Another issue which concerns us all

[Gav Mortis]

Forgive me for not going into detail on this one but it has become quite evident to me as of late that the OOC atmosphere of this Roleplaying Community has plummetted to new appauling levels. It seems that everything anyone says around here is a sneak-attack aimed at another, then if it isn't, it most certainly is being accused of it.

Personally, I am beginning to feel drained of energy to contribute to this community anymore because of it. I read threads here to which I would like to add my own point of view and when I see someones awful attitude getting in the way of the issues at hand, it disheartens me to the point that I just leave the thread entirely.

I know I don't have to go into detail nor will I have to provide examples because I think most around here who care for this community will know what I am talking about and the evidence is everywhere, it really is.

My hope is that perhaps we can establish some sort of stricter administration here regarding bitterness and spitefulness coming across in posts. The morale here seems to be flailing somewhat. I applaud the administrators and moderators here because what you do for this place is unreal; the patience you have is truely admirable. But I do feel the need for some sort of action that will pursuade flamers and the foolish to think twice before they post.

[Gav Mortis]

I might be wrong here, but I have just read something that suggests that this issue has been raised in Jeseths post "An Issue Which..."

If this is so, I appologise as I have not kept up with the developments in that thread as of late and will have no objection to this thread being deleted.

[Moltar]

:|

Should I get out the hose now or later?

[TheHolo.Net]

I have noticed the recent trend and have been trying to come with ideas for solutions and also been interjecting when it gets really offensive, with warnings and the like, but to no avail. The negative attitudes of several people towards each other is starting to reach a boiling point for me and about the only solution I can see anymore is issuing final warnings and if they are not heeded performing bannings.

Personal attacks on any level have not and never will be acceptable behavior here, and the presence of them only serves to injure how our community is perceived, by those who are new to it, and those who are veterans of it. Either the ones responsible for personal attacks, be they veiled or blatant, stop it all together, treating each other with at least some form of respect while they are here, take it somewhere else where it does not blight this community, or be forced to not be able to do so at this community any longer.

Tolerance for such things has now reached a zero level. I would appreciate if anyone perceives something within any thread as a veiled or blatant personal attack, from this point on, contact one of the appropriate forum moderators or administrators, so that action can be taken.

Warnings will be issued first to such offenders, and if not heeded, more strict action will be taken to remove the sour voice that blights our community.

If you feel that this action is unjust or inappropriate, please feel free to speak your mind in a calm and rational manner and the entire community (those who wish to share their thoughts) will discuss the topic.

Edit: spelling :x

[Nupraptor]

How about merging the threads? :)

(will provide a response to your original post later)

[TheHolo.Net]

Originally posted by Nupraptor
How about merging the threads? :)

(will provide a response to your original post later) Actually, as long as the other has become, I think a fresh start on this related topic is a good idea. :)

[Daegal Murdoch]

I wholeheartedly agree. The OOC situation has become repulsive. I commend any efforts to stop it. You have my full and unwavering support, Ogre.

Off Topic...Nup, are you not an admin anymore? Your title is gone

[Moltar]

You know, I'd like to think that reading those threads are not like watching Mel Gibson in Braveheart get the title of protector of Scotland, and then be forced to watch the Nobility of Scotland argue.

It makes me want to pick a fight!

And thats what should be happening, this is an RP board, so why not fight it out?

[Nupraptor]

Daegal: Let's just say that I needed a break for a few days to collect myself. :)

I know that I'm far from being guilt-free when it comes to causing sparks to fly, on the boards and off. And I doubt that I'd be taken sincerely when I say this, even though I am nothing but. Still, I think it's for the best:

I'd like to make amends with anyone and everyone whom I've clashed swords with in the past (especially those I've done so with more recently). I often tend to become a bit overbearing and narcissistic. I truly am sorry, and I try to keep a reign on these traits when I can. Really, I'd like for nothing better than to be friends with all of you.

You don't have to respond to this one way or the other. If you do want to do so, you can just IM or PM me. I'm posting this here because I feel this is the sort of thing that needs to be done. I know we can't be expected to get along with everyone, but there's no harm in trying. :)

[Marcus Telcontar]

http://www.swforums.net/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11499

That's still an open offer to anyone I've crossed swords with in the past and for anyone with lingering hostility to me.

[Jedah Lynch]

It has taken this long for some to notice the levels of OOC ness has sunk low? I'm amazed, its been as such for a long time, its not until someone rocks the boat and some make an issue until it gets noticed though I suppose. Ah well. Perhaps some good of this is going to take place after all.

While I actually do agree with what Ogre has proposed I do question how much good it will do. It is one thing to police the board here at swfans for the sake of the community. It can help to stop some issues or fix some problems before they arise, but what of the problems created off board that flow here due to any number of reasons. At the center that is the problem and those issues are not so easily dealt with, in the end how are those corrected or stopped? People are a fickle lot, no matter who they are.

If some get along or try to tolerate each other there might be no issue or at least things can move on to a degree or exist so little trouble is created as much as possible for the sake of the comunity. But even that is difficult to achieve. When its said and done warnings, bannings whatever can all work, but who would they be used against exactly? For the right reasons than yes it perhaps has to be done. However it should be done for the right reasons, just reasons as well. Believe it will be if the need does arise.

If any of that makes sense I got no idea, I'm dead tired but felt had to say something especially since am more than responsible for this topic being started and am one of the more controversal posters here when it comes to such things. I doubt that will change any time soon unless am exiled due to how I'am. *shrugs*

Either way as for solutions that I'm afraid have none to offer..might post again on this later when thoughts are more clear.

[Rama]

These things happen on both sides.....


The main problem I see is lot of people want thinghs to stop....but at the same time they don't want or are willing to change their views or attitudes. They don't want to be attack, but at the same time they countiune on the with the whole im better then you attitude and belittleing actions that most likely lead to the attacks in the first place. If you want it to stop.....not just a few people have to change. Everyone needs to to do a 180.......not just the ones that are offending you. Cause Im pretty sure you offend them too.



Myself and Mister Geek here.....have made great strides in our OOC feelings towards each other in the last couple of days. That wouldn't have been possible if he hadn't changed his attitude towards me......and in turn changed my attitude towards him. I mean I diliked everything he stood for.......he started a thread to just vent his woes over me. And yet we found an understanding.


Many others have come to me with the same purpose, but in most cases it never came with a feeling of really wanting to put past diffrences behind us. It came across more as a "I wanna make peace so you won't get in my way." and i realized that they had learned nothing.....and that all their hard feelings were still there. DT didn't come across like that all......I felt he was truely honest with me. I can't say that for the others that have tired to make peace with me. Hard to explain really.....that you could get a vibe off someone who is hundreds if not thousands of miles away. Maybe it's how they type........or the words they use. Or they way they tip toe around things instead of giveing you a straight answer. All i know is I can tell when some is being honest with me.....and DT was.


Now back to the issue......If someone says that don't like you, or that you are doing this or that for OOC reasons, or that they don't have repect for you or your group. You've more then likely brought that on yourself. Being secertative......talking about them behind their backs.....Bad mouthing them on IM and them proclaiming to be their "Friend" the next time you see them. These sorta things bring these things down on your head. I deserved a lot of flames I have had in my day.....I wished I could go back and change things, so that the flames did lick my feeling any longer......but it was to late. And I had to bear them......IC,OOC, Personal,or just against my friends. I had to bear them, cause after it was all said and done I could do nothing to make it right. You people have the chance to make it right.....and yet you are to stuborn....to set in your ways to do it. But maybe you just have to live and learn. Make the mistakes for yourselfs before you know they were mistakes.

[Marcus Telcontar]

I'll tell a story here.

Over two years, I've offended or bit out at a lot of people. I can be very hostile and agro and that's my nature, for better or worse. But I'm also basically honest, so when I snap and lash out, I say what I'm truly feeling. And yes, Rama has been the focus of a lot of that. Which I never sought to hide.

In October, I guess I had trashed any good reputation I had ligering and I was going to leave here permanatly. I had enough. I just wanted to just leave and leave the bad blood behind. I took a break for a month, then came back to GJO. At which point I put fortht he topic he alluded to.

A few days after Rama responded to hat thread, I re-read that thread. Really read what I said. And began to wonder, just what the hell was I saying? Why was it so important that I went and ripped someone I didnt really know OOC? Someone on the other side of the a very large body of water?

Now by this time, I had made peace with a few people I had OOC fights with. Videl is one. Jeseth is another. Itala as well. And I realised one of my better friends OOC was no longer talking to me, Nup for some reason. That was like a cold slap in the face. I liked Nup, we had spoken deeply of some subjects and I believe I had gotten to know him well.

So here I am, looking at this thread and thinking. My wife had a tape from a Christian speaker playing in the background and I heard this...

"How can you God forgive you if you dont forgive others? How can He lay aside what you have done wrong against Him, if you dont do likewise to everyone else?"

Okay, I know some here dont believe ina God, but I do. And considering my own journey with God has sucked lately, that really hauled me to a standstill.

Here was someone I hadn't been prepared to forgive and forget with. Right on my screen.

Well, that started to work into me and when I dared to come to SWFans again, it really was quite clear. Either I laid aside everyone honestly and openly or there wasnt going to be peace. I wont say I immediatly set down to right the wrongs, but I knew I had to. And I had to be honest and straight up. That does not saying the past does not exist, but instead saying that there were mistakes. There was hostility. And to acknowledge I was wrong, come forward and say it. Apologise and truly lay everything aside.

I set down and I looked at myself. I didnt like what I saw and maybe what some others did see. I'm not saying I'm a better person, cause I'm not. But I was prepared to admit it and I still will now. I'm not perfect. In fact, I'm an *******.

Be honest about what had been done and honestly come forward to make peace. I wrote what I did and simply asked myself - are you honest? Are you really prepared to put the wrongs aside? Take the first step, even if nothing comes of it? I hit reply when I truly did.

I have been stunned at the response. I really didnt think Rama would respond in kind. But he has and for that, I'm grateful.

So what was the point of this overlong posting?


OOC hostilty can tear the board apart. It's easy to hate, but to forgive is hard, but at some point it must be done. It has to be honest and upfront. And it can't be selective.

Pity it's taken two years for me to work that out.

[Darth Vader]

I'm a forgiving guy, and I don't like to have bad blood carried on for an extended period of time. There's only one person I know that I've never forgiven, and those close to me know that story.

But here? Nothing anybody here can do would keep me from calling it all water under the bridge. However, I'm not going to sell myself short. If I'm right, and I believe it, I will stick to what I'm saying. If you think I can be blunt, yes I can be. I've been told that people don't AIM me much because they think I'm in a rotten mood. I'm not, just try not to dance around what I wanna say.

Lemme just say, there are a helluva lot fewer people here that I have problems with than say about 2 months ago. I've patched up things with Dara and Rama, and Firebird to a better degree.

Does that mean that we can toss olive branches around and dance around the world, hand-in-hand? No. There will always be people I butt heads with. Still are today.

Now, for me to take two steps back, and put on my mod hat. Yes, I know that OOC arguments can poison things here, and while I know this, I have to take lots of discretion in determining when and where I need to step in and keep things from blowing up into a flame firestorm. The kind of verbal backstab insults that I've seen flying of late in the realm of the TGE/TSE war is going to stop. I didn't say that it would be nice if it stopped, or ask you guys to pretty please stop. It is going to stop. Whether I have to ask posters to be nice, or go in and edit out their inflammatory comments, we're going to keep that out. You can argue without being petty. I have no problem with an argument, but keep the insults out. I've said this before, and I hoped my words were heeded.

[Morgan Evanar]

Actually, I'd have to say that aside from the fleet thread, everyone handled themselves rather better than we did last time we had an out of character discussion that ran with some tension (which I caused pretty much single-handedly).

I mean, a lot better. I went over that thread again, and I was frickin MEAN in spots. Course, I was being tarred and feathered, but no one was really right in that whole mess. I was more wrong than most, for sure.

Seperate the current attitudes that we've seen in the fleet thread and what we had in an issue that concerns us all, and I'd say most of the participants in "Issue" have been taking their doses of chill pills on a regular basis. Not perfect, not a shining example, but not a horrendus evil either.

I guess the short is that I think that a lot of people have decided to quit taking jabs at each other and try and work stuff out.

So people, kick back, turn up the stereo, and calm the frick down, cause "yeah, who do we think we are?"

[Severen Morkonis]

I agree entirely Charley my old mucker...