Hey all

[TheHolo.Net]

Moved because it was causing some mebers so many problems.

Start of FIRE354658 buffer: Sun Oct 28 01:44:49 2001
[00:49] FIRE354658: Hello?
[00:49] *** Auto-response sent to FIRE354658: I am away from my computer right now.
[00:49] SE Ogre: yep
[00:51] FIRE354658: Are you reading this thread.Or this one? And do you have access to the SWFans.net name?
[00:51] SE Ogre: which threads?
[00:52] FIRE354658: Both links above.http://www.swforums.net/forum/showthread.php?s=&;threadid=10768Is the first one.
[00:52] SE Ogre: yes I have
[00:52] SE Ogre: I just posted to one
[00:53] FIRE354658: As SWFans.net?
[00:53] SE Ogre: yes
[00:54] FIRE354658: Ok, then I have to ask you something. If Korran came to TSE and asked you to me his master, would you train him?
[00:54] SE Ogre: sure
[00:54] SE Ogre: see my thread with demonknight
[00:55] SE Ogre: http://pub59.ezboard.com/fthesempir...picID=121.topic
[00:55] FIRE354658: Ok, I asked that because both you and Q (aka LL) are bitchslapping Korran about his "newbeness"
[00:56] FIRE354658: Aka not having perfect grammer, and posting in the wrong forum. Also Dara is up in arms about this.
[00:56] SE Ogre: Q isn't LL
[00:56] FIRE354658: Then who is Q?
[00:56] SE Ogre: no one is bitchslapping Koran
[00:58] FIRE354658: Umm.. I call telling someone I haven't seen before that their typing skills are terrible and then getting into a war of words with someone who tried to help him.
[00:58] SE Ogre: I saw no war of words from LL or Tasha
[00:59] FIRE354658: Eve put it best....{quote}The way Tasha delt with new person... BAD. The way Dara delt with new person... GOOD{/quote}
[00:59] SE Ogre: Dara expressed her opinion as did other posters,
[00:59] SE Ogre: thats an opinion
[01:00] FIRE354658: And she is getting hit around by other people who would rather be the welcomers...And rather have the person ask them, not Dara or the others for help.
[01:00] SE Ogre: no one is acting as if they would rather be the welcomers
[01:00] FIRE354658: Um, then why the debate?
[01:01] SE Ogre: because some people can't handle others not agreeing with their opinions
[01:01] FIRE354658: Then why is something that should be a 5-6 post thread turning into a catfight, teetering on Flaming. And it has nothing to do with the fact that people can't agree. It's the fact that the Admins are pushing the issue.
[01:02] SE Ogre: huh
[01:02] SE Ogre: Admins pushing what issue
[01:11] FIRE354658: First off, your telling Korran that he is in the wrong forum, you could of done that through PM. Next When someone gives him the links, a few posts later, Q tries to Back up the Admins. After Dara posts a responce in which she tries to explain herself, I see SWFans discuss a post about friendliness, and then Q uses the word repremand. But both posts try to dissect the second post in the thread, trying to make it sound that Tasha's post was more friendly.
[01:13] SE Ogre: I never told him he was in the wrong forum. Someone else did, I moved the thread about 30 minutes later, the admins never even posted in that thread until just now.
[01:15] FIRE354658: Yeah, then why are backing up Tasha?That makes no sense. Dara provided the links to the FAQ and I see that she is being treated like she is in the wrong for trying to help him.And also the second link I gave shows Korran getting yelled at for his spelling.
[01:15] SE Ogre: Ihe did nothing wrong
[01:15] SE Ogre: he stated his opinion, last Ichecked opinins were okay to have
[01:16] FIRE354658: Yeah, but does a Mod need to tell him that his typing sucked in an open forum like that.
[01:16] SE Ogre: no mod told him that
[01:17] FIRE354658: Then why did a mod try to bail out Tasha again?
[01:17] SE Ogre: Dara stated that Tashsa's opinion was wrong, she is also welcome to have that opinion, but others are bound to disagree with hers just as she disagreed with Tasha's
[01:17] SE Ogre: Tasha did nothing wrong
[01:17] FIRE354658: Right, but does Q also have the right to bash Dara?
[01:18] FIRE354658: Hello, you told me you were for the people?
[01:18] SE Ogre: Everyone has a right to thier opinion, Q didn't bash Dara, he stated his opinion and made valid points
[01:18] FIRE354658: And what if Dara feels that Q bashed her?
[01:19] FIRE354658: What then Ogre?
[01:19] SE Ogre: she has a right to feel that, it can also be said that she has been bashing people who don't have the same opinion as she does in those threads
[01:19] FIRE354658: I agree that Tasha did nothing wrong, he just needs to work on his tact. But Why are the Admins picking on Dara?
[01:19] SE Ogre: no one is picking on Dara
[01:20] FIRE354658: Really, then why is the thread still alive?
[01:20] SE Ogre: there are only 2 Admins on the board, and I didn't bash Dara
[01:20] SE Ogre: because people disagree
[01:20] FIRE354658: Are you even reading either thread?
[01:20] SE Ogre: such is life
[01:20] SE Ogre: yes
[01:20] FIRE354658: Forget Life.
[01:21] SE Ogre: are you
[01:21] FIRE354658: Novi just summed what the Mods and Admins should of done. PMed him.
[01:21] FIRE354658: That was all
[01:22] SE Ogre: the mods and admins did nothing wrong
[01:22] SE Ogre: I tried to say that opinions had been heard and it was time to move on. Is that wrong?
[01:24] FIRE354658: But instead, you decided to talk to both Korran and Dara like they were your red headed step children. You don't get it, you don't talk to anyone like that. Why do you think I made such a big deal about becomming a Mod at TSE? I did it so that I wwould let people know that I would not treat them like they were dirt. Why do you think I left that thread with Anbiraa open? I did it so I could let people know that I can take a hit and still be professional about it.
[01:25] SE Ogre: no I didn't/
[01:25] SE Ogre: I treated no one like dirt, that is a ludicrus accusation
[01:25] FIRE354658: Then who are SWFans.net tonight and Q? Do many people control those accounts?
[01:25] SE Ogre: I am the only person that posts as SWFans and Q is not part of the staff
[01:27] FIRE354658: Well, then why do I have Dara IMing me about this?Why is Var cussing at Cirrsseeto?
[01:27] FIRE354658: And why is Q backing up the Admins?
[01:27] SE Ogre: becuase they disagree
[01:27] SE Ogre: he has a right to his opinion
[01:27] SE Ogre: just l;ike everyone else
[01:29] FIRE354658: Well, so do I. But I will not post in there.I'm not adding fuel to that fire. And you need to IM Dara now. Her AIM is DarkLordessDara.
[01:29] SE Ogre: she has my name, she can IM me
[01:31] FIRE354658: You can explain that you did nothing wrong to her...I have invited both of you to this chat.
[01:31] SE Ogre: I'm not using AIM and cannot be invited into a chat
[01:31] FIRE354658: Get on it.
[01:32] SE Ogre: no
[01:32] SE Ogre: she is free to IM me if she wishes
[01:32] FIRE354658: You need to talk to Dara.
[01:32] SE Ogre: okay
[01:34] FIRE354658: Your talking to Her?
[01:34] FIRE354658: I'll BRB
End of FIRE354658 buffer: Sun Oct 28 01:44:49 2001

************************

Start of DarkLordessDara buffer: Sun Oct 28 01:45:26 2001
[01:33] DarkLordessDara: hey..
[01:33] *** Auto-response sent to DarkLordessDara: I am away from my computer right now.
[01:33] SE Ogre: hello
[01:34] DarkLordessDara: I am a big girl and can handle myself and I know the consequences of me speaking on swfans.. but I feel Q/Sanis is out of line in that last post when you said the topic was done..
[01:34] DarkLordessDara: so part of me wants to answer his post where he accuses me of playing with words..
[01:34] DarkLordessDara: and then Tasha got a last jab in at me too.. I don't know
[01:34] SE Ogre: Q is not Sanis and I see no one being out of line in either of those threads. People disagree, its a fact of life
[01:35] SE Ogre: he clarified his opinion, he didn't jab anyone
[01:35] DarkLordessDara: I thought Sanis said he was Q
[01:35] SE Ogre: no
[01:35] DarkLordessDara: oh ok, so I can continue to post then to the threads
[01:36] SE Ogre: I am bordering on closing the thread and moving it to the staff threas, because people are having a tough time understanding that they can disagree
[01:36] SE Ogre: staff forum*
[01:37] DarkLordessDara: Tasha is a guy?
[01:38] SE Ogre: I dunno
[01:38] DarkLordessDara: not that it matters of course
[01:38] SE Ogre: he was figuratve
[01:38] DarkLordessDara: I still stand firmly by my opinion of the ill treatment of the newbie
[01:38] DarkLordessDara: but I think I covered that in the threads
[01:38] SE Ogre: If this is going to continue to be a source of stress, I think moving the threads where they can't be seen by the general posters is the best course of action
[01:39] SE Ogre: thats fine and I think you did state your opinion clearly
[01:40] DarkLordessDara: oh ok, I think I know who Q is now.. it makes sense..
[01:40] DarkLordessDara: thanks
[01:40] SE Ogre: ok
[01:41] SE Ogre: would you be satisfied if I moved the threads?
[01:42] DarkLordessDara: actually I'm not bothered as much now as I used to be by things.. I could keep posting if the discussion is continuing.. it's up to you
[01:42] SE Ogre: I think I will, no need for them to continue any longer and no need to see any others taking sides over the issue causing more stress to anyone
[01:45] DarkLordessDara: ok
End of DarkLordessDara buffer: Sun Oct 28 01:45:26 2001

[Q]

>_<

Just ban me. It'll make life easier.

[TheHolo.Net]

:lol

No worries really. I know what being an Admin means and the problems it entails. You did nothing wrong, she just can't handle people disagreeing and always runs to others to get back up.

[Sanis Prent]

|I yeesh....

The pharmacies are in full-tilt making Cipro...maybe we should switch gears to Prozac :(

Me? Q? WTF....I have nothing in common with that dickhead! :lol

[Q]

Mentat Paradigm (2:50:46 AM): Hi. For your information, Q is NOT Sanis/LL/Whoev er. I am. As a point of note, you shouldn't point the finger at someone unless you know for certain it's them. If you have a problem with anything I said, you could have PMed me instead of accusing the wrong person
DarkLordessDara (2:51:55 AM): Look, I was told that Q was Sanis.. and I accused no one.. did I put that in my posts anywhere? no.. so you really need to get your facts straight
Mentat Paradigm (2:52:36 AM): No, you didn't put it in your posts... but you *did* put it in your IMs. *You* need to get your facts straight and drop the "Holier-than-thou" attitude
DarkLordessDara (2:52:56 AM): I have no such attitude.. you don't know me so you need to quit with the false accusations
Mentat Paradigm (2:54:27 AM): Quite the contrary, I know you quite well. And my "accusations" do have merit. The reason why I jumped on you was because your posts portrayed passive-aggresive bashing to Tasha, who did nothing wrong
DarkLordessDara (2:54:29 AM): I was the one told that Q was Sanis.. you need to get a grip on the facts
DarkLordessDara (2:55:18 AM): No one I know well would speak to me this rudely so once again, your facts are not correct.. Tasha was rude to a 14 year old newbie and I let her know of my displeasure of that uncalled for treatment
DarkLordessDara (2:55:22 AM): And I'll do it again and again..
Mentat Paradigm (2:55:24 AM): And you couldn't simply ask if this was true? Or perhaps even asked Sanis himself
DarkLordessDara (2:55:43 AM): I don't care who plays the multiple hidden names..
Mentat Paradigm (2:56:04 AM): So you opted instead to go by second hand information and blame him?
DarkLordessDara (2:56:22 AM): I put the blame on no one but Tasha and her ill behavior toward a newbie
Mentat Paradigm (2:56:29 AM): And I said I knew you... I never said I was your buddy or your pal. There's a marked difference there
DarkLordessDara (2:56:56 AM): There is a huge difference.. I only let a few actually know me.. there are too many two faced people out there.. so I'm sure you don't know me at all
Mentat Paradigm (2:57:20 AM): "ill behaved"? As I pointed out in my last post, Tasha was quite polite. To quote myself: "Was it a warm welcome? No. Was it polite? Yes."
DarkLordessDara (2:57:51 AM): Tasha was not polite at all..she was short and rude with her post.. a more tactful and gentle approach was more appropriate for one so young as Korran
Mentat Paradigm (2:58:06 AM): And I don't need your permission to know you... that can be accomplished quite well from the attitude you portray
DarkLordessDara (2:58:29 AM): Not at all.. there is no attitude I portray.. I stand up for someone who is being picked on such as Korran and I will do it again
DarkLordessDara (2:59:00 AM): The attitude and quippy snide remarks would be evidenced in your last post which was a personal attack on me..
DarkLordessDara (2:59:08 AM): Perhaps you should look in the mirror..
Mentat Paradigm (2:59:39 AM): I'll agree that Tasha could have perhaps been more tactful. But why is it any more your judgement call to "reprimand" her than for her to correct someone else? Hello Pot
DarkLordessDara (2:59:57 AM): I did not reprimand her..
DarkLordessDara (3:00:04 AM): Nice twist on my words though
DarkLordessDara (3:00:11 AM): Nice try yet again.. but you fail
Mentat Paradigm (3:00:22 AM): Indeed it was a snippy response, because I find your attitude unsettling.
DarkLordessDara (3:00:51 AM): I have no attitude.. you are the one who speaks condescendingly.. I merely addressed a situation after Tasha had posted..
Mentat Paradigm (3:00:53 AM): Not twisting your own words at all. You tried to portray yourself as somehow better than her, which you have no right to
DarkLordessDara (3:01:05 AM): Do I pick on newbies?
Mentat Paradigm (3:01:14 AM): Condenscendingly? By telling you that you have no right to judge other people?
DarkLordessDara (3:01:17 AM): I think not.. so in that respect my behavior is better than what I saw from her..
Mentat Paradigm (3:01:20 AM): How was it "picking on"?
DarkLordessDara (3:01:21 AM): Your point is?
DarkLordessDara (3:01:48 AM): Jumping on a newbie is picking on them.. it was his first second and third posts on swfans..
Mentat Paradigm (3:01:57 AM): My point is that you're calling me "condenscending" when all I've said is that you have no right to act better than anyone else
DarkLordessDara (3:02:05 AM): Being short and rude to them in public is picking on a newbie..
Mentat Paradigm (3:02:24 AM): "Jumping on", "being short and rude"... you're being vague. Cite an example.
DarkLordessDara (3:02:34 AM): I'm not acting as if I am better than anyone else.. I simply am not rude to newbies and I don't personally attack people like you did to me..
Mentat Paradigm (3:02:38 AM): I have the thread saved. I can quote everything that was said verbatim, in context
DarkLordessDara (3:02:57 AM): I'm sure you can.. here's a gold star for you and your sarcasm..
DarkLordessDara (3:03:20 AM): I also know that I am not alone in my opinion..
Mentat Paradigm (3:03:36 AM): You still havent answered me: What was said that was "jumping on [a newbie]" or "being rude"?
DarkLordessDara (3:03:37 AM): Many were abhored by the blatant rudeness displayed to young Korran..
Mentat Paradigm (3:04:06 AM): And just as many are fed up with your self-righteous need to look like some saviour
DarkLordessDara (3:04:06 AM): I have addressed this already.. I will not waste my time reiterating my statements to you when you have them all logged to read to your heart's content..
DarkLordessDara (3:04:21 AM): I could care less what people who don't know me think of me..
Mentat Paradigm (3:04:31 AM): No, you never cited a specific example, instead opting to remain vague.
DarkLordessDara (3:04:39 AM): I am opting not to waste my time with you..
Mentat Paradigm (3:04:50 AM): Then you shouldnt care less what I said and thus never brought this up with other people
DarkLordessDara (3:04:51 AM): Which is my choice..
DarkLordessDara (3:04:59 AM): Nice twist again..
DarkLordessDara (3:05:03 AM): Too bad you don't stick to facts..
Mentat Paradigm (3:05:31 AM): How is it a twist? In your opinion, I dont know you. And you said that you couldnt care less what people who dont know you think of you.
DarkLordessDara (3:05:56 AM): You twist what I say to your own benefit.. you did it in the thread and you are trying to do it here..
DarkLordessDara (3:06:08 AM): Nice try again..
Mentat Paradigm (3:06:19 AM): Moreover, instead of bringing it up to me by, say, private messaging/e-mailing me and saying "I think you're being rude to me", you brought it up to someone else
Mentat Paradigm (3:06:44 AM): Tell me how I'm twisting? Again, you're remaining vague and not making any speicific points
DarkLordessDara (3:07:01 AM): No, I was told by many that you were being a complete ass to me.. notice I didn't respond to you in a personal attack as you did to me.. I have manners..
Mentat Paradigm (3:07:03 AM): If I misunderstood you, then by all means - Correct me
DarkLordessDara (3:07:19 AM): I won't waste my time with talking to someone who only hears himself..
Mentat Paradigm (3:07:45 AM): I just told you that I'm willing to listen to you and you claim that I only hear myself?
DarkLordessDara (3:08:02 AM): Wow, I marvel at yet another twist..
Mentat Paradigm (3:08:49 AM): I invited you to correct my interpretation of your statement[s]. Instead, you're acting condenscending by claiming you're not going to waste your time with me, as if you were somehow more important. Moreover, you constantly claim I'm somehow twisting your words, but never opt to clarify what you meant
DarkLordessDara (3:09:12 AM): No I'm not more important than you, I simply choose not to talk to someone who has been rude to me..
Mentat Paradigm (3:09:38 AM): Rude? I'm telling you that you can clarify what you meant and I will retract my statements
DarkLordessDara (3:09:44 AM): I will not adhere to your trickery and mindgames this evening...
DarkLordessDara (3:10:00 AM): The threads are gone.. I just looked for them..
Mentat Paradigm (3:11:18 AM): You're still failing to state anything with solid substance, instead making vague claims about me twisitng your words and playing mindgames. In any even, it's obvious that this is becoming akin to banging my head against a wall. In the future, if you have a complaint, don't try to go over my head or make false assumptions - Take it up with me
Mentat Paradigm (3:11:20 AM): Goodnight

----

When I asked her to point out where and how Tasha was "Rude", she dodged the question. When I asked on at least half a dozen occaisions how I'm twisting her words, she failed to respond. When I invited her to correct my interpretations of what she meant, she said she's not "wasting her time" with me. Talking to her is about as fruitful as banging my head against a brick wall: She dodges questions better than Neo dodges bullets.

Edited to include timestamp, EST (-5) Daylight Savings time.

[TheHolo.Net]

Circular arguments that go nowhere are her fortay, I know it quite well, just as I know that she is the one making others belive her opinions to be right by bombarding them in IM with her well structered words with false points and the like. I am almost certian the entire convo I had with Firebird was fed by her and such.


[01:15] DarkLordessDara: Did you tell Q I thought he was Sanis?
[01:15] *** Auto-response sent to DarkLordessDara: I am away from my computer right now.



[01:17] FIRE354658: I'm back
[01:17] *** Auto-response sent to FIRE354658: I am away from my computer right now.
[01:18] FIRE354658: Ogre, who is Q? He is harassing Dara.
[01:19] FIRE354658: Dude, Who is Q?

I opted not to reply as neither question is really any of their business, and my online status was clearly "away".

[Sanis Prent]

I'm having flashbacks to almost exactly 6 months ago...

She's very silver-tongued, or at least tries to be, but she dissolves quite quickly under a microscope. She's a two-faced deceitful woman who mesmerizes people who don't know better with a lot of sweet talk, and I regret that my position as mod has caused me to be a hipocrite and talk to her.

I'd gone from April 30th to now without doing so :(

Here's to sacrifices, I guess :\

[Q]

I IMed her under my Mentat Paradigm name. If she really wants to know, she can find out. That s/n is clearly displayed in both Gurney and Mort's profiles, and it's not too hard to find out who they are.

And how I am harassing her? If she has a qualm with someone, she should take it up with them personally - Not try to go over their heads.

BTW - I can timestamp the previous convo. I just noticed that the timestamp is saved as part of the html file, and is simply uncommented.

[TheHolo.Net]

I’m in a similar position with Sanis and had a great deal of trouble with Dara and her “IM troops” (What Sanis calls those who are so easily mislead by her sweet talk) about 6 or 7 months ago too, and hadn’t been on speaking terms with her until recently, because of some issues that recently came up at TSE.

She is sooooooo manipulative and I’m not even sure she does it on purpose, though part of me screams at me that she is. Her influence on those without enough experience is what causes problems and is bound to again, sadly enough.

My timestamps all reflect Mountain Daylight time.

[Sanis Prent]

I'll release this from my archives, as I believe it bears some relevance on this problem. This occurred April 30th, give or take.

Dara Shadowtide: at the risk of setting things off badly.. I must be honest, but not hateful in any way..
LoungeLzrd: sure, go ahead
Dara Shadowtide: I do agree that if you play as many characters as you do in as many groups as you do.. that you should be ready at the drop of a hat to defend yourself without getting upset or taking offense.. it is logical to suspect someone like you of looking out for one of your other groups since you are in so many
LoungeLzrd: but there isn't a single precedent to give a reason for that suspicion. I could understand it if I'd had that problem before or something
Dara Shadowtide: the precedent is the fact that you are in so many groups with so many characters now and so many locked forums..
Dara Shadowtide: your merely playing all of them causes natural suspicion regardless of who you are
LoungeLzrd: thats what I think is the problem :-( no trust
Dara Shadowtide: I will not trust someone who plays that many characters and that has access to all the info.. sorry but no one else does that
Dara Shadowtide: I would feel better only if you had no access to any locked forum in all of the groups you were in, then I think I could have some trust because sensitive information would not be occuring
LoungeLzrd: I guess that's kinda what I'm saying though. I've been with TSE for 5 months, going on six. I've done this, even as I had all this information. Its like not wanting your mom to own a kitchen knife, because you think she might stab you :-\
Dara Shadowtide: The only person who should have access to all the group's information would be a GM who is a non-participant IMO.. it's how I feel as a roleplayer of one major and one minor character that I stopped playing.. everyone is free to make their choices, but when you are in as many groups as you are and are in SO, the trust will not be there from me.. sorry
LoungeLzrd: then don't trust me. Don't know what else to say.
Dara Shadowtide: And I am also saying that Rama and Sums don't owe an apology for having an opinion similar to mine.. one apologizes when they are wrong, not for merely stating an opinion on the security of a group
Dara Shadowtide: I am stating that I don't trust any player with a huge amount of characters that has access to a great deal of sensitive information. Now what they do with that information, only they can know.. no one else will ever know whether they used that information to benefit another group. That's too much of a variable for me to base trust on. It's not a personal issue at all.
LoungeLzrd: I'm not going to get into this subject, because this is the point where I draw a line on what is a game and what is something that I truly won't tolerate from anybody IRL. If I'm not trusted, and what I've done in the past 5 months doesn't warrant trust on something like this, then you should kick me out of TSE. I would do the same to anybody I didn't trust. At least I'd be telling them the truth up front :-\
Dara Shadowtide: You didn't have this many characters when you joined TSE though.
LoungeLzrd: Anbira, Jubei, Sanis, Senator Paelotu, Eluna Thals, Captain Fena
Dara Shadowtide: Look what you do is your own thing. This is a game, a game I play for fun not to have sensitive information at risk to make the game not fun.
Dara Shadowtide: And the cats
LoungeLzrd: that is how many I had at the time I joined TSE
Dara Shadowtide: The rest were minor characters at the time though. Sanis has his own board and business now, the cats are up and running..
LoungeLzrd: Anbira, Jubei, Sanis, Eluna Thals, Cirrsseeto, Sarrtarroa
LoungeLzrd: Sanis always had that board
LoungeLzrd: Eluna was in Intel
LoungeLzrd: Cirrsseeto is an illiterate slave
Dara Shadowtide: Look, you don't need to be getting upset. I merely wanted to explain a point of view from some people who don't play alot of characters in alot of groups. I just wanted you to see it from my side. You jumped all over Sums and Rama when I feel the same way and so do some others who are afraid to speak against anything you choose to do. It's your choice, just don't get upset when your motives might be questioned when coincidences arise, ok?
LoungeLzrd: I'm very calm right now, Dara.
Dara Shadowtide: I hope so. You seemed a little defensive there for a bit, that's all.
LoungeLzrd: no, I'm just being honest.
LoungeLzrd: if you don't trust me, I shouldn't be around at all.
Dara Shadowtide: Please, lol, who am I? I am no one compared to the legendary LL..
LoungeLzrd: call me Charley.
Dara Shadowtide: Hello Charley.
LoungeLzrd: LL's just a character.
Dara Shadowtide: So how come you can't understand where Sums and Rama were coming from in SO then?
LoungeLzrd: I guess its just an irreconcilable view on the concept of trust, I suppose.
LoungeLzrd: All I'm saying is that I shouldn't be in the group at all if I'm not trusted. Should have been told that in december, so I wouldn't have invested the time.
Dara Shadowtide: I always trusted the roleplayers in the tabletop group because I knew them personally in real life and we all just had one AD&D character to play. The DM knew all the info about all of us since he was running the show of course. But, this is online, trust is a rare commodity and it is impossible to truly know.
Dara Shadowtide: You weren't in SO when you first started either though so that was not an issue then I suppose.
Dara Shadowtide: Like I said, I was merely defining why Sums said what he said... not saying you should not be in a group. Where did I say that?
LoungeLzrd: I said that.
Dara Shadowtide: Ok, well I didn't say that, now did I?
LoungeLzrd: I said, if there is no trust, I shouldn't even be in TSE to begin with. Trust is paramount above all things
LoungeLzrd: I never insinuated that you said that.
Dara Shadowtide: Ok, because at no time did I suggest you not being in TSE or that you leave.
LoungeLzrd: I know.
Dara Shadowtide: I thought at one time on swfans it was recommended to alleviate any suspicion of sensitive information being leaked by those in several groups to choose one group as the main one to be in the locked forums and then not allow themselves to be permitted in any locked forums in any of the other groups.
LoungeLzrd: The issue is trust. You don't trust me. Summs doesn't trust me. Rama doesn't trust me. You have enough right there to warrant my removal from TSE.
Dara Shadowtide: No one said you needed to be removed from TSE.. why do you keep going there?
LoungeLzrd: Because there is no trust coming from the people I am talking to.
LoungeLzrd: I can seemingly maintain trusting relationships with nearly everybody who's been around the RPs here, and I cannot do such things with TSE's command hierarchy. Its a problem that will only make others. If I were Rama, and he were me, I would do the same.
Dara Shadowtide: Sums and Rama commented on your cat group movements and actions which came right after some plans in SO. They pointed out their concern about actions by TSE which would benefit your other alternate characters, correct?
LoungeLzrd: the actions were shown to be put into place 2 weeks before that
Dara Shadowtide: There were threads, yes.
Dara Shadowtide: And at no time did Sums or Rama call you a liar.
Dara Shadowtide: Even Nuri commented on how those kinds of actions seemed suspicious which she is sure happens to anyone who plays multiple characters no matter how well they manage it.
LoungeLzrd: My being in SO and those accusations being mentioned are enough. By putting me in SO, they said they trusted me. Then, they say they do not. They give what I say value, then they devalue it. Hence, calling me a liar.
Dara Shadowtide: No one called you a liar.
LoungeLzrd: there are many ways to say liar without the actual word being used.
Dara Shadowtide: Well they still didn't say that or imply that. They just pointed out suspicious actions to protect TSE's welfare.
LoungeLzrd: If there were suspicions, and they did indeed trust me like they said they did, then the trust would have taken care of that. Mentioning those suspicions speaks volumes.
Dara Shadowtide: No it doesn't. Like Nuri said, it's a common reaction to people who play multiple characters no matter who they might be.
LoungeLzrd: Then my membership at TSE should never have happened, because I have been doing this from the get-go.
Dara Shadowtide: Aren't you taking this a bit too personally when it's just a game?
LoungeLzrd: Game and OOC are oil and water to me
LoungeLzrd: If I wasn't trusted to play the game from the beginning, why was I allowed to play?
Dara Shadowtide: See, you are taking it personally..
LoungeLzrd: exactly.
LoungeLzrd: The moment we stopped talking about RP and started talking about people behind the computer not trusting ME, not Anbira......it became personal in an OOC fashion
Dara Shadowtide: I'm still going with Nuri and Rama and Sums in a natural reaction to anyone playing multiple characters.. regardless of who they are or how long they have been around, etc.
Dara Shadowtide: Sums and Rama saw something, they commented on it OOC.
Dara Shadowtide: I saw it too.
Dara Shadowtide: That's all it was.
LoungeLzrd: and that is how I took it. OOC.
LoungeLzrd: What are you going to do?
Dara Shadowtide: About what in particular?
LoungeLzrd: me.
Dara Shadowtide: Why would I be doing something? I am not following the logic here..
LoungeLzrd: I am not trusted, and the situation obviously hasn't been healed by time or effort.
LoungeLzrd: Myself, I'm having a great time at TSE and enjoy RPing there very much
Dara Shadowtide: It's not just you, aren't you listening? Nuri summed it all up and I have put her exact words here already.. it's a common reaction! to ANYONE.. this isn't about you personally..
LoungeLzrd: but, my being in TSE is causing some definite angst amongst you and others.
Dara Shadowtide: LOL! angst?
LoungeLzrd: I'm not trusted, whether its for a personal reason, or because I have a lazy eye, or whatever random reason
LoungeLzrd: that is irrelevant
Dara Shadowtide: Your recent actions and coincidental timing of the two groups you have characters in caused a natural reaction..
LoungeLzrd: as I said, that is not the point
LoungeLzrd: the point is....I'm not trusted
Dara Shadowtide: But that was the whole point..
LoungeLzrd: we could've been talking about Rama thinking I ate the last dorito...and I would feel exactly the same about this.
Dara Shadowtide: My point of speaking to you regarding this was to say that I agreed with what Sums and Rama saw happen with regard to the TSE actions and plans.. and subsequent posts by your cat guy.. that is all.
LoungeLzrd: I know. I had a hunch this was how you felt on the issue. There's nothing wrong with that, Dara.
LoungeLzrd: You're being truthful, and that is good.
Dara Shadowtide: You have always been honest and very truthful with me and I appreciate that as well.
LoungeLzrd: So how do we deal with this breech of trust?
Dara Shadowtide: There's really nothing to be done in my opinion. If any occurance of coincidences come up between the two groups that anyone is in, I'm sure it will be addressed like it was this time. You live, you learn.
LoungeLzrd: but that doesn't really do anything, you know?
LoungeLzrd: Do you feel that you trust me any more than you did before this conversation?
Dara Shadowtide: Not if you still play multiple characters that have access to all the locked forums of all the groups you are in.. Like I said, it's not personal at all. You are a very nice guy to talk to but that doesn't change how many people you play that have access to sensitive information. Sorry.. that's me.. my flaw or whatever, but it's my opinion.
LoungeLzrd: We both know that isn't going to happen. We're rather diametrically opposed when it comes to multiples.
Dara Shadowtide: Each of us is as diverse and unique as the world we live in and we will have our own set of beliefs and opinions that make us who we are today.
LoungeLzrd: yes, but without trust...there is very little at all to base anything on.
LoungeLzrd: would you invite somebody to play poker with you if you thought they cheated at cards?
Dara Shadowtide: This isn't in person.. this is the internet.
LoungeLzrd: cite me a reason why that would be any different?



The convo dragged on...as you can imagine.

[TheHolo.Net]

Yes, very similar to what happened in the threads I moved. She couldn’t handle the fact that someone had a different opinion than she did. Her use of the words “natural reaction” and “everyone” make it evident that she believes that all people should think as she does. x_x That’s my interpretation.

[Q]

At least she answered your questions. |I

[TheHolo.Net]

Sanis had a good idea that I wish I had thought of earlier, splitting the topics and starting over. Please don't remove/delete the redirect to the moved topic from this forum or it will also delete the topic in the OOC forum that was moved.

Still adjusting to the abilities vBulletin provides.

[Champion of the Force]

|I

I don't know what it is with Dara - it seems as though if you post something that doesn't agree with you she's chasing you all around until she get's an explanation or an apology or something.

She sent me a PM last week complaining about a post I did when she asked why her post total remained the same under her name (she didn't realise it auto-updated). I had made a joke regarding it, full of :), :p and :lol to stress the fun in the post, but apparently she still took offense and insisted we should be 'more professional'.

Professional my **** - when I used to use my 'profesional' mode everyone accused me of being an unemotional zombie who couldn't connect with posters. :rolleyes