So is Khadi REALLY the Indian homespun jedi robe fabric?

[kimncris]

any useful information contained herein was about to fall off of the board at pg. 20 so I will move my photos over to the ASAP board for a litle more longevity...

I do not know how to move an entire thread- is that even possible?

ck

*edit*
well apparantly this topic is not quite dead...

below are some pics of the Khadi I got for my Jedi robes.

The main jist of my original post was that I was a little dissapointed with it because it did not seem all that exact...
which was followed by a really aweful pic. I posted the close ups later...

[kimncris]

here are some close-ups:

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1477575&a=13656820&p=53470535

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1477575&a=13656820&p=53470531

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1477575&a=13656820&p=53470529

-cris

[Razmeister]

You want to talk to JediVic about this - he and I scoured LA's famous Garment District and nobody knew what Khadi was... And all the homespun fabrics we saw looked nothing like the Jedi tunic material in the photos.

I've suggested talking to the costume department at Lucasfilm. I can't imagine they'd be uncooperative. A little persistence and tenacity can get you anything! :)

Guy

[reinone]

The white one seems really close to OWK in EP1 to me. Just needs to be dyed. Is it wool? I ask because I hear that if it isn't wool it ain't it.:rolleyes:

[masterjedi322]

From the discussion over at the ASAP board, I believe Indian Homespun is about as common a type of fabric as cotton. Finding an exact match may be difficult. I'm fairly sure some people decided the homespun was completely untreated and such.

Check for more threads at pub23.ezboard.com/fpropreplicasfrm49 (http://pub23.ezboard.com/fpropreplicasfrm49)

Hope that helps.

[Got Maul]

Nice shots Kimncris ! Unfortunately finding this piece has become such a pain. What you have to look for is wool...crinkled gauze like wool...here is a sample and our target :

http://www-scf.usc.edu/~jsalcedo/swatchreal.jpg

What is that last one made of ? Secondly, did you stretch it out before taking that pic ? Looks like muslin from here...that is fairly close, something that vic was about to use, until he found a very unique and tighter weave down here....coincidently from the same place that once had the real fabric (that JK2 used to have for their obiwans) !!

Jose

[kimncris]

Thanks for the input guys!

The thing that stands out in JediVic's discovery from talking to Ian McCraig is that he said something like "what Ghandi wore..."

Every Indian person I have talked to, when I mention Ghandi, immediatly says "Khadi." The Khadi is the darkest yellow rough weave fabric in the photos above. The middle one I was told was cotton linen, and the third- lightest colored one is crushed cotton cheesecloth.

All of them are cotton- and all are from India.

I did not stretch them out at all, I just laid them flat on the scanner. The top picture is a little smaller than actual size I believe- I was unable to get the full size picture to load into my photopoint acct :(

the close up pictures are at the maximum scanner resolution. If you copy the photo and then view it in photoshop with the rulers- the actual size would be about 2" wide.

I took my sample to several Indian stores and every one of them said "cotton? - we do not import cotton because of the extremely high duties" or "cotton- you will not find that here..." etc.

In my mind- I think the cheesecloth looks the closest in texture from a distance because it has that crumpled look, but the weave is so perfect that I do not think it is "homespun."

I am going to wash 1/2 of my sample to see what happens when the Khadi shrinks- but for now I have my doubts that "khadi" is the droid we are looking for.

BTW- Got Maul- where did the fabric sample you have come from? Is it a photo of the real costume?

ck

[Sith Sheriff Brody]

I thought the stuff was raw silk...

?


-SSB

[westies14]

Qui Gon's was the one that was thought to be raw silk. The fabric being discussed above is Obi-Wan's.

-D

[Sith Sheriff Brody]

OK. My mistakte.


-SSB

[kimncris]

here are the washed close-ups

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1477575&a=13656820&p=53536238

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1477575&a=13656820&p=53536259

ck

[Blind Jedi]

oooooooo! That white looks pretty good cris.

[kimncris]

the white looks the most like the book photos I have from a distance- but from close-up it does not really seem right to me- don't you think?

I also was under the impression that it SHOUDN'T be white in it's natural state?

It it that photo above that Got Maul posted that is haunting me...

-cris

[reinone]

I found that material at a local fabric store(the white one). They have a nice tan color also. Its real thin and would have to be layered. If its close enough I might get some to make a suit. But I want to make sure. I also found a raw silk material that looks like QGJ's suit.

[Darth Eagle]

Ghandi wear Khadi? When I ask my Indian friends what Ghandi wear, they say dhoti. Wooo, so which one is the correct one? (Just don't start telling me it's verthi. Worse still, all 3 are cotton materials)

UPDATE
Opps, I forget to add; that wrinkled cotton material is actually cheesecloth.
I thought of using it for my Handmaid gown but got to know that the wrinkles may get smoothen after some washings. Moreover, it's pretty thin when undyed (well, the dyed ones doesn't look that gauze-like as the white/unbleached ones).

[kimncris]

Hi DE!

My understanding is that a Dhoti is the name of the garment (please don't be offended if there is anyone here who is Indian) that is worn sort of like a loose diaper around the legs and upper body. It can be made of cotton/Khadi, or silk. My friend told me that it is a traditional garment that is worn to keep cool on hot days and sometimes for ceremonial occasions.

Do you have a sample of verthi? I hadn't heard of that one yet?

-cris

[leiasky]

The washed white looks the closest and after it's washed looks like a cotton blend. I believe the material was dyed to the cream color that it looks like in the film. Of course, the lighting could have made it look that color, but I tend to doubt it would change that much.

Katarra has samples of the fabric that Jose posted and it is wool gauze, but we can't find it anywhere.

Calling Lucasfilm for info would be your best bet. Ask them if they could give you the types of material used for the Jedi costumes. All they can say is no...

[kimncris]

This is the report that pointed me in the direction of India.

JediVic posted this a while ago, but this is from TFN.



How To Make Obi-Wan's Episode II Costume
Sat, Apr 14, 01 09:32:06 PM EDT
The other night at the Iain McCaig lecture, I (Scott) saw Vic Mignogna from Lightsaber World approach Iain with a question. He wanted to know what kind of fabric Obi-Wan's costume was made from. Vic had been searching for an identical match, but had no luck. Vic lets us know what Iain told him:


All the Jedi Costumes were made out of a material called Indian Homespun. It is a light woven fabric like Ghandi wore. It is hand woven in a variety of different patterns and shade of white to tan. That is why so many Jedi tunics were different shades. They also dyed the same fabric black for the Sith robes.
You can find this fabric at some Indian stores. Hopefully you can find an exact match! Thanks to Vic for the report!


So when I read this, I assumed all of the robes and even the cloaks were the Indian homespun stuff. The concensus seems to be that the outer cloaks are wool, however.

I think I am going to stick with cotton. I do not relish the idea of wearing 4 layers of wool! :)

-cris

[leiasky]

Indian Homespun is not a fabric but a generalized term for the Indian fabric and its weave. Just like cotton...There are many weaves, variations and blends of cotton.

The outer cloaks were wool. I did read that somewhere.

[ShezaPropstitute]

Just a thought, but I don't think Ian is the person to ask about the fabrics. He was the designer for Ep1, but Trisha Biggar was the person who translated the designs to real costumes. I think she'd be a little more familiar with the fabrics chosen. As to how to get a hold of her...I haven't got a clue, unfortunately. :(

Maybe some of our members from "across the pond" would have better luck? Lord, I wish I could visit the garment district over there!

Darc

[TServo4]

So has anyone actually called or written to see if Lucasfilms' costume department will divulge the secret? I don't think they'd need to keep it so guarded.

[kimncris]

I have not called or written Lucas myself, but perhaps JediVic has taken steps in that direction? Since I have enough khadi to make my costume(I hope) my quest is pretty much at an end- but I did want to share my results with everyone in case there were others who might benefit :)

-cris

[westies14]

Has anyone looked into having the Obi Wan fabric custom-made? I'm sure it's a ridiculously expensive process, but I also believe we would have enough interested people to make it a bit more cost effective, and perhaps worth doing...

[kimncris]

...well presumably we could all make some for ourselves at home with enough time and a small investment in a chakra and loom right? :)

I think the major problem with commissioning someone to weave up a bunch for us is that nobody has yet found the exact fabric to provide as a sample. Even then- I am not sure I would want to pay mega bucks for it anyway.

If I hadn't been lucky enough to have a friend who offered to bring me some fabric back from India- I would have been happy with plain old linen.

-cris

[Lucasberg]

Someone mentioned that Qui Gon's costume was thought to be Raw silk.
According to the Magic of Myth book "The under robes for the costumes of
both Ben and the Emperor are elegant Japanese kiminos of raw silk, beige
for Ben and black for the Emperor."

I would suspect in the name of continuity that Qui Gon's and Obi Wan's
in Episode I would have been made of the same material. I also cannot
see Lucasfilm chasing down some extremely odd, exotic and rare material
to make the costumes from, but I could also be wrong on that point.

[leiasky]

Lucas wrote:

<<Someone mentioned that Qui Gon's costume was thought to be Raw silk.
According to the Magic of Myth book "The under robes for the costumes of both Ben and the Emperor are elegant Japanese kiminos of raw silk, beige for Ben and black for the Emperor." >>

The MOM book would be talking about the orig SW Trilogy costumes, I believe.


<<I would suspect in the name of continuity that Qui Gon's and Obi Wan's in Episode I would have been made of the same material. I also cannot see Lucasfilm chasing down some extremely odd, exotic and rare material to make the costumes from, but I could also be wrong on that point. >>

From an interview with Trisha Bigger back when TPM was released, she said they had a MUCH bigger budget for costumes this time around and they were using it. I believe that did allow them to go after different, more exotic materials.

Also, for raw silk, I believe there are different blends. And how those blends look when washed/dyed, could be why Qui-Gon (looks dyed a tanish color) and Obi-Wan's (looks bleached or simple a natural undyed color) outfits look different.

[Lucasberg]

Thanks Tammy ;)

[ObiWannabe]

I have 6 yards of tawny raw silk, washed, in my costume closet, and I will swear on my larbel Qui that LFL did NOT use raw silk for any Jedi tunics.

I mean, it's a great material, and wears well - I've seen people in Got Maul's tunics of raw silk - but it's not THE thing they used.

Vic's managed to get info out of Trisha Biggar's assistant on the Episode 2 material (that stuff will be impossible to find because it literally doesn't exist) but she didn't tell him anything about Episode 1.

As for the samples and the question...I've got a sort of comment/question to pose to you folks. What's more important, the wrinkles or the overall look? Why would you want to look like you're wearing a Kleenex just because it was wrinkly? Most gauze - especially cheesecloth - is so light it's unsuitable to pass for a rugged garment like the Jedi tunics. They have a weight and flow to them that suggests something a lot heavier than gauze.

A friend of mine here, part of the Midwest Base now, did manage to get her hands on a very small amount of a wool crepe that was woven in an even, wrinkly manner, and the tunics look splendid. We're going to try to find more of it, but she thinks she bought up the last stock of it, and that was back in March.

However, stuff like that is rare. Most wrinkly-type stuff I've managed to come in contact with is not suitable for Jedi tunics. I would say, think hard about what factor is most important to you before trying to decide which fabric substitute to go with.

[kimncris]

thanks for the input ObiWannbe!

I agree with you about the cheesecloth- even though it has the "ribbed" look from a distance- it is just too thin. I chose the 1st yellow fabric- the one with the roughest texture. It's a nice medium weight cotton.

What do you mean the Ep II material doesn't exist? Are they using CG clothes? :) Or do you mean that they made thier own fabric?

-cris

[leiasky]

Kim wrote:

<<What do you mean the Ep II material doesn't exist? Are they using CG clothes? Or do you mean that they made thier own fabric?>>

Ayup! They had is specially made. So all those out there that just must have the absolute correct material for the EPII costumes, will be outta luck. Of course, if they have a lot of money to spend to have it specially made, well, that's another story altogether... ;)

[Lucasberg]

Leiasky, you said that Trish Beggar had stated in an interview...

"....they had a MUCH bigger
budget for costumes this time around and they were using it."

Is "it" raw silk or "the budget"?

Obiwannabe, when you say that raw slik was not used for any jedi tunics were you
meaning just in EP I? Because I have to go with the MOM book about Ben's and the
Emprorer's.

[ObiWannabe]

Oh, I meant just Episode 1.

Yeah, for E2 they went reportedly to someplace in France to have the material for Jedi costumes specially woven - for LFL and ONLY for LFL. Just enough to make what they needed for the film and no more.

Vic and I have been doing a ton of research on this, so take our words for it as much as you can - especially Vic's. He's on a hardcore search.

[leiasky]

Lucas wrote:

<<Leiasky, you said that Trish Beggar had stated in an interview...

"....they had a MUCH bigger
budget for costumes this time around and they were using it."

Is "it" raw silk or "the budget"?>>

:lol:
Budget.....

[kimncris]

So what fabric do you guys think we should be looking for?

Up until this point I thought the consensus was Khadi from India...but mine still does not look exactly right. The texture is there- but does not seem to be as "thick" as it looks in some photos.


-cris

[leiasky]

Cris wrote:

<<
So what fabric do you guys think we should be looking for?

Up until this point I thought the consensus was Khadi from India...but mine still does not look exactly right. The texture is there- but does not seem to be as "thick" as it looks in some photos.>>

My vote has always been wool gauze. :)

[ObiWannabe]

Oh, but wool gauze is so light, Tammy! I actually found some at a warehouse in Minneapolis a couple months ago, and was about to rejoice when I felt it. There is no way I would make a tunic out of that. A sheer sarong-like skirt maybe, but not a tunic!

[leiasky]

Obi wrote:

<<Oh, but wool gauze is so light, Tammy! >>

There are different weights, just like with all wool. I have swatches of this material and have seen the tunics that were made from it. They were definitely not light when all put together.

[jedivic]

Hi everybody....

I have been gone a while but saw this thread and wanted to chime in. What Obi Wannabe said is correct...I talked to an assistant of Trisha Biggar who told me that the stuff fro EP II was specially made in France, and that no more existed.

I do not believe it is just a wrinkled fabric for one minute. The ribs are clearly woven into the fabric. I have been keeping my eyes open but so far have not seen anything that nails it.

What Ian McCaig told me iwas either all a lie or just referring to EP I. Regardless, I want something that nails EP II.

Any discoveries will be greatly appreciated!!

[leiasky]

Vic, EPII fabric was specially woven for the film and is not available. EP1 fabric was not.

We'll just have to agree to disagree on this subject...:)

[reinone]

Got Maul or anybody that has seen and felt the fabric first hand - Is the fabric soft and stretchy? I found something close but it is uncertain.

[jedivic]

Leiasky...

We don't disagree.....that is precisely what I was saying....the Lucasfilm assisitant I spoke with said that the EP II costumes were made of a fabric that was specially woven for the film, and no more was available. The EP I costumes may very well have been an Indian homespun or Khadi fabric like Ian Mccaig spoke of, and more readily available. I saw the Maul costume at MOM and the fabric was exactly the same as Obi Wan's, only dyed black. However, as I said, I am most interested in the EP II fabric.....EP I is old news.

[kimncris]

Thanks for the input Vic!

Did you happen to snap any close up photos of the real deal while you were at MOM?

How different is the EP II stuff?

-cris

[jedivic]

You know, Chris....

I didn't! I'm not sure why, but the fact that it was black made it a little less easy to see the texture. EP II differs form I in that the fabric of Obi Wan's tunic is darker and has a woven ribbed texture to it. It doesn't look like something that would be that difficult to find......but it sure is!

[kimncris]

Darn...


well I think I have decided to do an EP II style but with the fabric I already have. I like the longer over the shoulders "sash" thing. I guess it will be a custom :)

thanks again for sharing your research!

-cris