Knew the was Going to Happen Eventually ...

[Dalethria Mal Pannis]

Looky what I found when I wanted to take a peek at the old swfans board.


Banned and Locked Down!

(swvstitanic) has been locked down in accordance with ezboard's Terms of Use

Reason: to be deleted.

Wasn't that special :)

[Nupraptor]

What utter tripe :mad

[Dalethria Mal Pannis]

I found it stupid they need to lock it down and ban the board in order to delete it @_@

[Nupraptor]

I know that most of the threads are either here or at the RPF board, but I really want to know what supposedly violated their TOS. Is it against the rules to switch to another service?

[ReaperFett]

At a guess, it's because it links everything away or something. Hardly bad though, is it? :)

[Dalethria Mal Pannis]

I skimmed the TOS and didn't see anything about linking to other third parties or other sites except to use caution when viewing such things :p

[ReaperFett]

My guess is enboldened:


6. USER CONDUCT
You agree to not use the Service to:
(a) violate or solicit the violation of any applicable local, state, national or international law;
(b) infringe the rights of any third party, including but not limited to intellectual property rights and privacy or publicity rights
(c) upload, post, email or otherwise transmit any Content that (1) is unlawful, threatening, abusive, tortious, defamatory, obscene, libelous, or invasive of another's privacy; (2) consists of instructional information on illegal activities, including, but not limited to, hacking, cracking, and phreaking; (3) violates or infringes in any way upon the proprietary rights of others, including, without limitation, copyrighted software, music, photographs, text, videos or artwork; (4) constitutes pornography, or sexual material of an obscene nature or that violates local, state or national laws; (5) is the private information of another such as their addresses, phone number, Social Security number or credit card number; (6) contains software viruses, Trojan horses or any other computer code, files or programs designed to interrupt, destroy or limit the functionality of any computer software or hardware or telecommunications equipment; or (7) you do not have a right to upload or post due to contractual or other legal obligation.
(d) impersonate any person or entity, including, but not limited to, a ezboard official, forum leader, guide or host, or falsely state or otherwise misrepresent your affiliation with a person or entity;
(e) forge headers or otherwise manipulate identifiers in order to disguise the origin of any Content transmitted through the Service;
(f) interfere with or disrupt the Service, computer servers or boards accessible through the Service;
(g) disseminate off-topic messages on boards promoting any product, service, web site, board or venture, or promote boards on the Service through unsolicited electronic mail messages to third parties.
If you do use the Service to commit any of the above, ezboard may, at its sole discretion. terminate your password, account (or any part of it) or ability to use the Service, and remove and discard any Content within the Service.

[Dalethria Mal Pannis]

which means since the board is locked up tight, it means they can axe if that is the reason why they're doing it.

good thing everything is saved here.

[Nupraptor]

That is the most ambiguous loop-hole I've ever seen in my life.

[ReaperFett]

Oh, it definately does "disrupt" the Ezboard service, but you could say so do large pictures and bad colours :)

[Taylor Millard]

Heh Too true RF, too true.

[Marcus Telcontar]

Good grief, what a complete and utter load of vindictive crap.

EzBoard = evil

[ReaperFett]

think I love about it most though. Deleting it is one thing, it is one hugerear thing to just leave there. But how long we been gone? Is it that hard to find? Did we turn all the signposts saying 'SWFans' around to face the other way? :)

[TheHolo.Net]

I guess they just get to claim the 55$ that was sitting in the Community Chest too. :huh

[Moltar]

What did you expect.....

[ReaperFett]

hey, damand the kitty back! They can take our board, they can take our freedom, but theyll never take our MONEY!!!


:)


Seriously, ask about that. I got their legal team e-mail if you want it

[Marcus Telcontar]

They have no right to the money. It must be refunded.

[ReaperFett]

just checked. According to the agreement you agree to, they have every right

[TheHolo.Net]

http://login.ezboard.com/fezboardfrm40.showMessage?topicID=9411.topic

[Nupraptor]

The day we move the board, they delete my account. On my birthday, they delete the board... they really must have something against me. :|

[ReaperFett]

Don't get married dude, never get married :)

[Marcus Telcontar]

BS they can Fett. No service can legally claim your money for a service NOT provided, no matter what their stinking TOS says. TOS does not override consumer protection laws - those laws are to stop BS like that

[Yaijaarree Auusseeri]

:eek That's not legal! That's not right, either. >_< We did absolutely nothing wrong on that board other than leave it. I mean, yeah, most of the threads have been moved, but that's not the point! It's more like a photo album or something.. >: They must die.

[ReaperFett]

Well their TOS says they can. Only way you'd get the money back is be diplomatic to the important people or get in the legal team

[Nupraptor]

Hmmm

:: is seriously considering calling the BBB ::

[TheHolo.Net]

Considering this action was taken without so much as a message to the ezOp (me) stating what was done and what would occur because of it, as well as the fact that the money is basically being forfeited from what I can gather, I think the BBB would be quite interested to hear about such practices.

[Nupraptor]

I'll see if I can't find out their number sometime today.

[ReaperFett]

BBB? WHat's that in dumb people(ie, me:)) speak?

[Nupraptor]

The Better Business Bureau. They look into businesses that are being crooked or unfair to their customers.

[Marcus Telcontar]

Well their TOS says they can. Only way you'd get the money back is be diplomatic to the important people or get in the legal team


It does NOT MATTER what their TOS says. It does not and can not overide consumer protection laws, full stop, end of story. The act of having such a TOS is itself a criminal offence and can be challenged. If you want your money back, I would suggest Consumer Protection offices and a vert stiff and stern request, making it clear you know the law and you want your money back.

[ReaperFett]

Hmmm, yeah, I think you have a case then. Only thing though. If you did do anything, avoid personal opinions, just keep to the facts. Personal opinions are easy to defend from

[Moltar]

<a href=http://www.bbb.org/BBBComplaints/lookup.asp>The Better Busness Bureau has a webpage.</a>

If you want to file a complaint then here is where to go.

[Marcus Telcontar]

I have now set EZboard.com as a Email spam domain on my mail servers.

I truly enjoyed that :evil

[Moltar]

LOL!

Well, there goes the neighborhood....


Wait, does that mean that we will get it?

[Taylor Millard]

Originally posted by Marcus Q'Dunn
I have now set EZboard.com as a Email spam domain on my mail servers.

I truly enjoyed that :evil

I bet you did. This oughta be interesting to see what happens now to Exlaxboard.com now.

Wierdos...(the EZboard I mean). They'll never do any good. I'll stick to VBulletin thank you. :)

[Marcus Telcontar]

What is interesting is that the script I use for the blockfile also can be modified to report to places like ORBS and list Ezboard.com as a spamming domain, so it becomes a globally listed spammer.

I'm tempted.... I really am....

[Moltar]

Why not, I've been getting spam from them..Spam about Cars with Credit Cards, Buy my house with 100% intrust loans, Get money for a Vacation I won't have enough money for....


Do I really need to go on?

[Nupraptor]

Yeap. I visited www.bbb.org earlier. I'm going to give ezboard several days to respond to the thread Ogre started. If they don't (at the very least) refund the people's money and explain why it's being deleted, I'm going to report them.

[Marcus Telcontar]

Another suggestion is to combine all what they have done and then try to get it published on something that is highly visible - something like slashdot. Yeah I know it's a l4m3 site now, but it's read by 500,000 people minimum per day. Just alerting people to their practices isnt a bad thing to do, especially if they start claiming money for services they promised and never delivered, or even taking the Community Chest without refunds.

Who else have they done that to?

[imported_Eve]

I feel like shutting down DU because I hate the ezbitches. When I do, I'll create an account JUST to give them a hard time. Believe me, I hope they run themselves into the ground... and they will eventually. Just watch. But...

Guys - don't forget that your country law has no effect on the international internet. It's a different field here. That doesn't mean that there is no justice, but the laws that you physically live under do not always apply.

And very often, when you sign up for a service, whereas you agreed to the TOS, the fact that you don't like it LATER, means nothing in a court of law.

In this issue of deleting the board, ezboard DID forewarn you in the TOS. In the matter of keeping your money, ezboard did forewarn you in the TOS, as someone above quoted.

Now, don't get me wrong, I think, as a business, they have a lot to learn. Any idiot can tell you that. Just don't surprised if you don't get very far with the BBB. It's not ezboard's fault that you didn't read the fine print. They didn't deceive you, nor lead you to believe that anything otherwise would happen, and you can't prove that.

Unless you want to challenge their whole system, and then you get into all the complexities where the internet laws aren't well defined.

Now as far as deleting boards and accounts randomly and with very short or NO notice, THERE you have a solid issue. Nup, what happened to your account alone is BS. The times that it happened always seemed to coincide with some battle with ezboard. And I'm sure that's all documented in some place or another. If you had ever paid for your account, you would be entitled to a refund I think. FR HAD to have been saved somewhere. They provided no compensation for depriving its owner of the product, except a simple, "sorry".

[Nupraptor]

Guys - don't forget that your country law has no effect on the international internetI'll concede that it's a bit of a gray are, but they themselves are located in California, which means that they're succeptable to US laws.

And, as DT pointed out: Just because it's in the TOS (which, by the way, they altered after the fact and said that "continuing to use ezboard for 30 days after the alterations to the TOS means that you agree to the new terms" - very misleading and unethical) doesn't override the fact that they can't just take money for services not rendered.

[imported_Eve]

Oh, I agree it's not fair. A business like that will only go so far. Hell, they may end up losing more from being sued than what they're making on those damn pop-ups, community chests (that only open for ezboard), and user fees.

Lemme know what BBB says.

[Marcus Telcontar]

If your an International always pay for services by credit card. At least in Australia, you are insured for any fraudulent transaction - and BTW, if Ezboard takes the money, it's fraud, they have a legal obligation to refund for services not taken up - and the credit card companies will then be responsible for chasing the debt down. I'm sure they will have no problems with getting the money back.

Also, the legal system for Aust recognises that the transaction HAPPENS IN AUSTRALIA, or that is what the latest cases are bginning to show. Thence, it is entirely possible that EZBoard would have to obey Aust trading rules for my hypothetical transaction. Course, I'd rather eat **** than pay those asses any money ever.

So, Internationals are not necessarily stranded.

[Moltar]

Well, your thread over there has been locked and the Mod left an Email to Ezboard's legal department.

[Marcus Telcontar]

What a lot of TRIPE!!! So they dont address the problem, it simply shunted. What BS

[Taylor Millard]

Welcome to America DT. Where resposibility is shirked and the buck is passed.

*Hopes shirked means in Australia what it means over here.

But you are right...it is BS. I want my 7 bucks back!

[Marcus Telcontar]

And I remember someone tried to seriously suggest EZBoard was better not long ago.

[Taylor Millard]

Yeah and I was one of the first to say they were wrong. What is it with people not getting EZBoard SUCKS!!!! /rant

[Marcus Telcontar]

Just goes to prove as the population goes up, the mean intelligence goes down

[Moltar]

After all the BS I have found out about, I will not support them.

This is stupid, those Mods should of been able to find out of it by themselves, and not give people the run around!

[Marcus Telcontar]

It's because in reality, they have no idea and they dont care.

[Taylor Millard]

And Wizard's first rule is: People are stoopid. People being EZBoard here.

I still want my 7 bucks back. :mad

[Marcus Telcontar]

Tell your credit card company that you recieved no goods for you money. They should help you out. Yeah okay, it's a tiny amount, but it's the principle.

[TheHolo.Net]

I just got this and replied with an inquiry about the TOS violation message where the board was and the CC funds in the amount of 55 $.
(An ezboard private message from ckerr)



this is vanchau.. email me at vanchau@ezboard.com



We are deleting this board b/c it is no longer used and takes up
space.

[Marcus Telcontar]

Hmmmm.... this will be interesting. I'd love to hear what he says

[Nupraptor]

So... where's the violation?

[Loki Ahmrah]

'Tis very sad. It's like our heritage has gone. I used to go back to check out Old Betsy and now it's all gone! :(

[ReaperFett]

Now that Vanachu thing is wrong. That isn't a violation

[TheHolo.Net]

I agree that it is wrong. The message they have in place where SWFans used to be is a false perception they are giving people that visit the board and is an insult and defamation of our community’s character if you ask me. As for my email to him, it has yet to be responded to.

[Marcus Telcontar]

I have nothing polite to say about EzBoard right now.

[Lord DarkStar]

do you think vanachu would be annoyed if he were to get somewhere in the region of...oh i don't know 20,000 (hotmail's daily limit) of e-mails to his acount :evil

[Marcus Telcontar]

I would say that was lowering ourselves down to thier level and to be avoided. Funny, but not something we should do or condone

[Champion of the Force]

Can anyone give me the URL to Ogre's thread that was locked down by ezboard? I went to their help forums but I can't find anything.

PS. I don't think the username SWFans Net was the ezOP - I think that would be Jason unless they changed things last year when I wasn't around.

[ReaperFett]

"Dav! Look over there!"

*As he does so, SWFans changes the ezOP*

:)

On page one I believe, http://login.ezboard.com/fezboardfrm40.showMessage?topicID=9411.topic is it I believe

[Champion of the Force]

Thanks.

[Ghostie Gitane]

Feh! That's just stoopid.

[Frank Harrigan]

They deleted Sith Ahnk, I asked for my posts and admin access back, and they deleted it

[TheHolo.Net]

Well He finally replied. I suspect they will let us transfer the funds to another ezboard possibly, but really I'm not sure. What does everyone else think?
That's just a standard message.

What is that you guys want?

-----Original Message-----
From: Darth Ogre [mailto:darthogre@yahoo.com]
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2002 1:58 AM
To: vanchau@ezboard.com


Subject: RE: Hi


>(An ezboard private message from ckerr)
>
>
>
>this is vanchau.. email me at vanchau@ezboard.com
>
>
>
>We are deleting this board b/c it is no longer used and takes up
>space.

According to the message when trying to access the board the TOS were violated and there is also the matter of the 55 $ that was in the community chest. Do those funds intend to just be forfieted?

Board in question is swvstitanic

[Marcus Telcontar]

What they should do is refund the money to whoever paid.

[Alec Lafeyette]

They're still getting the money, they don't care what board it goes too. :mad

[Champion of the Force]

Is it within their policy to refund money paid? I thought it was non-refundable. :\

[Marcus Telcontar]

Is it within their policy to refund money paid? I thought it was non-refundable


Doesnt matter what their policy is. Consumer law still demands that they return the money if services are not provided for. Just like in Australia, when you see NO REFUND signs - thats not correct. Goods unused must be accepted for refund, services paid but not used must be refunded.

[Nupraptor]

Yes, it's their policy not to give refunds. However, if they're so adamanet about upholding it, they may find some unfriendly people breathing down their collective necks.

[Jehova Eaven]

here here!

[Darth Viscera]

What is that you guys want?

and there is also the matter of the 55 $ that was in the community chest. Do those funds intend to just be forfieted?
*scratches his head* :huh *scratches his head some more* 'e's dimmer than a black light bulb, 'e is. Clearly, the $55 refund is what is being requested. Don't tell me, this man is the mastermind behind all of ezBoard?

[Taylor Millard]

Bah I want my $7 back! :mad

[Q]

You know, I could just snap my fingers and Ezboard would cease to exist.

But then I'd have the continuum breathing down my neck for upsetting the balance too far in the favor of Good.

[imported_Eve]

Marcus- Consumer Law re: refunds... is that the way in Australia? Cuz we don't have that same law here in the states. There are consumer rights, but once someone signs on the dotted line, they don't have much of a chance. You have the right to be informed of all information and stipulations regarding purchases, and then you have the choice to sign, respectively. I have personally worked in three places that do not allow refunds and it stands that way.

Where I work now, if you neglect us for 72 hours (no contact), your money is ours. Sounds stupid and unfair, but it happens, and no one can do anything about it cause they signed off on it. Not our fault they didn't read the fine print. If they even tried to take us to court, they'd end up being out the money it took them to hire a lawyer. We do that because the neglect may have cost us business. If we waist our time and resources on someone, they will pay for it. EzBoard may have the same type of thinking in this TOS stipulation. If my company has the right to do that, then so may American grounded EzBoard.

Hell you can agree, over the phone, to take a telemarketer up on their offer for a cell phone and be making a verbal and LEGAL contract to get celllar service for 2 years! Credit card companies mail their users stuff all the time that they never read. Some of that stuff says, "if you don't sign and return saying you don't want a neat new service, then you will be making an agreement with us for that service at a cost to you"! I've had experiences with both scenarios. Thats how it works here. It's legal and it happens everyday.

Again, don't get me wrong. I hate the ezbit... (you know what I call them). I just think when it comes down to it, there isn't much you all can do about a TOS that you have agreed to. Unless you plan on taking ezboard to court, Vanchau isn't budging, and he can keep pointing to the TOS you agreed to in the meantime.

[Q]

Most of those things you cited do indeed happen, Eve. But that's mostly because no one has the inclination or money to take a big company to court over such an issue. Take that credit card example: If you got a class action lawsuit against the company that's doing that, I'm fairly certain that you could get them for unfair business practices. Lots of stuff goes on in this country that isn't exactly legal or fair. But since no one challenges the big, scary, faceless corporation on it, it continues to happen.

Regardless: It looks like the old board is no longer set to be deleted. Not the best solution, but Vanchau knows that it'll keep us quiet.

[imported_Eve]

Actually I called and bitched until they reversed it. But what you say is true too.

Well good about the board. I'm glad they did SOMETHING. I didn't think he would.

[Marcus Telcontar]

I think what you have outlines Eve is actually illegal, it's just that, as Q said, the compaines do it cause the know they can get away with it and not many will have the money to challenge.

To back up those laws in australia, there is a small claims office that is dedicated to solving small claim issues and handing out big punishments. We have the ACCC which has a very big stick. We have consumer affiars Onbudsman with real powers and teeth. I I have a 50 dolla r issue with my credit card with fraud, I go to my bank and they legally take responsibility and refund, then go get the frauder themselves.

If you know your rights in consumer law in Aust, it works really well.

Now, I would imagine the same anti fraud and scamming laws exist in the USA, its a difference in enforcement by the sounds of it. And from what I understand, unlike AUst where Federal law can and does overturn state "rights", that's not the case there, except by the Constitution? I dont understand that bit myself - but in Aust its not uncommon for laws to be synced up across states and uniform, except for minor differences.

If you enforcement laws dont work.... come to australia where if you have a valid serivce issue with a monopoly, you can go see the Onbudsman who has the power to override them in a lot of cases. Which is what I'm doing about a service bill I got, for a service that has not worked.

[Champion of the Force]

The question is whether it is worth all the effort to get back $55 (or whatever the amount is) - I assume that amount is split between a number of different users.

[Charley]

To be frank, I would be mortified to live in a country that threw contractural and tortious law to the birds, and simply dropped a big bad government beat-stick onto businesses. We may not like the EZ situation, but its as legal as any legit company in US or Australia. Just a matter of borders. Its like radio frequencies and the FCC. Certain bandwidths can't be used in one country, but can in another. They're still useful frequencies, just used for different things in both places.

Just remember...if you think it will matter, it never hurts to read the contract.