Extreme Censorship

[Jeseth Cloak]

Why has censorship become such a problem here? Fett why do you go around closing every single thread you think is a "waste of space"? Some of them are not even really offensive and have purposes and it's becoming more and more of a crime to speak one's mind around here.

Though I doubt that this post is going to be answered, most likely it will be closed or deleted.

[Taataani Meorrrei]

because messages of a 1-1 personal nature are best dealt through the Private Messaging system. Its not extreme censorship, its getting people to use the correct part of the forum.

[Jeseth Cloak]

Shouldn't it be up to the individual people if they want private messenger or open threads? Some threads are made because the people who post them are unsure who to direct them to and would like the proper individuals to see them. Also if everything is kept under the table so to speak, then the likeliness of rumors spreading around is greater. There's nothing wrong with carrying a conversation on in public unless you have something to hide. It's extremely annoying when someone doesn't have a computer and they log in to find that nothing got done because the thread was closed. Oh and I'm not the only person who feels this way.

[Sanis Prent]

There is no reason that a one-on-one conversation between a person and the administration of another board entirely has to be carried out in this public venue. Email, messaging systems, or the PM system on this board are far more tactful. An equal number of people complain that a vast proportion of OOC forum use becomes a "Hey you" system of simply catching somebody's attention. There is a button on each person's post that enables a private message to be sent. It isn't a difficult thing to do.

[Dark Lord Dyzm]

Yet, when you close a thread, you block out other's people's views. If you keep everything private, then people can not learn from the mistakes of others. In every government, the press crave for the dirt on their leaders, or people of importance. Here, you are blocking it. If the individuals decided they do not want to make points open to everyone, then they can take it to PM.

[Sanis Prent]

And if the thread is addressed to anybody more than a singular party, it is fine here. This was not...and such things are handled on a 1-1 basis. If they want to make it a public matter, they can address it at such, which it was not.

[Darth Viscera]

In every government,

This isn't a government, and most of us aren't paying contributions to support swfans.net. This is a privately run forum, one which needs to exercise a bit of efficiency in order to stay afloat at a time when bandwidth is expensive. This forum has to be paid for, believe it or not. It doesn't fall from the sky free of charge, a gift from the gods.

That's not to say that I agree with Fett's decision to close that thread. It seems that Jes is guilty until proven innocent. He was trying to dispute that in the only outlet he deemed practical; publicly. It's a surefire way to start a flareup, certainly, but it would be selfish to expect the boy to lay down and take a whipping without crying out.

[Sanis Prent]

True, if it were a matter pertaining to jurisdiction here. However, as it deals with the administration of another board entirely, it has no business being addressed here at all.

[ReaperFett]

1. That is something that should be spoken about in private

2. THat is the sort of thing that can cause a lot of arguments

3. I've closed two things involving you, both of which could cause arguments. A sig some might see as offensive, and something which you know VERY WELL would erupt.


Some of them are not even really offensive and have purposes and it's becoming more and more of a crime to speak one's mind around here.

I've shut PM-worthy threads, a thread that resulted in a banning and your sig one. I've not touched any others.


Shouldn't it be up to the individual people if they want private messenger or open threads?
Is it up to a mass murderer wether he should go to prison for killing people?


if everything is kept under the table so to speak, then the likeliness of rumors spreading around is greater
Only if someone spreads those rumours


Oh and I'm not the only person who feels this way.
Ahh, the age old adage. Let me guess, you wont name names because they dont want to be known, right? Well, why dont you ask them to PM me, so I can see that you're not just making this up to make extra lines of text.


Yet, when you close a thread, you block out other's people's views. If you keep everything private, then people can not learn from the mistakes of others. In every government, the press crave for the dirt on their leaders, or people of importance. Here, you are blocking it. If the individuals decided they do not want to make points open to everyone, then they can take it to PM.
Was the thread involving a group of people(Like say, "WHy has TSE banned every TSO member?" or something), I'd agree. But this was Why was I banned.

You have AIM. You have their AIM names. You have a PM service. You know how to work it. Why not use these wonderous facilities?

[General Tohmahawk]

Oh for f***** sake


<h1> WHAT TSE DOES AT IT'S FORUM IS IT'S OWN BUSINESS AND IS NOT UP FOR DISCUSSION HERE, EVER, AT ALL, FULL STOP. WHY IS THIS CONVERSATION TAKING PLACE AT ALL?</h1>

This has nothing to do with SWFans.

<h1> LEAVE THE REST OF US OUT OF THIS </h1>


There is no discussion to be had futher on this. This has been a clear policy of SWFans and Reaperfett is 100% correct in closing that thread as fast as possible.

[TheHolo.Net]

I agree with Sanis, Fett, and with the Capitan's points.

This thread can remain open so that the subject of censorship may be further discussed in case others feel that they have justifiable arguments saying that such things are occurring here, but as I see it none has been presented so far.

[Darth Lynch]

Might as well add my view on this although its basically the same as others.

If someone has a problem with any board, GJO, TSE, TBH, TGE why not go to those people? There isnt much a point to post here about it really. If someone has got a problem with the group of a person the council or people in charge are the best to go through. Its not like anyone here is going to solve the problem or can exactly tell the group what to do, although might be a few exceptions to that.

To bring up something on Swfans always has and always will cause problems. And who wants that? People have gotten only more sick of such things in the last year becaue its happened one too many times.

Thats obvious.

So in short if we got a problem with someone or a group we bring it to them, if someone has a problem with us they can do the same. They wont be yelled or cursed out if they do it unless they act uncivil.

Thats all.

[TheHolo.Net]

Originally posted by Darth Lynch
Its not like anyone here is going to solve the problem or can exactly tell the group what to do, although might be a few exceptions to that.Care to explain yourself?

[Darth Lynch]

Originally posted by Darth Lynch
Its not like anyone here is going to solve the problem or can exactly tell the group what to do, although might be a few exceptions to that.


Care to explain yourself?


Not sure which part or all you refer too so shall give it a shot.

In other words what said is not many can tell a group what to do or how to act, basically what a group does is their own business at their board.

The GJO does what the GJO want at their board.

TSO does what TSO does at their board.

TSE does what TSE does at their board

And so on.

However if something is brought to swfans in RPing for example where something is being done unfairly or against the rules as it contains to SWfans going ons the issues has been brought up or the problem been fixed after a thread or two on the subject has been made from time to time, mostly due to a mod alerting the person that they were posting in a way against what is considered "fair" or against the rules and would need to change san thead or plot to accomendate it.

That better?

[TheHolo.Net]

Thank you.

[sonja]

Like Vis said, this isn't a government. It is privately owned board with few monetary contributors - whom I believe try to be fair, if even making a few mistakes along the way - they do learn and always have intentions of doing the right thing.

For the life of me, I don't understand why if some of you hate this place so much and the way it is run why you stay around? No one makes you be here, and this isn't the only Star Wars forum around. Frankly, the constant posting of bitches and gripes, or the surrounding dialog about whether people think the way this place is run is fair or unfair, is getting old. It furthermore only seems to come from people who personally have beef with one of the staff.

The rules to this place haven't really changed in its long existence. No one came in here with some new regime of unfair ideas. You read these rules when you came here, but for some reason you're going to spend your time bitching about them. What a waist of time.

The staff always listens to suggestions, most of which are always negatively put towards the staff (and don't get me started on how people always demand respect from the staff when they're yelling a snaping at them with cloaked insults). But when some people don't get their way (and furthermore can't always understand about the greater good for this place), they stick around and just pick pick pick. And I JUST DON'T GET IT.

Jeseth, you decided to post with a signature that was lacking class, IMO, which was nothing less than a shot at the staff here. Yet you stick around. Then you decided to make a 1-1 conversated post, whereas you have seen many like it closed before. And NOW you choose to protest? Does that make you the new figure head for censorship when you cared about it ONLY when it happened to you? Think the staff wouldn't treat you the same way, by president, or by the rules? Here, you're stating how so many people are unhappy. Maybe so, but y'all still stick around, if even to bitch at the staff day in and day out.

I mean you don't see me making a sig saying, "Jes is a lameass" and yet nagging to you constantly on AIM. If I thought you were lame, or didn't like the way you were, I'd just as soon not even talk to you, rather than waist my time.

All in all, there are more complaints about this forum being one big instant message/private message than there are from people being angry that their 1-1 message was closed. The staff is trying to promote the greater good. Would you rather this place be run any other way?

If you agree that this isn't the forum for matters of another place, nor the place for private conversations, then why are you griping?

[imported_Firebird1]

Should I even reply in this thread? I really don't know but here it goes.

In my mind this really isn't about censorship as it is that someone is mad that they aren't getting their way. This is one of the things that is pushing myself and others out of the RP, constant nagging that another person or group in an OOC sense is doing something at their board that really isn't bad it's in the best intrust of that board or group to do so.

We cannot continue to do this. It tears this place apart, breeds mistrust of everyone concerned, and causes people to quit the RP faster then anything I know.

[Chaos Alexander]

I will say that after the Dreyes issue, I will not speak out as much. I am not paying for this board, I am just useing it. I was not aware the board cost money. Now that I know, I just plan to keep quiet on what I think is right or wrong.

The only thing I have to say on this matter is I didn't really care about the sig. I first read it and was like "That a-hole." Then I stopped, and laughed. Why? It is only a sig. It was kinda funny if you didn't sit there and go "Well, I think that he meant.." or "Is he right for doing that..." I just let it go.

[Live Wire]

The admins didnt do anything they havent done before. They do what they do to keep this place happy for the rest of us and to minimize bandwidth by closing threads that should be PMs. They've stated time and time again what threads should be done privately and which constitue OOC material. Deal with it and grow up.

[Chaos Alexander]

::cowers at being scorned.::

Yes ma'am.

[Darth Viscera]

Ack, can we stop the yelling here?


Originally posted by Sanis Prent
True, if it were a matter pertaining to jurisdiction here. However, as it deals with the administration of another board entirely, it has no business being addressed here at all.

I respectfully disagree. The animosity towards Jeseth is not confined to TSE. DT and even Gav and others have given off some harsh early judgements (and I refer to the thread in which he was showing off his unwholesome sig), which may or may not be warranted. Could we please delay the animosity until we know for sure that he's guilty of everyone's suspicions? Come on people, don't be imprudent about this. Infamy is a hard thing to shake :\

[Jehova Eaven]

Jes here. First off, my thread was posted because for one thing I don't know who the administration of TSE IS exactly, and secondly, because I don't have the time to find out due to not having a PC at my disposal constantly. It used to be that people could pretty much discuss anything at "OOC." My thread wasn't offensive to anyone, it was a question and the consorship at this board is out of hand. I haven't spoken up before because it was never THIS BAD before. And you're right. Peace out, this place has gotten stagnant and disgustingly restrictive.

[Shawn]

I don't know who the administration of TSE IS exactlyI could be wrong, but I believe that the Council (whom they have e-mail links to at the bottom of their board) also is the admin body. If nothing else, it would probably be a safe bet that Rama Sha, Dara Shadowtide or Jedah Lynch would all be able to help address your concerns.
the consorship at this board is out of hand.It's not censorship. You're not being singled out. If you'll go back a few pages, you'll notice roughly 10 other threads closed for similar reason.

I imagine "stagnant" is vague enough to suit your purposes, but there is absolutely no evidence to support your "restrictive" stance - especially given our rather liberal terms on what can be posted here.

I'm going to be frank: Compounded with the other reasons, that thread was closed because all it's going to do is start up an argument, and there's no need for it. The thread had no purpose, other than to say "Look at me! I've been banned! Aren't they evil?"

And Viscera: Any animosity expressed by other posters is not necessarily unwarranted. I'd say that there is a good deal of it coming from both directions.

[ReaperFett]

My thread wasn't offensive to anyone, it was a question and the consorship at this board is out of hand
Did I or did I not wait until you had an answer?

I ASKED Jed to answer before I closed, so you had one. Surely was I censoring you, I would have just closed it, or maybe just deleted it.


ANd if you check any of the other closed threads that should be in PMs, no reply was waited for. Hence, you actually were treated better, no?

[Dalethria Mal Pannis]

I have to agree completely with what the staff and some fellow posters have said so far.

This isn't TSE ... you have a problem with them, you email them. It isn't hard finding an email addy at their board or website nor is it hard using the PM system here.

You have been here long enough that anything happening at another board is to be dealt there. This isn't news to you so you should already know better that if there is an issue of banning at that board, you take it up with them.

We don't need issues not pertaining to Swforums here since we do not control them.

[Rama]

Originally posted by Jehova Eaven
Jes here. First off, my thread was posted because for one thing I don't know who the administration of TSE IS exactly


http://www.thesithempire.com/


Not only are all the members of the council listed here with email and IM/Yahoo/ICQ names........but so are most of the members of TSE.


You could also click a button at the bottom of the board that will send the same email to all the members of the council. As well as links to indivudal members email.


The only reason you didn't know, is cause you didn't bother looking.

[Rama]

I'm going to be frank: Compounded with the other reasons, that thread was closed because all it's going to do is start up an argument, and there's no need for it. The thread had no purpose, other than to say "Look at me! I've been banned! Aren't they evil?"


and I agree with Shawn.......I think this was your motivation for posting this here.

[Marcus Telcontar]

Agreed with Shawn and Rama I am.

And nothing said further has done anything to convince me otherwise.

This is not a restritive place. There have however been some very clear rules and I suggest one more should be added.

Anyone taking on OOC BS too far should be banned.


Now you listen to me Viscera. I''ve done my damnest to clear Jeseth over this and at GJO, only Jade is banned. I've saved his neck twice here, so dont you dare say I'm being judgemental to him. Get your facts right before you dare diss me out.

Now what makes me very, very angry is that I spent a lot of time getting some facts in this matter, much more than people other than admins here are aware. I truly believed Jeseth was manipulated as everyone else was.

Well thank you very much for not living up to the faith I put in you. Jeseth, I am disgusted you are clearly carrying this on in a totally uncalled for manner. Thank you so much for rewarding my efforts with you sig and now this. Well, dont expect me to side with you in the future if your going to carry on like this. You are wrong with your sig as it was a graphical up yours, you are wrong with your chest beating here about censorship, because that is not the real issue and it seems I was wrong to believe you could show yourself to be better and behave.

That's what hurts. I put my faith in you and I fought for you and you rewarded that faith this petulant childish antics. I deserve an apology from you.

If your going to keep this up then leave and leave us alone. It brings me no pleasure to say that as I count you as a friend. In fact, it damn well hurts.

So I'm going to tell, you as a friend to stop this nonsense at once. Your making yourself look like an idiot and no better than LMJ. I know your a good person, so it's about time you proved it. I want to see that my belief your a better person can be justified.

[Jehova Eaven]

Jes: I really have nothing to say. I apologized about pissing people off with my sig when I posted it pretty soon afterwards there were complaints, but I won't apologize for bringing up the matter of my banning at TSE, because I wasn't attacking them, but addressing them, and also addressing something that does have to do with SWFans.net as a whole. The other boards are not under any jurisdiction of SWFans.net, but all boards more or less followed an honor system. If people where banned it was usually for god-moding or reasons that were more than suspicion and there's no crime in bringing this forward before the community as a whole.

I don't intend to continue posting here, as many of you will be glad to hear I'm sure. Those of you who said "if you don't like it, leave" are right. I don't bother with pleasantries most of the time because the shortest distance between two points is a straight line. So here is the straight line. SWFans.net has changed. This place is pretty well moved by rumors and suspicions more than anything else. I don't like it and I'm not going to hang around to watch this place go into anymore of a decline. It's not even the least bit fun for me at all anymore, though I suppose there will always be the memories.

[Dalethria Mal Pannis]

Obviously, nothing is going to come out of this thread being left opened because the same points are being said back and forth.

To clairfy once again, anything relating to a personal matter at a board that RP's here at swforums is to be directed at them. Not here.

This has always been the standard for awhile now.

Anyone else wanting to discuss this further can email or AIM one of the staff here ...

Le close.