About Gavin13 and other idiots

[Hart Kenobi]

It's obvious there's something wrong with the kid, but since I'm not hired to be the kid's mom, I really don't care what his personal problems are. He's looking for a new master since I refuse to even talk to the little brat anymore.
(look at his training thread at the Academy)

He's probably not the worst ever (though I wouldn't bet), but I'm not gonna waste my time with him, and I suggest the rest of you let him sweat it out for a little while before you agree to be his master. He needs to take a breather.

Personally, I think he and some others like JediKnightAL and such should just be discarded. We need some standards here. Mace Windu turned people away, and I think if we want to stay a respectable force, we simply get rid of these guys. We NEED a standard or else we become a joke like the lower ranks of the Sith groups have become.

[Sage Hazzard]

I agrre 100%. We need to make sure they have what it takes, not just skill. A Jedi is more mental then most people believe. You have to follow the code strictly, or else have a high respect, knowledge, and following of the fundamentals of it.

[Jedi Knight Leia Solo]

*sigh* Gaven 13, Jedi Knight AL and Dragon Dlayer have been problems. I have spoken to them on AIM and have warned them all. That is why in Fett's Thread I mentioned that. They "YES LEIA" me to death and they behave for like a day at best..if at all, then they are back to being brats.

*sigh* I do not like saying that. But I am tired of sounding like their mother too. There are quite immature and at times disrespectful.

I do suggest standards. I also firmly believe..that we need a type of disciplinary standard too. Meaning if they mess up how it is dealt with, warnings and such and if they continue ..they are let go of GJO.

I really mean that. Sorry if I sound harsh. But I find this rather disturbing and I don't like feeling like a babysitter.

*sigh* I think I have said enough. That is my dollars worth.

[Hart Kenobi]

There are two courses of action:
1) Ignore them
2) Name me the "GJO Hated Newbie Remover" and send me out to make their lives a living Hell in the B&G until they quit rping.

[ReaperFett]

OK, has anyone tried to talk to them? Crazy idea, but rather than bad mouthing them, couldnt you help them?

Oh yeah, I forgot, we are all perfect RPers, who never started out. EVERYONE has to start some time. When I started this sort of thing, I annoyed people. But I got better. And that was because people helped, not badmouthed.

Basically, by ignoring them, you are just making yourself look arrogant, and worse than a new person 1000% times over. I despise people who yell newbie. And this is all this is. All this thread says to me is 'Im perfect, and they arent, evict them!'. Over my dead body.

And I was talking to BBN about all this yesterday, and said about old threads. He then went and found one of his first training ones. To say it was bad was an understatement. Now, Id say he is one of the best Sith around

[ReaperFett]

oh, and I read the training thread btw. Yes, he was wrong, but is you saying he lives in a trailer right? No? Thought not. In fact, for a master to insult the place someone lives, thats low. That really is low


Just so the admins keep an eye out btw, AL is on a warning for comments he made. Just watch him, just in case

[Jedi Knight Leia Solo]

Fett...I have spoken to Gaven on several occassions on AIM nicely. Without yelling and such. Being calm and logical, I have reasoned with him. This is my point...I get "YES Leia I won't do that" THEN..what happens...they forget what I have spoken to them about and they do it again.

Actually want to know the truth...I ALWAYS..speak to RPers, I understand they are newbies and might need some guidance. I am not hard on them at all.

The ones that have had problems, Dragon, AL, Gaven (just like Stone) I would ask to talk to them on AIM and we talk it out. I DONT GO BEATING THEM DOWN. Fett...I do this several times and have several conversations..BUT..its a temporary fix and then they go off with their cocky little attitudes and do again and again and again.

Thats' why there are rules needed. I think a 3 strike rule or something is needed.

Remember....Stone and Blade, do you know I have dealt with them to in the same manor. Yes..it is true. I always have long calm reasoning discussions. BUT I CANNOT make them change if they are NOT willing too. Like I said they listen at first and understand,but eventually end up doing what they want to do.

Very frustrating. I am probably ONE of the few that ALWAYS has to deal with this too. I try to stop and correct the problems. But they still persist.

I don't enjoy it at times. But I most CERTAINLY NEVER ignore the problems. I would really like to see some rules that we can enforce.

[Hart Kenobi]

Fett, your defense of some of these guys is just getting tiring. These guys don't deserve it. It's not any of our responsibilities to teach them how to act in society and the real world. That's what parents are for. Don't waste any of your sympathy for them. I've had to listen to that guy for months about EVERYTHING. He has never once shown the skills or the patience to even try to be reasonable, so if you want to talk about right and wrong, just keep it away from me. I don't run a daycare center for 24-hour smart-aleck teenagers.

Does he deserve to be a knight? NO. Does he deserve to even be a padawan? NO. It's as simple as that.

Dissing him is a bad thing? Don't care. What I think you've been forgetting is that we all come here to have fun first, and be Jedi second. I'm not going to spend my extra time helping him out if I don't feel it's worth it.

[TUJK]

Oy...

Now, suppose i should have some things to say... although, keep in mind that my mindset is quite differnt than most.

Of people who try to RP Jedi, there's several types:

Sith Bait: The jerks, the idiots, the poor RPers that thinks "Wow! Jedi! I wanna be one". They'll never progress to far without a lot of guidance, and often, you need to smack them into line so they understand what they're doing, and how they should act. Sometimes they get past this point, and become true contributers.

The Rank Grabbers: They come, they like the idea, but they don't like the process of learning, and would rather have you say "Here's a saber, here's a robe, you're a jedi knight" They're a bit below to just above average... thier fun tends to be in being a jedi.

Average RPer turned Jedi: The tale, the journy... rank is simply a detail. These people are the most common... they might like rank as a symbol of achevement, but, they like the game and the people.

The Teachers and professional students: Often the average RPer who thinks a little more, putting more detail into the force than most do, explaining it. Even when playing a student, they can teach the teacher many things. Eventually these students, through desire or pushing, decide to teach.

------------

Now how is this relevent? Well, basically To me these classifications are automatic, I tend not to associsate with the first 2 catagories much, unless I've been asked to help deal with them,... or I'm bored and want to heckle somebody.

See value in the ones you want to take on as students... don't need to be a baby sitter... harmony between teacher and student should be there to teach... or learn.

[Liam Jinn]

Wait, why is Gavin13 getting yelled at and Hart is not? Hart was out of line in that thread too...

[Hart Kenobi]

IM conversations. Look, we're doing a lot to train them and sacrificing a lot of time. If he doesn't feel like respecting me at all, I'm not staying there. How can I prove that I'm not like that all the time? I have 4 or 5 other padawans that give me no problem and I give them none. True, I can just not train them and ignore them like the few of you who are complaining about my actions and don't understand enough to have any solid opinion, but I actually put effort into it.

It's amazing how some of you are like "hey, it's not fair." I don't have to patience to deal with guys like that, so I won't. I admit, I'm not the golden child. Everyone has their limits and he repeatedly crossed mine. I don't even understand why I have to justify myself. Even if I simply did not feel that our master-padawan relationship was working out, it should be recognized. This place is for fun, no one should be forced into training guys like that. I've been told by Sith that he embarrasses our order and when I try to make him change, I get a bagful of "whatever"'s and "yeah right"'s. And that's cool, but after a few months of it, I have the right to strangle him.

And lastly, I didn't write this thread for everyone to go beserk on him. I just want to establish much-needed standards in our recruits. Loose standards, obviously, but even those some of these guys couldn't pass.

Seriously, some of you sensitivity hypocrisy is getting old.

This is the last straw: pub56.ezboard.com/fgjofrm3.showMessage?topicID=75.topic (http://pub56.ezboard.com/fgjofrm3.showMessage?topicID=75.topic)

[Darth Turbogeek]

As I understand this, it is not about one thread. It's about a general attitude, correct Hart?

Look, I dont profess to know Gaven but I do know he a right pest at times on AIM. I see Hart's point. If you have tried and tried and tried and there is no changing... what can you do?

Stone was my Padawan, wasn't he? And yes, I tried - and failed - there. Sometimes you just have to admit you cant train em or they dont belong. I agree, we need standards, and isnt that what Hart is saying in the end????

[Hart Kenobi]

Yes, I'm was just trying to bring up that point.

But NOW I am trying to get some sorta action done to this guy.
pub56.ezboard.com/fgjofrm3.showMessage?topicID=75.topic (http://pub56.ezboard.com/fgjofrm3.showMessage?topicID=75.topic)
That's just unacceptable. He doesn't deserve a warning. He's gotten hundreds. How come we never back our warnings up? I don't mind his continuous torture of me now with going around responding to some of my posts with obscenities- that I can handle because I don't care- but it's him embarrassing us in the eyes of the Sith. (and do you know how hard it is to actually make yourself look bad in front of some of those characters?)
I'm sure some of you understand how it's like for Sith to IM you and use the argument, "but Gavin is your padawan" as a diss.

This isn't a rant. I'm perfectly serious. Fett brought along the idea of re-testing them. I now change my vote to that.

Some responses are welcome, because we either decide to do nothing, or we resolve to act. I don't like the idea of waiting until we forget about it.

[Warren Azalin]

I defiantly think something has to be done about Gaven and the others like him, I have started taking action with Dragon and talking to him since he is one of my padawans but hopefully something can be done about their stupidity.

[Darth Turbogeek]

Are you saying that's typical of Gaven? That is bad. I think if that is typical, Hart's concerns are genuine. I personally dont give a @#%$ what the Sith say, but when a Padawan continues to act in an inproper manner after being talked to that is wrong.


I would like to do something, if that is okay with you Hart.

[Anakis Moreven]

Murmf.

Gaven took advantage of my tired self.
Guess who is his new master?
Me.

I might need some help with this guy, and I might follow Hart and boot him if he gets too much trouble.