One. Two. Buckle my shoe.

[Hart Kenobi]

What bothers me the most about how this universe is functioning is that we are straying from FACTS about the Jedi. As appealing as a "lone wolf" Jedi is, it is not the Jedi way. They travel in twos, Master and padawan.

Thus, I suggest that each Master and Knight to create another Jedi character to be their own padawan. This has many advantages.

1) You don't have to waste time training your own padawan if you don't want to.
2) If you ever do an rp together as a Master-Padawan team, it is impossible for one to be present without the other. So then you can go ahead and actually have the rp instead of waiting forever.
3) You always know what the other character is going to do, because you ARE the other character.
4) You don't have to make an excuse to them if you take a leave of absence.

And, most importantly, it gives the impression of the Jedi having a larger number. In rp situations, it potentially means up to double the amount of fighters on our side. And the great part is, YOU NEVER HAVE TO PLAY THE CHARACTER OUTSIDE OF A BATTLE OR RP.

Not also to mention.... Jedi fight with padawans. Let's stick to the Star Wars universe.

Of course, you don't HAVE to do this. I, personally, have been making a couple of closed threads in a few places for Hart (although retired and living as a hermit) to gain a padawan that I will play as well.

Now, you will naturally have the other padawans (who are not you) to train. I'm just suggesting this as another step.

Masters and padawans who can read each other's minds is indeed a DEADLY combination. If anything, it will make the GJO unbelievably more powerful.

Of course, I think if anyone decides to do this, that we should keep this tactic from the Sith as long as possible.

[Jubei SaDherat Vader]

I like it

[ReaperFett]

Sounds good, but were I you Id next time give a title that will get people to read. If you want the council to vote something, you put it in capitals. If you want people to read, put that. It does work

[Hart Kenobi]

Well, it probably shouldn't be voted on by the Council. I mean, it's an optional thing for each knight or master. It wouldn't be fair to make it some sorta requirement.

Hmmmm, I'll try to think up a better name.

[ReaperFett]

That works! <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/image/emoticons_classic/smile.gif ALT=":)">

[Katarina Kariena]

I like that idea.... may try it once I get the padawan I now have trained.... would make things a bit easier.... for me anyway....

[Captain Tohmahawk]

No.

The priciple is 100% correct, but making up a character? Errrrr.... I dunno about that. I think maybe teaming up with someone is a better idea. Marcus will be doign something like that, but instead I'm getting a RP'er to play the student. that seems to be a better option.

[Morgan Evanar]

Well, lets see who is around a lot, find someone who doesn't chaffe your stylez, and train under each other.

If I get a new idea for a padawan, I wouldn't mind training under ya Charley, Fett( tho bye bye =p), Kat or any number of people.

Its a good concept, but it would be far better to just RP alongside someone you are cool with.

[Satine Capashen]

I like the idea...It would make things alot more interesting for my character...

[Anbira Hicchoru]

I'm kinda coming into a bit of a genesis with my character Anbira. Trying to make him a different man from the battle-scarred, depressing man he was, since he isn't really weighed down by the evil of his past anymore.

Want to make him kind of a kind-spirited old guy, mentoring a lot of padawans...(think Gandalf and the Hobbits for lack of a better comparison). He'll still have a stern, no-nonsense side...but carefully sheathed, like a sword that is only used when necessary.

[Morgan Evanar]

Satine: I HAVE AN IDEA! I'll talk to you about it tommorow.

[Hart Kenobi]

I personally don't see this as anything other than playing two characters. How many people here only have one character? Not many, huh? The only difference is that both will be Jedi in this case. It's not unfair because the new character starts off as a padawan regardless of your main character's rank.

This isn't a vote on whether it should become the standard, it's merely suggesting an option. I'm not looking for approval or disapproval.

I understand it seems a little desperate and this should be far from an ideal move. It would just be a very productive one if you currently don't have that one padawan or partner who fits you perfectly.

[TUJK]

Padawans shouldn't be brought into battle until at a certain point in their training. Otherwise they're just fodder and a worry.

[Hart Kenobi]

I disagree. I think the only time when a padawan learns and grows in the Force is in battle. Even Qui-Gon brought little Anakin all the way back to the Naboo to follow him in the middle of a huge war and learn. Obi-Wan took the risk of bringing Luke- also untrained- all the way to Alderaan even though it was a great risk and Luke was their only hope left. The intelligent move would've been for him to simply keep Luke in hiding.

[TUJK]

*hits the buzzer*

Whoa. Back up, back up one -huge- step.

The purpose of being a Jedi is not, and I repeat, is not to get involved in battles.

They're teachers, healers, and diplomats. Can they fight? Yes. Is battle one of their duities? No, I'd say that battle is one thing they try to avoid.

Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan are bad examples, expecially as you portray them.

Qui-Gon pretty much had to bring Anakin along, Leaveing him alone in the Jedi Temple, with people who didn't want him trained is a bad idea. Young minds are easily tainted. And remember, when the fiighting was going on, Anakin was told to stay in the cockpit of the fighter to stay safe. Anakin obeyed the word, but not the spirit of the order.

Obi-wan brought Luke with him to Alderaan. Which, as far as Obi-wan knew, was going to be a lum run. No danger at all. And Obi had to take Luke becaue Imperials were going to be looking for him, as he posessed the droids. They killed his aunt and uncle... and likely would have killed him.

So, it's more normal to not take a student into danger unless they're an advaced student (Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan going to Naboo) at least as I see it.

[Hart Kenobi]

Qui-Gon told Anakin to watch him in safety first because he was practically two years old, but also because he wasn't a padawan and Qui-Gon wasn't allowed by the council yet to train him.

What I'm disagreeing with is that new padawans, since relatively untrained, are helpless. Jedi masters would be the LAST people to encourage less experienced padawans to avoid battle, because even the presence of a less capable Jedi can make an impact. Jedi, themselves, don't fear death, they simply are the vessels for the Force's will. If they must die for even the chance to succeed, then so be it. What you're suggesting is that the Jedi council would prohibit a trainer and a master from helping save the universe because his padawan can't leap 70 meters. I don't remember the Jedi refusing to allow normal, non-Force sensitive soldiers work alongside them even if it meant their death.

Whether a Jedi is a teacher, a healer, a diplomat, etc, is a moot point. All must pick up their lightsaber when the darkside approaches. It must be a disgraceful Jedi who does otherwise when people around him/her are in danger. This talk of "specialized" Jedi spawned from EU, not Star Wars canon. All Jedi, in the movies, played the part of all. Qui-Gon taught, fought, and negotiated. Any Jedi who does only one is a pretty sorry excuse for a Knight.

[ReaperFett]

Dont talk canon Hart, that one can just run and run <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/image/emoticons_classic/smile.gif ALT=":)">


"What would you have us do then, Kyp?" Luke asked mildly
"I told you. Defend ourselves. Fight evil, in whatever guise it takes. And we don't let the fight come to us, to catch us in our homes, asleep, with our children, We go out and find the enemy. Offense against evil is defense"


Now, there is one POV of this. Offense against evil IS defense. You could also point out that being as a jedi is tought offense saber moves, there must be SOME form of attack

[Organa Solo]

Jedi are scholars, teachers, healers and diplomats. But they are also guardians. They may oppose battles in principle, but they participate willingly(most of the time) in them, and sometimes go looking for them because they have to in order to completely fulfill their defined role as guardians. Qui Gon and Obi went with Amidala to help in the battle of Naboo, Older Obi Wan ultimately knew he would face Vader and looked for it instead of just running, and later Luke faced Vader by way of seeking him out. Maybe it is indeed the duty of the Jedi to battle. Battles mean too much to the universe and occur too often for the Jedi to not in some way, large or small, be obliged to know about them pretty well. On the side, a battle includes a lot of room for personal growth, and the gathering of knowledge of other forces and people. A Jedi must know battle, unless they plan to never leave the Academy. The only way to learn about it, is to be in it, even from an observer's standpoint. So of course, the Padawan's role in the battle would be defined by their capabilities.


As for the original idea...

Just what I always wanted to do! RP with myself!

I support the Jedi traveling in pairs or groups idea, I just wouldn't want to RP with my own alias. That's a little too 'predictable' for me, lol.

[Darth Turbogeek]

Can I make ONE point here that seems to illude people and has for the entirety of roleplaying?

It is well and good to say Jedi do this and Jedi do that....

BUT WHAT IS THE POINT OF ROLEPLAYING?!?!? PERFECTING THE JEDI CODE?!?! SITTING HERE SPROUTING SOME WORD I CAN'T SPELL OR PRONOUNCE??? HUH?!?! HUH???!?!

The POINT of roleplaying is to a) develop your character and b) defeat the challenge of the DarkSide. The main point of THIS Roleplay universe, whether you like it or not, is going out there and battling the Dark Side users.

See Organa Solo's post for another good fact. If you plan to just be some Jedi sitting on your butt, you have no reason to leave the Acadamy. NONE. That is not the point of the overall Roleplay, now is it?!And that is why GJO are stagnating here in it's little shell, we seem to have lost sight of why we are here and what part of the community we are a part of. We Battle the Dark Side. There is plenty of room for character building, there is plenty of room to sit in the bar and get drunk if you want. But clearly, the Sith players know their part is to defeat us... so as the appointed Guardians of light, it is a Jedi's duty to stop them. And that involves challenging them.

Now, maybe you dont like fighting. Fine. Think of another way. I can think of several myself that no one has ever tried that a peace loving Jedi should try.

I will say again, the point of SWFans roleplay is keeping the Galaxy free of the Dark Side. How you do that.... is completely up to you. Your not limited to swords and sandals fellow Jedi. You dont have to wade knee deep in the bodies of Sith. Find a Jedi solution as you see it but always rember the reason why we are here.

[Darth Turbogeek]

Can I make ONE point here that seems to illude people and has for the entirety of roleplaying?

It is well and good to say Jedi do this and Jedi do that....

BUT WHAT IS THE POINT OF ROLEPLAYING?!?!? PERFECTING THE JEDI CODE?!?! SITTING HERE SPROUTING SOME WORD I CAN'T SPELL OR PRONOUNCE??? HUH?!?! HUH???!?!

The POINT of roleplaying is to a) develop your character and b) defeat the challenge of the DarkSide. The main point of THIS Roleplay universe, whether you like it or not, is going out there and battling the Dark Side users.

See Organa Solo's post for another good fact. If you plan to just be some Jedi sitting on your butt, you have no reason to leave the Acadamy. NONE. That is not the point of the overall Roleplay, now is it?!And that is why GJO are stagnating here in it's little shell, we seem to have lost sight of why we are here and what part of the community we are a part of. We Battle the Dark Side. There is plenty of room for character building, there is plenty of room to sit in the bar and get drunk if you want. But clearly, the Sith players know their part is to defeat us... so as the appointed Guardians of light, it is a Jedi's duty to stop them. And that involves challenging them.

Now, maybe you dont like fighting. Fine. Think of another way. I can think of several myself that no one has ever tried that a peace loving Jedi should try.

I will say again, the point of SWFans roleplay is keeping the Galaxy free of the Dark Side. How you do that.... is completely up to you. Your not limited to swords and sandals fellow Jedi. You dont have to wade knee deep in the bodies of Sith. Find a Jedi solution as you see it but always rember the reason why we are here.




Rant Over



Now, as for Hart's suggestion, in the main, it is good. Except I dont think playing your own Padawan is a great idea, especially when we clearly have more than enough Padawans to go around. My advice is find someone you can work with and use Hart's basic idea. Personally, I have had three requests to train in the last week, two that I would be more than happy to run with. Maybe I get requests cause I have a real reputation as a Jedi, but my point is, there are students out there if you want to find them and work with them. Personally, I think Hart's idea leads to far better Knights and far more committed Jedi in the long run and that is what we need.

[TUJK]

Hart, a Jedi Padawan, with only minor training -is- helpless against even a half ass sith. Believe you me. Consider the fact that Maul held off both Obi-Wan and Qui-gon in a straight up fight. Consider that Vader smacked around Luke, after Luke was even relitively trained.

A Padawan is not a fully trained Jedi, in abilities, or Philosophy. The fact they might die should make them crap their pants. It takes -time- for them to understand the philosophy of the force and their place within it.

Your arguments of Soldiers vs Padawans isn't that well made. Soldiers are -trained- to fight, A Padawan is like takeing a soldier who's just began Basic Training and throwing him into the battle field agaist blooded troops.

Now, as for the Jedi in the movies. Have you also noticed the following

1) The Main Jedi were not on the "inside" of the Jedi Order. Obi Wan and Qui gon were most definatly not the council's favorites. They are not representative.

2) Both Obi and Luke fought and skirted the darkside, giving into thier anger to help them overcome their foes.


Can a Jedi fight? Yes. Is it the Jedi's duty? No, I'd say not.

"There is many interpretations of what a Jedi is, and what a jedi does. as many interpretation as there is Jedi I'm afraid.

But above all, Jedi are simply learners, preservers and teachers.
They learn of the force, exploreing it's vastness.
They preserve the knowledge of what they've learned.
They teach others about the force, about things they need to know.
They honour and respect the force, working with it's flow. "

That is what a Jedi is.
Not some Mighty warrior. Even though a Jedi certainly can be that when provoked.
Not a protector of the innocent. Although surely a Jedi may do that. "

[Darth Turbogeek]

Not some Mighty warrior. Even though a Jedi certainly can be that when provoked.

Sorry, but that's not always true. Some Jedi ARE warriors. Plo Koon of the TPM Jedi Council is a Jedi Warrior and is a fighter and clearly says so on the Star Wars site. Yoda's POV is only one way to view a Jedi. There are more and clearly to me some Jedi are indeed Warriors and Fighters! And there is evidence to back that up!

[TUJK]

By that same logic, not all Jedi are warriors.

Now, read my quote, in it's entirety once again.

Realise something.

All those things, Learning, Preserving, and Teaching is something all Jedi do, without any exception, as well as honouring the will of the force.

Everything else, is a personal thing.

Some jedi take a more proactive stance upon working with the force, by confronting those that would alter it's flows for it's own gains, others offer aid, be it knowledge, healing, or mediation to others.

But, in the end, they learn about the force as they live, they preserve the knowledge of thier teachers, and thier own by teaching, either by takeing on a student, or simply through interaction with others. Those things, are *interlocks fingers, showing unity* are 3 parts of a whole, all exist, unless you're dead.

[Hart Kenobi]

My point is that I can't think of one example of a Jedi who did not do all areas. A Jedi, simply because he's a "healer", doesn't exclude him from saving lives when he's around danger. If a Jedi isn't trained well enough, should he instead run away from a confrontation? No. If he must, he should sacrifice his own life for those that he is sworn to protect at all costs. Yes, even if he doesn't think he can win.

There is no warrior Jedi. There is no healer Jedi. There is no teacher Jedi. There is just Jedi. It is synonymous with all.

Now, of course, each particular Jedi is more talented in one area than another. That's not an excuse for him/her not to perform the other functions of a Jedi. If you don't FEEL like roleplaying the other functions, then by all means. You should just do what you wish here. But don't try creating your own definition of a Jedi to match your opinions. You should form your opinions on what is true about Jedi.

[TUJK]

I hold it better to run, to live, to learn, than to die needlessly. Give yourself to death when there is cause, but not needlessly. If you fail, and your foe goes on to kill others before being stopped, your death was simple stupidity.

A Jedi's life is Just as valuable as any other life