Discussion about GJO. (GJO MEMBERS ONLY)

[Morgan Evanar]

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GJO Members only may post in this thread. Comments from outsiders, including compliments, will meet a swift end.
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Proposed policies with revisions:

a) Monthly big battle
1) Perhaps split into three seperate threads so we don't have our heads explode.
a1) Monthly may be too frequent

b) Dump less active forums for simplification
b1) UNDER CONTENTION


c1) Council Elections remain every three months. Monthly evaluation is (of course) in not on election months.

c2) Disolve the Council. Every Knight and Master gets a vote.

d) Can promotion months. If someone is ready, let people know, get it voted on.

e) Council perhaps should start to asign missions.
__Side note: this would be cool to RP.

1) Person on the mission should have just as much input. Decent amount of discussion should go into the missions so that the council and the person designated with the task has more than decent satisfaction. No one should see RPing as a chore. Its a game, for fun.

f) Make your presence known. Less lurking, more Sith wacking/rping. (deemed obvious, but I'm leaving it cause it seems to need to be said more. Or something)

g) Council has a week to vote on an issue, two if a large portion of the council is missing for various reasons (eg vaction or school finals).

h) List of people who will hopefully fight fair. (http://pub56.ezboard.com/fgjofrm1.showMessage?topicID=270.topic)
1) DEBATING

i) You see a padawan that is ready for promotion, SAY SOMETHING.

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Original First Post:
Well, it seems that there are a lot of problems here. I'm not exactly sure what they are, because I'm not partictuarly perceptive right now.

So lets lay them out. What can we do to fix it?

I think we have too many forums, for one. General Assembly and Way of the Warrior are hardly ever used.

Thats my opinion.

[ReaperFett]

I think the main prob is that in the last year or so more or less everything Ive suggested has gone through, while few others have put their own forward. While some were good (I think the system of vote months works well), but others just get forgotten or only remembered in the odd occasion.

I think one start would be if the people in here(not council, all) went through each of the current ones(I'll hunt mine down if you want, others can do the rest), and decide which to keep, modify or dump

[Marcus QDunn]

1) Participation or lack thereof.

2) Council Members who get elected and then are not seen for the the rest fo their term. It's excusable if IC gets pressing - but maybe a note saying they are gone and then maybe someone takes their place?

3) The everyone wins a prize Council system

4) GJO is reaching a point where it is getting stale. Maybe a shakeup and a hose off would be good

5) Leadership is lacking.

And finally...... how many people really care if GJO dissoved or not? I think not many and it shows. We need to care more about being Jedi and wear it with pride. It used to be being part of GJO marked you as a member of the best Jedi Order. What does it mean to you now?

[Morgan Evanar]

I care about being Jedi. I've never though that a group was the end all, and I was frustrated before, al-la Febuary.

So who is the leader?

We've had a series of personell losses that we've never really recovered from, especially Leia. She left a big gaping hole, and while Warren and Amalia have tried admirably, she simply excelled at what she did, and that gap is still there.

I've kind of avoided doing training stuff myself because I feel I'm so bad at it. Maybe its time I learned.

Maybe everyone should haul their Padawans out into SWFans and talk to someone in TSE/TSO and TBH and set something up. I've been kicking around ideas in my head for a while, and when something smacks me as half decent I'm gonna do it.

But decidedly, the people with the most complaints about us are TSE. TSE has good people even if I don't partictuarly like the leadership behind it.

I don't think a big roleplay is the solution at all. I think individuals talking to individuals is the solution. Find someone's style that doesn't chaffe yours and go for it. Drop em a IM/PM/E-Mail.

Though it would be just as nice to see the reverse happen.

[Anbira Hicchoru]

The very definition of "Greater Jedi Order" is missing. Long ago, it meant a confederation, a conglomeration of Jedi sects coming into one. Now, you can't really tell any of that unique feel. We need some kind of stratification, maybe classes or maybe just some kind of cult of personalities working with and against, to greater and lesser degrees.

I mean, its prime ground to exploit to show the fundamental differences between the pacifistic Jedi and the more martial guardians of the Order. At first I thought a new group was necessary, until I realized it could be done right here within the Order, and would play out nicely.

[Morgan Evanar]

I agree. Perhaps we should collectively decided to lay down the line.

"Hey man, pick A, B or C. You can ride the line, but its gonna be tricky as hell and you may get some frowns."

I think we need to play out of philosophical differences more, although Morgan would be one of those getting a few frowns because is kinda strange in that regard.

[ReaperFett]

1) Participation or lack thereof.
I dont see how we can do anything with this. I think the place needs to just get more efficient with what recources it has first.


2) Council Members who get elected and then are not seen for the the rest fo their term. It's excusable if IC gets pressing - but maybe a note saying they are gone and then maybe someone takes their place?
Theyre only there for 3 months. How do you decide who takes their place? Better IMO would be if you had it so you dont RELY on x% of people being here day in day out


3) The everyone wins a prize Council system
Thanks for being so kind about my idea. You just said about people dissapearing. You then get a system which in essense has more around, and you have problems with that too. Come on, you have to choose one or the other, you wont get a Utopia in the middle. Anyway, only like that currently. As I said before, the theory is it will change if more people vote, with numbers fluctuating. But hey, if youre just going to insult it, just remove it.


4) GJO is reaching a point where it is getting stale. Maybe a shakeup and a hose off would be good
Cant see what can be done aside from revote on all rules


5) Leadership is lacking.
Problem is, too many are too willing to let others lead.



I have a suggestion. Quite a changing one, will be shot down in seconds, but might as well say it.

The council has an attendance problem
The system lets all on, as you so kindly put it
there is no leadership

To me, sounds like the problem is simply THE COUNCIL. Why not try dumping it?

[Morgan Evanar]

How about we dump people who aren't around? We don't really need to quantify participation. It's obvious if you aren't around enough.

A good example is Bel. I have no idea wtf she is on the council. Sure, she's a solid roleplayer, I really like her and all, but she simply isn't around, and doesn't have a place on the council.

Maybe we should make the council elections every 2 months, and do a monthly intra council evaluation. If someone hasn't been around enough, we let em know, and the spot gets run for again.

Promotion months: If someone is ready for it, their master lets everyone know and the council votes on it. I think its delaying the inevitable inconviently. Setting promotion "months" is silly.

[ReaperFett]

Bel as a reason, her comp went kabloom

And Morg, the idea was to stop a vote being missed due to another one being there, They only had to miss ONE month, didnt hurt anyone, did it?

And yes btw, I am deliberately opposing you here. All Im doing is saying WHY I put these forward, or at least one reason. Im nothing here now, so I dont ifluence. Im just trying to help

[Anbira Hicchoru]

I agree. I'm sure the month system for promotions served a purpose at one point, but its also been a hinderance, especially for those who may have an absence of a week or so and simply miss a window. Its very frustrating, and as I can definitely attest to. Jubei spent almost a whole year as a padawan lol <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/image/emoticons_classic/smile.gif ALT=":)"> Sage and Amazonbabe aren't exactly champions of perfect attendance, no offence masters <img src=http://www.thegjo.com/forum/smileys/magtongue.gif ALT=":p">

[Anbira Hicchoru]

Btw...Bel IS back, just to let you know. Talked to her for a little bit yesterday.

[AmazonBabe]

:: Gives Anbira the "evil eye". ::

I heard that! <img src=http://www.thegjo.com/forum/smileys/magtongue.gif ALT=":p">

Actually, I am here. But as stated before, things are stale, and there just isn't any reason or need for me to post to certain things. But that sure as hell doesn't mean I don't come by and make sure the place is still standing.

I do feel though that this place could use a bit more umph. As stated earlier, we could get a RP going with one of the Sith/Dark Jedi groups. That would certainly spice life up around here.

[Hart Kenobi]

Would it be too out-of-the-question to travel to other, smaller or equal-size Jedi boards/organizations, and ask for an alliance with them? An alliance that would bring them over to this universe.

Just a thought. It doesn't take care of the bulk of the problems, but it'll be an interesting move tactically.

[Morgan Evanar]

I'm not sure if thats a sound idea. Interesting though.

[Darth Turbogeek]

maybe just some kind of cult of personalities working with and against, to greater and lesser degrees.


We used to have that.... I personally hated it cause one of those sects was the cult of DT. it also pissed off some other people too.

[Sage Hazzard]

First off, I'd just like to say, I'm here everyday now. I just don't post as Sage, because he's supposed to be punished soon. Of course, now I see that it needs to be put on hold. So, I'll start posting with Sage, making some big bangs on the battleground, and trying to take a leading role.

Okay, onto my ideas:

1) The reason for perticipation of Jedi on the Battleground being slim and overall enthusiasm being down is simple. Not many people know what a Jedi is. They feel like fighting is out of the question, unless attacked first. And they feel that their monastic in everyway. Some people take the other approach and become rebels, but they just fight in meaningless challenge posts, and are often Padawans. Then they get promoted and lose their zest.

I say we define what a Jedi is, or what our GJO rules are. Tell all the Jedi they are allowed to go and hunt the Sith down and eradicate them. Spread the word and people will start fighting and perticipating more. No one wants to play a stale Jedi who sits and meditates all day, and does not take an active role. But with the general conception of what the Sith have put forth, we are shunned when we attack!

We should put a post on SWForums.net and link it to all bar forums on all group boards. The thread would announce that no more are we going to take a backseat. That Jedi will attack Sith, and that it is acceptable. Then no Sith can call "that's not Jedi like!!!" If we want to have an enjoyable experiance here we have to bend everyone's rule of what a Jedi is.

That's just my first idea. More later. :)

[Anbira Hicchoru]

No...I don't think that should be doctrine at all. Its an issue of personal prerogative. Some people DO play their character as zealous pacifists, and don't believe in RPing like that. Its just the makeup of the character. On the converse, you don't see many in TBH out there busting anybody up. They're evil alright, but have other focuses.

We gotta keep it open for people to decide for themselves.

[Akrabbim]

Heck, my character's a bit of a zealot, win-at-all costs Jedi. He has no Dark Side tendencies, but he is more than willing to take the fight to the bad guys. I'd be quite happy to play rogue zealot man if anyone thinks it'd help.

[Organa Solo]

There is talk of bringing back large group activites to solve this problem... and there is talk of doing the exact opposite.

Why not do both? Within the large group, small bonds form. It's inevitable. It's how I and all of my colleagues elsewhere got into RPing at SWF(though to make a long story short many moved on from SWF to different boards). Group participation is needed to establish GJO as a strong and proud group once again. You keep talking about bringing back the 'Sith/Jedi large scale battle', so stop talking about it and do it!!!!

There is a very definite Padawan problem here. GJO ascension requirements are too harsh for the average RPer's tastes according to my observations, and some of the best RPers around come into power only when they aren't restricted. How did the old gang of greats get their stuff? It certainly wasn't because they were restricted until they were perfect. One could almost say GJO has gone elitist in that manner.

When there's no 'umph'... make it!

I find the pacifist/activist roles to be very useful in creating Sith trouble for everyone to end up being involved in. Don't separate them, make them clash!!!! Activists love to make the trouble, pacifists love to clean it up. Looks like a good cycle to me. Too much philosophy OOC is a bad thing, and it can kill ya, ya know <img src=http://www.thegjo.com/forum/smileys/crazya.gif ALT=":b">

[Hart Kenobi]

Why not follow the example of the Jedi Council in EpI. You can learn a lot from the movies.

Y'know how the Council would assign missions to the Jedi? Why don't we play on that. Right now the purpose of the Council is a little hazy. They do stuff when they feel like it.
How about we make being a councilmember more of a job with requirements? After all, they are "supposed" to be the most active, competent Jedi, correct?
The council, each week, should "assign"* a mission.

* assign= keeping on open dialouge with the Sith organizations and cooperating with them to create large-scale rps and battles in which mass participation is all but insured.

Let's say... one LARGE-scale rp a month. It should follow a reasonable storyline which would be discussed in.. perhaps an AIM chat.

That sounds reasonable, doesn't it? To give the council the responsibility and power it is asking for and it is capable of using successfully? And it also breeds participation.

The reason why there are no more large group-battle rps? No one is starting one that is getting the attention of the Jedi rpers.

[Morgan Evanar]

That sounds fairly reasonable, but large group RPs tend to be fiascos because its simply hard to get so many people doing the right things at the right times. Maybe if we sub-sectioned it down to three threads it could be easier to follow.

[Jedi Knight Leia Solo]

Chris: Gosh..thanks for your kind words. I know we have a good bunch and Warren has done a good job of it. I am sure with Amanda's help.

I am sorry guys, I've been away for a long time. Things got so hectic in my life, busy and all. Just NOW can I say, I feel I should be around more and intend on doing so. Looks like its going to take me awhile.

I am going to read these here threads and try to grasp what is going on here. SInce I have been out of touch

[Captain Tohmahawk]

There is a very definite Padawan problem here. GJO ascension requirements are too harsh for the average RPer's tastes according to my observations, and some of the best RPers around come into power only when they aren't restricted. How did the old gang of greats get their stuff? It certainly wasn't because they were restricted until they were perfect. One could almost say GJO has gone elitist in that manner.

When there's no 'umph'... make it!


How DID Turbogeek and Yoghurt get where they are? By getting out there and doing something. Constantly. Turbogeek never even had a Master he joined. yes, even HE was a Padawan once. They went out and fought and played and roleplayed their own way and in the case of DT, even in defiance of the Council a good deal of the time. Actually, a lot like Alpha. I tell you, obeying the Jedi code sucks for actio and roleplay.

That's the real secret. Participation. Get out there and tar some hides.


When there's no 'umph'... make it!

I say a return to the more free flowing days. Just get out there and do it, select an opponent and beat the &*^% out of them. Or write a story. Have a closed RP. MAKE A PRESENCE. When someone insults the Jedi in the B&G, take a rail gun and blow their table apart. Have fuuuuuunnnnnnnn

[Jedi Knight Leia Solo]

DT (Mark): DEFINETLY!!

I've said it before....Get yourself out there and known..Fight one on one. And CLOSE that RP if you have too! And go all for it..Beat the sith! ;)

[Captain Tohmahawk]

Oh and one more thing...



Where's the link advertising the GJO in our sigs?!?! Whatever happened to that?? To grow we need to ADVERTISE.

And yes, I'm about to resurrect the link in my sig once agian. Everyone else should do so too.

[Morgan Evanar]

Mine hasn't budged. I just don't like posting my sig much.

[Katarina Kariena]

Ok, Just beacuse I don't post every single day doesn't mean I'm NOT here. I AM here, I just don't post. I check the board every day.

As far as one on one fighting... I gave that up a while ago. Part of the reason was beacuse every time I tried to battle a Sith the Sith godmodded to the point of no return. I had to praticly godmod myself just to get one hit in.

I've tried to start RP's three times now. Two failed and one got me into the debt of a Sith, that was over a year ago, but a debt is a debt. Makes for interesting Roleplay, but that's about all I've done here or at SWFans since I joined over a year ago.

Leadership? This place has some great leaders, Leia, Yog, DT, Fett, but from my point of view I see very few opertunities for leadership among those who are willing to try. Things seem very discouraging. *shrugs* That's just my opinion. It doesn't help that when you DO suggest something you get ignored. That has happened to me several times.

I will admit, though, that Fett and Leia havn't ignored me, but then again they also know me. Several of you give me the creeps(you might or might not know who you are) and it doesn't surprise me when myself or others get ignored, but it can hinder the growth process.

[Morgan Evanar]

I'm going to give this a few more days before I introduce this to GJO as a whole and garner more input.

Last thing we would want is for the newer people to feel that they are ignored.

I want to move on this, and I'd like to move on it now, but thats simply not fair. So I'll get about 5 days worth of responses and then we move on it.

That sound good?

[Captain Tohmahawk]

Leadership? This place has some great leaders, Leia, Yog, DT, Fett, but from my point of view I see very few opertunities for leadership among those who are willing to try. Things seem very discouraging. *shrugs* That's just my opinion. It doesn't help that when you DO suggest something you get ignored. That has happened to me several times.


Let you guys in on a secret. Even the great DT got ignored at the beginning. For a few months. Hard to believe, right? Well so did Yog too. He got ignored, but both of them have the staus where they can do as they wish. Why?

Cause they both go with what they see needs to be done and just do it. That I think marks the difference between a bar rat and a Yog or a DT or even a Morgan. Just cut loose and show that your a force to be reckoned with. That's what GJO used to allow and I think it still does if your prepared to go for it.

[ReaperFett]

about Aura and her rank if she joined btw. I think that if we do start her at a higher rank, it should NOT be Master at first. To me, master is just Knight with added responsibilites and tasks performed for the GJO.

[Morgan Evanar]

Fett: She is a Jedi Knight anyway. There is no way we would give out a rank of Master so lightly. We didn't accept Amalia's master rank (er, right?)

I think a lot of the oposition is to her keeping her rank is because she's from talkcity and every other person from talkcity lost status when they moved over. Right now they are screaming "NOT FAIR."

Really, if we wanted to, we could have her be a padawan for about a month and a half and promote her.

Actually, when we are done with this, lets see what padawans are ready.

[Morgan Evanar]

New proposed policies:
a) Monthly big battle
1) Perhaps split into three seperate threads so we don't have our heads explode.
2) Shut up and do it.

b) Dump less active forums for simplification

c) Council elections are every two months instead of three.
1) Monthly evaluation: if someone isn't around enough, their council seat is up for grabs.

d) Can promotion months. If someone is ready, let people know, get it voted on.

e) Council perhaps should start to asign missions.
__Side note: this would be cool to RP.

f) Make your presence known. Less lurking, more Sith wacking/rping.

[Hart Kenobi]

A)
Good idea. I would definitely be the more practical idea to split the large rp into three threads. Perhaps each is a separate operation within the whole scheme of things.

B)
Its logical to remove them. Although we should try to make them more appealing. For instance, we suddenly got more activity in a new forum because we took away OOC rights at the B&G and placed it somewhere else.
Also, maybe the council should assign someone to the General Assembly to answer questions. Similar to how Leia greets padawans.

C)
SOunds good.

D)
Yes. I definitely think many rpers leave because they are frustrated with not being promoted, as shallow as that sounds.

E)
DEFINITELY. Like I said, that's what the Council's MAIN function should be.

F)
I've been suffering lately of "too-much-time-on-my-hands," so I might be taking Hart Kenobi out of hermitage very soon. Whether anyone likes it or not.

[ReaperFett]

a) Monthly big battle

Dont see how this would help really, they normally just degenerated into mediocraty, but there's no harm in trying. YES



b) Dump less active forums for simplification

NO. Maybe itd be better if the descriptions actually SAID WHY THEY WERE THERE. I wanted the general assembly there so that non Avaloners had a place to ask questions and such. It just got stuck in the middle, noone notices it. I think grouping them more would be better. If Way of the Warrior was staying, why is it with the (IC) Living Quarters and the (GJO debating)Avalon and General Assembly?



c) Council elections are every two months instead of three.

So, when do you propose the vote fo the council takes place? You have a month, so that people who are away on holiday etc can make it. If you want to have a one month check, thatd happen AT THE SAME TIME. So, now what? How'd you fit both in one month? NO, BUT YES TO THE ONE MONTH CHECKUP IS STAYING ON THE THREE MONTH CYCLE



d) Can promotion months. If someone is ready, let people know, get it voted on.

8/12 months for promotion months. The MAXIMUM period they have to wait is one month. If someone cant wait one month to get promotion, which they can spend improving more, then I dont know why they bother RPing. NO



e) Council perhaps should start to asign missions.
__Side note: this would be cool to RP.

YES, YET NO. RPing is for fun. Could one Jedi get stuck in some dull RP because the council said so? I think this one needs some clarification



f) Make your presence known. Less lurking, more Sith wacking/rping.

YES, OBVIOUSLY




Leadership? This place has some great leaders, Leia, Yog, DT, Fett,

A lot of my big things I set out for here are right now getting metophorically run into the ground and spat on. Great leader? Cut the bull-DO-NOT-SWEAR--DO-NOT-SWEAR--DO-NOT-SWEAR--DO-NOT-SWEAR-, I was just the one talking.

[Katarina Kariena]

A lot of my big things I set out for here are right now getting metophorically run into the ground and spat on. Great leader? Cut the bull-DO-NOT-SWEAR--DO-NOT-SWEAR--DO-NOT-SWEAR--DO-NOT-SWEAR-, I was just the one talking.
but atleast you know what you're doing.


Let you guys in on a secret. Even the great DT got ignored at the beginning. For a few months. Hard to believe, right? Well so did Yog too. He got ignored, but both of them have the staus where they can
You missed my point, but this brings up another. If DT and Yog were ignored when they first began (and I can't blame Yog for this since I hardly see him around) then they know how it feels. Ever heard the saying 'Do to others as you would have them do to you'? Does the fact that they were ignored when they first joined give them a good excuse to ignore others?

I've seen padawans who just joined a few days before be listened to more than myself. I'm not complaining(sp), I personaly don't care. I'm used to it both IC, OOC, and RL. *shrugs*


1) Monthly evaluation: if someone isn't around enough, their council seat is up for grabs.

Wasn't that the reason behind the new way of electing that Fett came up with?


d) Can promotion months. If someone is ready, let people know, get it voted on.

True, but again, the problem with some Knights getting ignored.


e) Council perhaps should start to asign missions.
__Side note: this would be cool to RP.

Yes, this would be fun to RP, My suggestion for this is get vollenters who would want to RP this. That way no one gets assigned doing something they don't want to do.


f) Make your presence known. Less lurking, more Sith wacking/rping.

Again, I'm all for this, but there are many godmodding Sith out there, and especialy if it's a padawans first fight. It gets discouraging. I've almost quit RPing here beacuse of it.


Edited your quote of no return ;) -Fett

[Morgan Evanar]

Fett: The rigid system of promotion months obviously isn't working. IT IS BROKEN. And obviously, we have a general communication problem. So whenever a Padawan is ready, they should be up for it.

Of course it should take two RL months. Less simply wouldn't be fair.

And there seems to be a common complaint. We should basically make a list of people who should be a fair fight.

And as to the Knights being ignored, I haven't seen any promotion posts in quite some time. If someone is ready, post it! Jeebus. Get the word out. AIM is not the medium. Post it in Avalon.

"Promotion: Name Here."

Council votes on it. It has a week to be voted on, which should give plenty of time.

Or maybe we should can the council completely.

Every Knight and Master has a say.

I'll adress your rebutals when I quit thinking how thickskullled you are being Fett.

[Captain Tohmahawk]

I'm not bothering with quotes, so here we go


a) Monthly big battle
1) Perhaps split into three seperate threads so we don't have our heads explode.
2) Shut up and do it.


GO FOR IT


b) Dump less active forums for simplification

YES


c) Council elections are every two months instead of three.
1) Monthly evaluation: if someone isn't around enough, their council seat is up for grabs.

HELL YES.

d) Can promotion months. If someone is ready, let people know, get it voted on.

YES YES YES YES

e) Council perhaps should start to asign missions.
__Side note: this would be cool to RP.

YES. Look out for Marcus to be in on something like this

f) Make your presence known. Less lurking, more Sith wacking/rping

YES.

[Morgan Evanar]

Also: Apparently, theres a little confusion with the checkup thingy regarding council. Its any month there isn't a council election.

[Anbira Hicchoru]

I am emphatically for all the things suggested

[Morgan Evanar]

Uhhh uhhhhhhhhhh.

Charley, is that to the stuff I listed.

[Anbira Hicchoru]

yes

[Captain Tohmahawk]

I might point out one thing.... Promotion to Master has never been based on monthly timetables and it's not going to be. It's strictly when someone is ready in the minds of senior Jedi of GJO. At that point, Marcus tests them.

The testing thin is not going to change, but i do have an idea about putting up Knights for testing that might work. Just want to speak to Leia and Yog first.

[Nichos Marr]

O_O

I'm really, really, really sorry for being busy the past few days. It seems that this thread just magically appeared and slipped my vision totally. >_<

As for my votes on the newly proposed policies:

A) YES, although each month? Why not every two months or so? I doubt some will be finished by the end of the month.

B) NO, Won't really do anything other then make the board look neater right? It just doesn't seem right to me.

C) NO, Leave it to three. Two is a small gap, methinks.

D) DOUBLE YES!, Best policy I've heard yet!

E) YES, Great idea.

F) YES, Can one really vote on this? I think people should heed this advice though. It's not enough to say "I'm here, but I just don't post." Post, no matter how stupid your ideas sound.

If it's okay with people (particularly Masters), I might spontaneously pop up in training threads or at the bar as Jedi Order Holocron. If that's not okay, say here and I'll scrap the idea. Just reminds me of the good ol' books and comics when Luke's holocron used to do that =)

[Captain Tohmahawk]

Go for it Nichos. It's something I used to do and it worked.

[Organa Solo]

All of the proposed policies are all well and good IMHO except for the two month Council limit, I say no no and no. Two is just too short.


An easy solution to the Padawan in the BG being more trouble than help thing is to not simply let them loose and expect them to magically stay well within all of your sometimes unspoken requirements, especially with them being inexperienced as to everyone else in there who is used to doing their usual routine. Either group them so they can support each other or make them follow their Master into some duel RP with one of the trusted and stronger characters as mentioned previously by Morgan before they are let loose to do their own thing, of which often is messed up by cluelessness and a feeling of being overwhelmed by the size and audacity of the BG environment. Either way, a more experienced Jedi to model after by actually working with the superior in action, and being able to fall back on for support when in trouble helps greatly, usually, in my experiences.

[Morgan Evanar]

^Damn good points.

I'll give ye olde list an update at midnight.

[Morgan Evanar]

New proposed policies with revisions:

a) Monthly big battle
1) Perhaps split into three seperate threads so we don't have our heads explode.
a1) Monthly may be too frequent

b) Dump less active forums for simplification
b1) UNDER CONTENTION


c1) Council Elections remain every three months. Monthly evaluation is (of course) in not on election months.

c2) Disolve the Council. Every Knight and Master gets a vote.

d) Can promotion months. If someone is ready, let people know, get it voted on.

e) Council perhaps should start to asign missions.
__Side note: this would be cool to RP.

1) Person on the mission should have just as much input. Decent amount of discussion should go into the missions so that the council and the person designated with the task has more than decent satisfaction. No one should see RPing as a chore. Its a game, for fun.

f) Make your presence known. Less lurking, more Sith wacking/rping. (deemed obvimore. Or something)

NEW:ous, but I'm leaving it cause it seems to need to be said
g) Council has a week to vote on an issue, two if a large portion of the council is missing for various reasons (eg vaction or school finals).

h) List of hopefully good and fair RPers that Padawans can get a fair fight from. Would be at the top of the Jedi Academy. (http://pub56.ezboard.com/fgjofrm1.showMessage?topicID=270.topic)

i) You see a padawan that is ready for promotion, SAY SOMETHING.

[AmazonBabe]

So far so good. I like the monthly big battle stuff. Especially about splitting it up into three threads or so instead of having one big massive one. I don't know how some feel, but when I see a thread that's got like 40 or 60 replies, I get discouraged not wanting to read all that, and then it keeps me from posting. This way it may lessen the load of posts per thread and won't look like such a daunting task to catch up in a RP or perhaps join one half way.

[Sage Hazzard]

I like all the ideas. :)

A quick note about Vice. He's always ready to fight and isn't even an apprentice. He has no Master, and no group. So, for any Padawan, he's a fair fight.

[Morgan Evanar]

Sage: Cool.

Ok... I'd like to post this in Arcan and get every GJO member's say. Course, it will be prefaced that if you aren't in GJO, I will nuke your post with the quickness, even if it is a compliment.

[Darth Turbogeek]

Yep, both good

[Akrabbim]

I agree to nearly all of the above comments. I think that two month seats is a bit short, seeing as we have one month of voting. Half the year would be a sort of lame duck period.

As for worrying about god-moders, I say we list a group of Masters or whatever who have fight moderating priveledges. Then, have a place that a person can go to protest unfair rps. That way, there's a list of people who know they're acceptable to be moderators, and there's always someone ready to moderate.

The other ideas, as previously mentioned, are great.

[Satine Capashen]

Sorry about not posting sooner, this thread musta slipped my vision too. I like the ideas in here, and you guys have my full backing (whatever that is. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/image/emoticons_classic/smile.gif ALT=":)"> )

[Morgan Evanar]

K, tommorow I'm posting it in Arcan... objections?

[Darth Turbogeek]

Go for it

[Master Yoghurt]

My appologies for not replying to this thread sooner. Time for me to include some input..


* Perhaps split into three seperate threads so we don't have our heads explode.
Yes, it would be a good idea starting up some new threads targetting the individual subjects. These would be some good topics:
* The future of the Council/voting procedures
* How to turn the Jedi more active
* Jedi Academy, recruiting & training Padawans, promotions etc


"Monthly big battle"
Yes, a big battle or roleplay where every member is encouraged to join in. These should happen at some frequency.

I also think some Jedi (me included) need to take initiative on their own to start roleplays to prevent evil. Think of RP opportunities where you help a greater cause. Then make it open for Jedi to jump in and help out.


Disolve the Council. Every Knight and Master gets a vote

Actually, I have to confess, it is somewhat troubling how much time and energy is spent on Council elections and various bureaucratic procedures that could just as well be spent on disussing topics like this one or roleplays. An open democracy where the Knights or Masters present have a say in important matters might be more effective and allow for some more creative input. At least, it is worth some concideration.


Can promotion months. If someone is ready, let people know, get it voted on

Yes. When someone is ready, he/she is ready.



Council perhaps should start to asign missions.
__Side note: this would be cool to RP.

Person on the mission should have just as much input. Decent amount of discussion should go into the missions so that the council and the person designated with the task has more than decent satisfaction. No one should see RPing as a chore. Its a game, for fun.

Thumbs up from me. Missions seem like a good idea. Anything to get things moving. We could designate primary and secondary targets etc, just like a briefing.


Make your presence known. Less lurking, more Sith wacking/rping. (deemed obvious, but I'm leaving it cause it seems to need to be said more. Or something)

Absolutely. And it needs to be said over and over again.


Council has a week to vote on an issue, two if a large portion of the council is missing for various reasons (eg vaction or school finals).

Yes. One week for votes (wether we keep Council or not), should be sufficient. This should keep decisions going through quickly.


You see a padawan that is ready for promotion, SAY SOMETHING.

Definitely

[Jehova Eaven]

Chris, don't nuke my post. I am a member of GJO with Nobuo Hyde, just don't feel like changing accounts.

I am just a padawan here at present, but hear me out. I happen to agree with the 3 month Council term, the one month check up is good. Though I have a question. Who would do the checking up?

A big RP would be nice. I play multiple charcters, some good, some evil. It would be be great to have them all duke it out over some great intergalactic scheme.

I believe that the promotions shuold be done like it is done in TSO or maybe TSE (I don't know how TSE does it). If the person is ready, then say it and have the council vote on it.

I am all for Sith whacking. I don't really play with Nobuo though because he has like no training at all so I'd be defenseless.

Yeah, I agree with the voting plan on the issues.

BTW, I would be happy to RP with some of the padawans and knights here. Jehova says bring it on. <img src=http://www.thegjo.com/forum/smileys/biglaugh.gif ALT=":D">

Sorry if this post seems all jumbled and makes little sense, I kinda just woke up.

[Navaria Tarkin]

Montly battle is defiantly good. Everyone gets itchy now and then for something to happen. The only problem I see is coordinating with another group or finding something that everyone would be interested in. big huge brawls are fun...but if they are to be every month... that will eventually loose favor and fun I would think.

Disolving the council is tough. As Yog said.... everyone having a voice and a vote would be great because people will be there and you dont have to wait on the Council for things. But having a central leadership of people that you trust can run things and put it on the line when OOC and IC crap occur has it uses.

Be tough to decide either way.

As for the Council voting, a week should be enough time after all discussions and issues have been brought forward.

Promotions

Just do it when it's time =)

I think that when people have ideas for RPs in general.... perhaps it should be brought forth so that everyone knows? That way input and people can collectively talk about the plot etc... feel they a part of things.

[verse dawnstrider]

Ok, I will put my input in as well. I know I am at the point where am I trying to earn back trust and everything. Here is what I think being that I have been with GJo for a long time, and RPing on these boards for a while as well.

A) The Battle thing seems good to me. I am always ready for a good fight. I don't do the 'Challenge to a Sith' stuff. I fight for RP stuff. Not pointless battles to see who is the biggest badass. After my fight with Darh Havok I saw that it was no Jedi-like to do that.

B) I like that Idea. The Jedi Bio's need to stay though. I like reading them. It lets other know about your char.

C) I say kill the council. I was on it, so this is not a 'If i can't be on it, no one can!' thing. I think everyone should have a vote. Only Knights and Masters though. I feel the GJo is one big council. Everyone has some say in things most of the time.

D) Promotions should be left up to the Master. Some people need to be a padawan for a long time. I feel there should be a minimal requirement though. If the master feels like somethign is stoping the person from acting like a Jedi, then listen to the Master. If it is a good reason then let the padawan be a padawan. If it is a stupid reason like "spends to much time in the bar" then vote and promote. a minimal list could be Things like this..
1)Active member for X months
2)Been in X RP's with Master and other Jedi. (This is more for training. the training center is cool, but I think hands on in the world is better)

E) I like this ALOT. This is a great way to increase Jedi avtivity on board and have a great time RPing. Even if we make other groups and Chars to use in the missions. Ambassitors (s/p) and stuff would be fun. I always wanted to be an Ambissitor. What is the point of one though if there are no one to talk to.

F) I agree. I say talk to the TSE and other Sith Groups and set up RP's for the Jedi to stop. The Sith can win sometimes as well to keep it fair.

G) I agree. That way things move faster. If anyone can vote, still put time limit on.

H)I can not comment. I speak for everyone that has no access to the Temple. Then again. I may be the only one without access. but still, I can't see the list. I think a list is a good idea. Some people (I will not name anyone) fights like a God. I remeber a certain person (will not name a name) throwing DT, I belive it was him, through a mountain. i need a can of WTF for that one. It can speak for itself though.

I) I agree, but talk to the Master. He/she may see something others do not. the Master should tell why though. I see some padawans in the bar and rooms, just worring and being plain pathetic. When I ask what is wrong, they say 'setting up a RP' and try to play it off when they see the fact that they are not acting like a Jedi should. If it is for a RP, just do the damn thing. I may be the only one to notices @#%$ like this though.

I know this post was long and few will read it, but for those that do, that is just what I think. If you can show me other ways t do things I have not seen, tell me. I am willing to compromise what I think to make the game better for all.

[Vega Van Derveld]

Just a little note on the Padawans looking for "fair" fights:

www.eccentrix.com/gaming/sithempire/ (http://www.eccentrix.com/gaming/sithempire/) - There are contact lists on there which hold email addresses, IM tags, etc. Most of the members have some form of IM - if not they can always be reached through a PM at SWfans or through there EzBoard profile. If you can't find a specific member this way, the TSE OOC forum ( pub59.ezboard.com/fthesempirefrm14 (http://pub59.ezboard.com/fthesempirefrm14) ) could be used to locate them.

There are many many of the Disciples waiting for a fight with a real Jedi instead of the Sim, and for the most a training thread can easily be located in the Training Grounds forum so you can see whether or not you feel as though they 'god mode' or not.

Don't know whether all that was useful or not, but I just thought I'd post it anyway. Thought it might be helpful to some of the padawans.

[Morgan Evanar]

^too useful to nuke.

Thank you, I'll be sure to add that if we decide to use the list.

[Hart Kenobi]

It looks to me like there's been a good deal of helpful discussion here, and that the terms agreed upon so far should be implemented as soon as possible. Now even, if anyone has the time. Y'know, before people forget this thread.

[verse dawnstrider]

I still can't see the fair fighters list. Can someone e-mail it to me?

[Hart Kenobi]

I think it'll eventually be listed in the Jedi Academy forum by Morgan once it's all checked over.

[Morgan Evanar]

There has been some outcry on the subject, even though it wasn't written here. Its certainly still under contention. It may or may not ever see the light of day.

However, I will post Vega's links stickied at the top of the academy.

[Xazor]

I think the thing about how "if you see a good padawan who needs to be promoted, you should say something!" is a great idea. There are a lot of great padawans who have been training for a long time that deserve to be promoted. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/image/emoticons_classic/smile.gif ALT=":)"> I think that a monthly brawl would be a little much.......how about every two months?? Yeah, that fair fighter list thing won't show up for me either.........I fight fair also, if you wanted to know. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/image/emoticons_classic/smile.gif ALT=":)"> Hehehe.........that's all I have to say right now.......I can't really put in my imput on the rest, such as the council stuff.......but I'll get there with time! <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/image/emoticons_classic/smile.gif ALT=":)">

[Estelle Russard]

I know Im one of the least-posting Jedi here, but the reason for that partially is because I dont really know what to do.

I think all the things discussed and suggested are good ideas (tho I dont have a clue about the council stuff either, or the timeframes you have here for promotion).

*I really like the Big RP idea

*I like the council "assigning" missions. This could be such a creative thing - great idea.

*I like the suggestion that those who are training ppl, need to instigate threads (look at TSE for example - they have training threads up the yingyang). <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/image/emoticons_classic/smile.gif ALT=":)">
I think tho the problem here is that there seems a disproportianate amount of new peeps to older peeps (I may be wrong on this, but this is how it appears to me). Too many indians and not enough cheifs. It takes time committment to train ppl, and not everyone can do that. So dont know what would help this.


I notice alot of new nics here at this board, but I think it was LD that did the post about who here had RP'd at fans - and it was quite a difference. I think Masters and those training DO need to take their padawans (and anyone else who might want to be involved)to SWForums and start threads with them. It is very confidence building for a poster to be asked to be involved in a thread. I dont think many players will turn it the chance down, especially with the calibre of RPers some of the seasoned players are here. I think you will find Sithies etc joining in and surely there are enough common sense ppl around to make it a good experience. There is an obvious awareness at SWForums for a need for more jedi interaction and I think now is the perfect time to use that to advantage.

For ppl who are completely new, it is very inhibiting when you are unsure of what a jedi is, combined with being new to SWFans, so to have someone lead the way who is familiar with other players and how things go, will be a huge help.

[Darth Turbogeek]

"I still can't see the fair fighters list. Can someone e-mail it to me? "



IT Wont surface again. I've deleted all traces of it cause it is causing too much @#%$.

[Saarreeaa Meorrrei]

I notice alot of new nics here at this board, but I think it was LD that did the post about who here had RP'd at fans - and it was quite a difference. I think Masters and those training DO need to take their padawans (and anyone else who might want to be involved)to SWForums and start threads with them. It is very confidence building for a poster to be asked to be involved in a thread. I dont think many players will turn it the chance down, especially with the calibre of RPers some of the seasoned players are here. I think you will find Sithies etc joining in and surely there are enough common sense ppl around to make it a good experience. There is an obvious awareness at SWForums for a need for more jedi interaction and I think now is the perfect time to use that to advantage.

I could not agree more. I still think that masters should be taking their padawans around EVERYwhere with them. When I first went to the BG at swfans I was afraid of EVERYTHING! I thought when I started a thread I'd get killed right away..it was a real confidence boost to be there alongside my master who knew all about everyone and everything. New RPers need the help.

[Anbira Hicchoru]

Wait a minute....Saa's not a Jedi!

(picks up the kitten by the tail)

[verse dawnstrider]

::grimices as DT uses such lanuage.::

"I just wanted to look at it. Nothing bad. I saw it talked about over and over in the thread, so I wanted to see what everyone was talking about."

[Elieen Cross]

is thread still active?


If it is, I wish to comment, because I know what the Jedi were like once and what they had.

Two words - Commitment and Passion.

When I first roleplayed, these were the two defining items that stood the Jedi out. The leaders could have been described as rabid with their passion for the Jedi and it showed. The reason Jedi like Turbogeek and Boricua are regarded are simply because of those two items.

If the Jedi do not have either of those two items, them it will show painfully. And I think it is. I do not see the leadership that either had and I certainly do not see the rallying of Jedi anymore.

If you do not have commitment and passion, then the Jedi will only ever be a shadow of what it could be and all this talk will be wasted.

[Sanis Prent]

Just a hint...It wasn't all just them <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/image/emoticons_classic/smile.gif ALT=":)">

[Aura Allei]

Hey all, I thought I would hang low for a while. I was Jedi Knight Aura on the SW Forums. I have been feeling out the new board and all.. After rubbing my eyes, going through all 4 pages, I think there are valid debatable issues in here.

First off, I am from the vile Rim known as 'Talk City', and agree the majority do not go by the rpg rules on the boards. As you see, I am a Padawan now, having gone through an rp with Jedah Lynch to fit it into a storyline Aura lost her memory. I am of the minority who does accept the rules of rank ascention, among other things.

I did learn detailed rpg skills in talkcity, including sabers, as I trained with 2 singles, and a little hand to hand. I feel it makes for a more realistic and interesting post if one describes in detail how they defend and strike, as it takes practiced visualization skills, that I hope to instill into my future padwawans. I see some in the Forums and here, not all, do not detail out how they block. It is up to anyone how they counter, I just think its more cool to post how it is executed. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/image/emoticons_classic/smile.gif ALT=":)">

The once a month battle idea is a great idea. I agree with Navaria, a large brawl is quite fun. Sage, Leia, and some others mentioned we should attack the Sith. I have found the statement..

.."You are acting un-Jedi like."..

..to be most annoying, and 95% of the time a Sith said it to me in TC. Sometimes to fight for justice, we must take the initiative in a confrontation.

I also agree with Anbira, there are divided Jedi whom seek a passive venture in the GJO, and those seeking an all out blitzkrieg with the darksiders. It would be in character to attack a Sith, as they feed on violence, hate, and anger. The action being an attempt to thwart future attacks against the Jedi or the innocent, and just to increase rpg participation. There wouldnt be any killing because of the rules, so no Jedi risks the eternal stain on his/her soul.
Also, if some players in the Forums witnessed more of these battles/storylines, with Jedi vs. Sith, we may get more attention to the GJO, hence more recruits, and the expansion of the group. Just some ideas.. As for the council, every group needs experienced leadership, so I vote it stays. That is if Padawans can vote lol.

Hey Morgan, how do I get a bunny line under my pic like yours? I have 3 house trained rabbits..Beware the bunny trainer lol? <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/image/emoticons_classic/smile.gif ALT=":)">

[Morgan Evanar]

In in reference to a comic strip that both DT and I read. www.sluggy.net

I'll see. =]