE memorial weekend, or it's game over.

Still, at least there's still Episode III. That film will be massive, trust me :)

[BUFFJEDI]

Buff goes to VA. Finds Eb(s) and epic battle takes place. EB(s) gets distracted by hot blonde walking by, Buff breaks EB(s) fingerws for typing such Trash!!:D


Lets just hope those figures are misleading and the Memorial weekend finds a ray of HOPE:)

[JMK]

I think any way we slice it, it's going to be close. More importantly that AotC having a huge memorial day weekend, Spidey needs to drop off in a big BIG way starting right now. The more fuss that is made over Spider Man's amazing run, the more people are going to see it.

[Jedieb]

I think the Memorial Day weekend can end up helping Spidey just as much as it will AOTC, in the long run. Spidey is going to have the benefit of getting a 4th weekend boost because of Memorial Day. AOTC will get a huge boost for its second weekend, but where's the help when IT gets to weekend #4? AOTC is going to have to score some really strong holds over the next few weekends in order to overtake Spidey. I think AOTC's 3rd and4th weekends will be more critical than Memomrial Day. That's when we'll see the real legs. That's when we'll see if AOTC has started to close the gap between itself and Spidey.

[Jedi Master Carr]

I think Spiderman won't go up any, it could make another 30 million for the 3 days and maybe 4 for the whole frame, I still think it will be close but regardless Star Wars will kill overseas at least giving it the WW victory so in reality SW did win this year.

[Jedieb]

I dropped the kids off this morning and then caught an early 10:30 showing. There were only a handful of people in the theater. I'm guessing less than 20 or 30. There was another showing at 11:00AM, but I have no idea how that one was doing. I had planned on going tomorrow, but we've got relatives coming in so I may not take my son until next weekend. I want to take him to an early screening because he's bound to have to take a couple of bathroom breaks and I don't want to disturb people around me too much. So a smaller crowd suits me better. The sad thing is, today's crowd would have been perfect. I really wasn't expecting to see so little people in there. :(

[flagg]

I saw on Box Office Mojo that Spidey is actually getting more screens this weekend - it'll be on about 500 more screens than AOTC. Not good! :(

[JMK]

Well, maybe its time we stop putting so much importance on box office numbers and start enjoying the movie experience. AotC is enjoyed more than TPM almost right across the board, and it's hands down a better movie. But yet its not doing as well, I think that says alot for the value of 16 years of hype and 3 years of backlash.

[JonathanLB]

The funny part about that is it's 3 years of backlash created by about 100 people out of about 85,000,000 who saw it, LOL. Those 100 people are all of the journalists and they THINK that somehow their opinion represents a majority and if they say something is so, it must be true. Reality is, TPM is one of the most popular films ever made and people really loved it. Sure, 10% of the die-hard fans or so were pretty disappointed, but the other 90% of us had a lot of fun and we all enjoyed it. I am sure we could each think of little things we might change in any SW film, but overall I'd rather them stay as they are and I love all of the films, especially TPM.

"ANH is always going to be first and foremost in the minds and hearts of most casual film goers."

Well.... ok, but as you saw from that poll, most people do NOT consider ANH the best Star Wars film. Not even close. 62% said that one of the other Star Wars films is their favorite. Yeah, ANH has the largest vote total (strangely... fan votes wouldn't put it in the top 2 even), but it doesn't have the majority.

That is hilarious that AOTC is frickin' WHOOPING ESB. I LOVE it!!! LOL. That is just classic. I cannot wait until the ESB-lovers eventually have to admit that either AOTC or Episode III is their favorite movie. I get so sick of everyone responding, "Oh ESB is my favorite movie of the saga!" Whatever. It is a great film just like all of the rest, but it's not better than Return of the Jedi at all, it's not better than A New Hope, it's not better than TPM, and it's not better than AOTC. I can understand it being someone's favorite, just as I can any SW film, but the ESB-lovers always act like the film is CLEARLY better because of some obvious reason, yet the fact is, the films all share a similar style and tone and ESB is not at all superior. It's just one of five. It's not better, it's not worse. It's ESB. It doesn't deserve to be put on a pedestal above the other films when the other films very much deserve to be on the same level. For sentimental reasons for some people, ESB will never be dethroned. It wouldn't matter if they know in their hearts that Episode III is really more appealing to them, for instance, they would just still be like, "Nothing can beat ESB!" So be it. It's the best movie ever made, along with the other four movies ;)

[Dutchy]

Okay, confession time: how often did you reload the Showbizzdata site while typing that post? ;)

[JMK]

Jon, I know ALOT of people that were seriously let down by TPM. Sure they thought it was OK, but not up to SW standards. They saw it in the theater, and paid their $$$. But their opinion stayed the same; it's an ok movie, nothing to write home about. And I know what the polls say, an overwhelming percentage said they liked it, but I'm always very skeptical of these polls, especially the online ones because as I've mentioned before, as soon as a SW-related poll comes online, it's reported on TF.N and all of us fanboys head straight there and vote 50 times. The results are skewed to a certain extent. I also know that it made boatloads of cash. My point though, is that better than half of the people that I know were not crazy about TPM, and not one of them are journalists. ;)

I'm willing to bet money that in 10 years from now, if the movies are all re-released, TPM is the one that makes the least--by a long shot. And it won't be for any other reason except that people aren't nuts about it.

[Jedieb]

When the dust settles years from now, TPM will more than likely reside at the bottom of any SW poll, fan or otherwise. That's where it is now pretty much. I'M tired of people who won't take that to heart and take cheap shots at ESB out of jealously. It's not Empire's fault it held up better than TPM will. :p And AOTC will drop a bit in years, just watch. Although I doubt it will fall the way TPM has, but it'll come down and mirror ESB in years to come.

And if we're going to get into semantics about how to use the word 'most', how about this. ANH will always be the most popular SW movie. See, you don't need a majority for that statement to bear out, just a simple plurality. :D

[JMK]

:lol true dat Jedieb!

[Dutchy]

Right now, I'd say AOTC's gonna lose the battle against Spider-Man. I'd definitely put my euro's on the web-swinger. :)

[JMK]

I would too, but I don't have any Euros. :) And Canadian money is about as valuable as a republic credit on tatooine.

[CMJ]

Hmmm Jonathan..as much as I like the SW films ESB is CLEARLY the best to me. AOTC and ANH are close(with ROTJ and TPM a rung beneath) but not THAT close. I think Episode III might unseat it...but that's just a suspicion.

[JMK]

My sentiments exactly CMJ. As a movie, I too think ESB is still clearly the best of them. It just has so much more to offer than the others do IMO.

[CMJ]

For all Yoda's new popularity for his saber wielding..nothing can beat this....

"Size matters not. Look at me. Judge me by my size, do you? Hmm? Hmm. And well you should not. For my ally is the Force, and a powerful ally it is. Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. You must feel the Force around you; between you, me, the tree, the rock, everywhere. Yes, even between the land and the ship"

Still gives me chills every time I hear it. Yoda the philosopher. ;)

[JMK]

Lines like that just tapped into people's spirit and imagination. Seeing Yoda actually DO it is totally different. Cool, but different.

[flagg]

How packed were the cinemas today? I really think Fox and Lucasfilm could have made more of this being the 25th anniversary of Star Wars to get people into theaters.

[Dutchy]

I like Yoda's voice more and more everytime I hear: "begun this clone war has" in commercials. :)

[CMJ]

Dude Yoda has always been awesome. I just happen to like him as the philospher better(though I dug the hell out of the mind/force battle...way more so than the saber one). Call me old school. ;)

"Told you I did. Reckless is he. Now, matters are worse."

"That boy was our last hope."

"No. There is another."

[Jedieb]

I LOVE ESB, but in some ways I think ANH is the best movie because it does the best job of standing on its own. It doesn't have to set anything up (TPM), it leaves nothing unresolved (ESB), and it does not have the burden of having to tie up all the loose ends of an entire trilogy (ROTJ). AOTC is kind of like ESB in that you are left with the feeling that you are definitely in the MIDDLE of something. Anakin's fall, the fall of the Republic, the destruction of the Jedi Order. ESB is MY favorite, but anyone can walk off the street and enjoy all aspects of ANH without any prep work.

[Dutchy]

Yoda's voice kicks ass. :)

Well, MY fave of the OT is ROTJ and you know why? Coz of the ewoks. :p

[CMJ]

ESB has the most cool stuff though(meaning lines/action/battles/everything)

"Calrissian! Take the princess and the Wookie to my ship."

"You said they'd be left at the city under my supervision!"

"I am altering the deal. Pray I don't alter it any further."

The way Lando rubs his neck...classic....:)

[JMK]

Maybe Kirschner should have directed AotC? :lol

[CMJ]

Nah...I don't think so. That whole thing is a bit overdone IMHO. I mean Lucas didn't direct ROTJ either which is arguably the least of the 5 films.

[JMK]

I know, I know, I was just kidding. I was just making the point that Kirschner did such a great job with a dark script, that maybe he could have done the same. But anyway, like I said, I'm kidding, Lucas did alright. ;)

[Marcus Telcontar]

Mmm, saw Star Wars yesterday again. I have to say Christensen is excellent. Just look at the detail he puts into his own face, he really expresses himself non verbally.

HOWEVER - expect a big drop in Australia. Theatre was only 1/3 full. AOTC will not will beat Spiderman I am thinking. 400 million is not on either and I am also most certain on the first, not so on the second, but it is becoming clear.

[Champion of the Force]

HOWEVER - expect a big drop in Australia. Theatre was only 1/3 full.
Have to agree with Marcus on the Australian outlook. My brother had a chat with the local cinema manager earlier in the week and it seems as thought the SW frenzy seen when AOTC opened has already cooled off - apparently screenings have already dropped to less than 25% full. Already the cinema is more interested gearing up for Spiderman (which opens in the first week of June).

[Jedi Master Carr]

I still think AOTC will win in the WW numbers at least over Spiderman. Harry Potter 2 or TTT could beat them both I guess. I just don't see Spiderman doing that well overseas, last I heard it had just barley made 25 million and Star Wars had made almost 70 million and it took Spiderman 3 weeks to get to 25 and Star Wars did that in one weekend. Spiderman will be one of these movies that will do better in the US than overseas I think there is just very little interest in comic book film outside of the US. I think its because comic books is something that is more US pop culture like Baseball.

[CMJ]

I think AOTC opened in more markets than Spidey...we'll see though. I think AOTC will make more internationally as well, but it's still early in the game.

[Jedi Master Carr]

I just don't think there is any interest in Spiderman overseas, I know when Batman came out it was huge here and did awful overseas it didn't even make 200 overseas or maybe just barely. The only one to do well over there was the worst one only because Arnold was in it. I am not sure how well X-men did, I know it made more than 200 but am not sure beyond that.

[Dutchy]

Originally posted by Jedi Master Carr
I know when Batman came out it was huge here and did awful overseas

Yep, it was a total flop here in Holland for instance. :)

[Marcus Telcontar]

eh, I bet that TTT could win International this year. I dont see Spider Man winning Intl, plus AOTC isn't going to broach 500 million O/S.

[JMK]

You're right Marcus, TTT could very well win the year, and maybe HP2 could have an outside chance. But I'll be optimistic and say that AotC will hang in there and win the year.