TSO Consitution

[Live Wire]

Its an idea that we've kicked around for quite some time but never actually gotten anything down in writing. Well that needs to change just for the sake of order. I took the time to put some things down. This is just a rough draft and I'd like to hear thoughts on what to add or take away and such.



General Rules of Conduct:
1. You will respect the rights of all members. Flaming is unacceptable!
2. You will attempt to resolve conflicts between yourselves. If a conflict can not be resolved the council will step in to mediate.
3. The good of the group comes before personal ambitions.
4. Three violations and you can be banned from TSO. The council will vote on if a second chance is merited.
5. Treason is an automatic banning.
6. Hacking is an automatic banning.
7. You will NOT use OOC information to benefit yourself IC.
8. Admission in to locked forums will be granted only after the person has proven himself or herself loyal and deserving (2 to 3 months on average). Ask and you will AUTOMATICALLY be refused and not be reconsidered for 2 weeks.
9. TSO is a family and everyone in the group will uphold that atmosphere.
10. Accusations brought upon any member must be backed with proof or they are summarily rejected.
11. Accusations will be brought before the council and NOT in a public forum.
12. To prevent problems secret IC information needs to be revealed to at least one of the council members in an OOC manner.
13. Violation of the rules results in demotion.
14. Repeat offenders (over 3) will be banned automatically.



Admission to the Order:
1. Admission shall be granted to all reasonable requests.
2. The council will discuss admission to “controversial” people before entrance is granted.
3. The council must clear anyone having a second character in TSO.
4. Those who have been banned from TSO and create a separate character that desires to be admitted into the Order must have a ¾ majority vote in the council before admitted.
5. Participation or having a second character in another group can not be a sole reason for dismissing a request.
6. Permission may be denied to someone who is deemed by the council to be a substandard role player. (i.e. Ron Thrawn) Quality over Quantity



Apprentice Training:
1. Everyone who is deemed qualified by the council MUST take on an apprentice.
2. If at all possible the limit to the number of apprentices is three.
3. Before an apprentice can be promoted they must have been on at least two RP’s with their master at the swfan forums.
4. Training may take place on the boards, in a chat room, or an instant message medium. If the training takes place somewhere other then the boards the transcript must be posted in the appropriate forum for documentation.
5. A petition for promotion must be brought before the council and the council will vote upon it.
6. Every apprentice will be made to feel welcome at TSO to ensure a long career in the group.



Alliances:
1. The decision to ally with any group or person must have a ¾ majority vote in the council.
2. The alliance must not conflict in any way with current alliances
3. Temporary alliances may be made with a simple majority vote.
4. If an ally turns against another ally the council must have a unanimous vote on whether or not to stay out of the conflict or side with one group or another.
5. Alliances can be broken with a week’s notice from the party severing the alliance. No reason need be given.
6. Even though a group is allied with us the council must approve the sharing of “Sensitive” information.
7. Information obtained from one ally will not be shared with another ally.



Governmental Structure:
1. The council will consist of 7 members. No more, no less.
2. Simple majority will decide all votes unless otherwise stated in the guidelines.
3. The council is not above the laws stated in the TSO constitution.
4. Replacement council members will be nominated by the existing council members and then voted on by every member in TSO.
5. Violation of any of the rules can result in your removal from the council.
6. Once the constitution is finalized a 3/4 vote in the council is needed to amend it in any way.

[Jeseth Cloak]

1. You will respect the rights of all members. Flaming is unacceptable!Does this include IC rights of all members? My training is... extreme, and thus I find it at times necessary to disrespect my apprentices for their own betterment.
2. You will attempt to resolve conflicts between yourselves. If a conflict can not be resolved the council will step in to mediate.Can this include resolving conflicts through challenges?
5. Treason is an automatic banning. I don't think people should be banned for IC treason. Violations of an OOC nature such as hacking, leaking important OOC information, and abuse of Mod/Admin rights warrant this kind of action, but banning for IC reasons is basically like stopping a flood in a comic book by erasing the river. It would be completely OOC and very detrimental to the nature of RPing.
11. Accusations will be brought before the council and NOT in a public forum. I agree that issues dealing with sensitive information should not be handled in public, but issues such as treason or violation of IC rules should be handled in public, before all of TSO. Examples should be set publicly, yes?
12. To prevent problems secret IC information needs to be revealed to at least one of the council members in an OOC manner.I have some conflicting feelings about that rule... I would need to further consider it to give a proper evaluation, but I know there are things that bother me about that situation.
13. Violation of the rules results in demotion.Again, I hope this refers to violation of IC rules, not OOC rules. OOC rules should be grounds for banning, not demotion IC.
3. The council must clear anyone having a second character in TSO.
4. Those who have been banned from TSO and create a separate character that desires to be admitted into the Order must have a ¾ majority vote in the council before admitted.The first I agree with, but I don't think that anyone should be obligated to name their other characters, only the groups that they happen to be a part of... the second I only want to re-state that I hope the banning will have been merited for OOC reasons, and not IC reasons. Banishment, IC, would be a better choice... But a separate character shouldn't be subjected to special treatment unless the person behind the character has an OOC history of causing problems.
2. If at all possible the limit to the number of apprentices is three.I would hope that exceptions can be made if their is a shortage of teachers...
Alliances:
1. The decision to ally with any group or person must have a ¾ majority vote in the council.
2. The alliance must not conflict in any way with current alliances
3. Temporary alliances may be made with a simple majority vote.
4. If an ally turns against another ally the council must have a unanimous vote on whether or not to stay out of the conflict or side with one group or another.
5. Alliances can be broken with a week’s notice from the party severing the alliance. No reason need be given.
6. Even though a group is allied with us the council must approve the sharing of “Sensitive” information.
7. Information obtained from one ally will not be shared with another ally.Can't alliances just all be voted on at the moment that they are needed, or no longer needed? They're tools to be used to our advantage, so why should we have to give anyone any notice? What if we want to attack them without warning..? And, how would you ensure that others groups maintain their end of the 2 weeks notice deal anyway?
Governmental Structure:
1. The council will consist of 7 members. No more, no less.
2. Simple majority will decide all votes unless otherwise stated in the guidelines.
3. The council is not above the laws stated in the TSO constitution.
4. Replacement council members will be nominated by the existing council members and then voted on by every member in TSO.
5. Violation of any of the rules can result in your removal from the council.
6. Once the constitution is finalized a 3/4 vote in the council is needed to amend it in any way. Lastly, how often is a new council voted on?


These are a few issues I think the constitution should clearly address:

1. Council Member In-activity: Council members that are inactive (IC) for more than one month should be removed and a replacement of their choice (voted on by all of TSO) given the seat. Yes, people have problems IRL, but that is not an excuse to have everyone else’s RP plans dragged down the gutter because some people decide not to show up for weeks on end IC, therefore making 3/4 votes impossible, and stalling up important decisions and discussions.

2. Reelection of Council: There should be some kind of reelection every so often... that's just my opinion. If the council never ever changes, it can become stagnant.

Sorry if I seemed to have judged this constitution harshly, but I just want to be as direct as possible, since if these are going to be adopted as our official law, then I would rather make sure that they are perfect now...

[Live Wire]

These are NOT LAWS!!!! These are just guidelines and not written in stone.

so like the first one no flaming. That's a guideline. Flaming is not what you do in training. Flaming is the outright unprovoked attack on a person or their character. Most of these are OOC rules to be followed. Yes there are IC rights but like I said this is a guideline for a code of conduct not something meant to cover any and every contingency. This assumes the use of common sense on the part of the members.

let me give an example. the reason the consitution of The US has lasted so long is because its full of guidelines and prinicples. It doesnt cover EVERY situation or contingency and our constitution shouldnt either. It would be impossible to do so anyway!


So if a people want to resolve a conflict through a challenge it would be up to them. The guideline just simply needs to say first resolve it between yourselves and then if that doesnt work the council will step in. People are smart we dont need to tell them HOW to resolve things. IT would be up to the individual person.

There are two types of banning. IC banning and OOC banning. OOC banning would be banning someones username for some hideous OOC violation. IC banning would be like what we did to the traitors we had. They're no longer allowed here. IC they are banned from the TSO premisis. OOC they can post and chat. That would be the difference between the two. So yes treason would result in and IC banning.

Accusations need to be brought in a private forum for this reason. Not all accusations brought are going to be valid. Thats just how things are. There is no reason to upset everyone with invalid unsubstantiated accuasations. Now if they are examined and prove to be valid then they can be brought out in the open. But they should be discussed by the council first before everyone starts to put in their opinions. Its a lot less messy that way and it makes sure that the members get facts not speculation. We'd hate to have a lynch mob over something not true and then have to go calm everyone down.

As far as number 12 I know we all like our IC secrets but lets get real. this will get rid of a lot of problems if were open an honest. And the council should be trusted to keep OOC and IC seperate so there should be no reason to worry about IC actions taken. Too many secrets limits communication and I think we all know what happens when communcation doesnt take place.

Duh IC violation IC action. OOC violation OOC action. Again these are guidelines.

If you've been banned for IC or OOC reasons and want another character in TSO yes the council should look at it. An example would be Itala banned for OOC reasons (I know this ones obvious but its an example) another example would be Lady DeVille shes banned or banished however you want to put it and even though we all like her and trust here OOC I think there should be a vote anyway just as a precaution.

IF AT ALL POSSIBLE limit the number of apprentices to 3. So if its possible to limit it then we will if its not possible cause we dont have enough masters then we'll just have to have more then three wont we?

The idea of a weeks notice was just a courtesy idea. If you dont like it then we wont use it but I think the rest of the guidelines in that section should stand.

3/4 of 7 = about 5
3/4 of 6 = about 4

I think in activity shouldnt be just for a period of a month. Seeing as most people even if in active do find time to make one or two posts and if there are 6 then you just need a different majority. We've always made important decisions with a person missing when we've had too. Its honestly not that big of a deal. Now what we used to do was have council alternates so that if someone had to be gone for a period of time the alternate took over and then stepped down when the person returned. I think thats a good rule to prevent this issue. But to remove someone because say they have to be out of the country for a month is a little cold. They've earned the position and it should be there when they return.

As for periodic voting of new council members.....it sounds nice but in practice it doesnt work that well and here's why. Like right now who in TSO who isnt on the council is really qualified at this point to be on it? Sure we have people OOC'ly qualified like Charley but IC his character isnt qualified. And this is the problem we've always had when times get slow and people take breaks and vacations. Plus TSO has always been small. Sure it sounds like a nice idea but in practice its very difficult. If you follow it you end up with substandard people on the council.

Honestly a stable leadership that only changes when it needs to promotes the best group unity. periodic voting really doesnt help. It sounds nice and fair but its really not a good idea in practice. If we had 100 members who were all experiened season rpers then maybe it would be more feasable but till then no way.

[Lady Vader]

I think the guidelines stated work well, LW. And it's about time we got them in writing.

Only the other day I was approached by a TSE Council member asking me if there were any written rules or guidelines for TSO. I told them it was in the process of being taken care of.

The reason why they'd asked, and lo and behold, some are getting sick of the blatant disorganization there. They want guidelines, something to follow. So, as soon as we finalize ours, and if it alright with the Council here, I will show it to them as something to follow to make their own rules.

After all, in an alliance, you do what you can to aid the other group. This would be aiding them to better organization.

[Jeseth Cloak]

Doesn't our system right now work well, though?

[Live Wire]

this isnt changing the system really. Its more like getting what we already do down in writing. Its also a preventative measure so people can't say they didnt know what they couldnt do. ITs so we have a standard system of guidelines and it can only help.

[Jeseth Cloak]

Well, from my experience, a guideline can help, but what we have now is organized anarchy - the very nature of being a Sith... but a set of rules, such as a constitution, tends to be very resistant to change, and in most cases can be exploited and abused to suit the needs of the few, and not the needs of the many. if what we do now works, then I don't see a need for a set of rules. Right now we basically abide by the same exact rules that are present at SWFans.net, and the only differences are things such as treason, which are obvious punishable by whatever the council deems a suitable punishment.

I just don't know why it's needed... That's all. What we have now works and make us felxible and strong.

[Live Wire]

the problem is that the very thing that makes us strong makes us unstable. Thats why every sith group that has ever been in existance has had power and then struggled from problems within. Some groups last longer then others. Some groups have more power then others. But we need strength and stability if we are to ultimately survive. Thats the bottom line. Ask anyone who's been around long enough to see the cycle.

and this doesnt inhibit flexibility. Theres always room for change and the fact that these are NOT RULES but guidelines to aid in decision making and to give a general code of conduct and lay out consequences they are flexible.

[Lady Vader]

*Raises hand.*

I've lived through the cycle (with TSC). What LW said is true.

Having guiddlines doesn't hinder us, it aids us. Not to mention it keeps us stable. For the longest time I've wanted to see these damn things in writing.

[Jedah Lynch]

I can agree with these rules, if they dont fit they can be changed or altered to meet the occassion so its no real issue.

Would post more but dog tired....

[Jeseth Cloak]

...these are NOT RULES...
Well, sorry if I got that idea, but it didn't help that the very document itself said:
13. Violation of the rules results in demotion.In any event, I don't have an overall problem, I'm just worried about how this group would ultimately be affected in the long run. Itala imposed and still does impose very strict rules to keep the groups he's a part of under his thumb and rules like that caused uprisings and cramped wings. I just am of the opinion that a family needs no more of a guideline than their hearts, and up to now the biggest problem we had was LD, and that was over this group being nearly dead for such a long time. We decide on an outcome quickly and efficiently, and we needed no such guidelines.

If you all want to use them, go ahead. Just know that I will always be the Qui-Gon Jin of most any group I am in. :p

[Lady Vader]

:lol:

Fair enough, Jes. Every group needs one of those I guess (keeps with the pattern of the SW universe). :p

[Live Wire]

the LD problem was not delt with quickly or efficiently that was a whole big mess!!!

Im not out to make some kind of Itala like system. I just know that we need some kind of stabilizing guidelines and I'll amend the word rules in that one and I'll also take out the week notice thing. If there are anymore suggestions for amendments then lets mention them. But I think everything I listed was pretty reasonable.