PDA

View Full Version : Can I just do this for a second?!



JonathanLB
Aug 4th, 2001, 06:53:31 AM
I'm sorry but I have to analyze some of the commentary from critics about Rush Hour 2, mainly just for my own amusement, but possibly you could enlighten me as to why critics just are so dense.

I don't buy this whole "they see lots of movies every year therefore they are cynical" stuff. I see as many movies per year as any critic I bet, though I admit many of them are on video and DVD, not in theaters. Even so, I'm at the theater 75 times per year, so come on, that's a BS excuse. I see all of the "crap" that they see, only most of it isn't crap to me, it's enjoyable entertainment, if not downright awesome work.

So back to RH2.

The film got a very strong A grade from CinemaScore, rather remarkable if I may say so myself. This movie will have staying power a bit better than past films this summer, at least, and there isn't enough competition to knock it down 55% in its second weekend, no way. 45%, sure, maybe, but it could only drop 40% or so, good for the summer I guess.

"A film without any surprises or new ideas."

Ok how is this even REMOTELY relevant to an action comedy film? Is this critic smoking weed or just extremely stupid? NO NEW IDEAS?! What is that supposed to mean? Technically, no idea is new because it's all been done before in some respect, and surprises? What do you want a freakin' plot twist at the end of a comedy film? Get real! Go watch The Game, Fight Club, Planet of the Apes, or something like that, stay away from a great, entertaining movie like Rush Hour 2.

Here's one I agree with "...just not as funny as the original." Correct. It was MUCH funnier than the original, so this reviewer is right.

"How can a movie allow [Tucker] to be so obnoxious and make no acknowledgement that his behavoir is aberrant?"

Oooo!!!! You used a big, new word there, "aberrant," I'm glad that dictionary your mommy bought you was useful, Ebert. Now just work on your awful writing style and terrible grammar and maybe you'll be alright. You fat retard.

"Watching it is a soul-numbing experience, but that probably won't keep it from being a big hit."

Does that make you jealous? You got that little degree that says "Film Production Major," but you ended up being a lousy film critic making $40,000 a year from making fun of work you never could do? Come on buddy, it's going to be a big hit because you're the only one on the planet, besides the other critics, who didn't like the film.

"Comes off as a lot more cynical than comic ..."

Cynical? Do you even know what that word MEANS?! You just used it wrong, so look it up. Ebert has a dictionary, borrow his! Moron.

"Delivers its share of laughs, but offers nothing you haven't already seen."

Well I've seen reviews just like yours ten thousand times, and I'm a bit tired of seeing them too, but does that mean you shouldn't write them anymore? The movie was funny, and that is enough, certainly more than can be said of your idiotic review.

"Primarily appeals to those who don't tire of ethnic jokes and to Chanatics, as we Jackie diehards style ourselves."

You count yourself a Chan fan? Clearly not, or you would have liked one of his funniest movies. What is this "we" nonsense anyway? I guess nobody tires of ethnic jokes since everyone who sees it has liked it.

Ugg, my good buddy Mr. Turan, I cannot be too harsh here given that I have his home address and personal e-mail, haha, but "Lacking in spontaneity and freshness"? Well, movies, professional ones that is, are not spontaneous most of the time, they actually have scripts...

"Nobody expects this to be, say, The French Connection, but it should make a little more sense."

Ok, cool, you've seen some movie called The French Connection, which honestly I've never heard of, nor have my two friends (spending the night tonight), and now you're comparing it to a major blockbuster. You are so cool and so smart for having seen a movie like that. I wish I could grow up and make so little per year writing frickin' movie reviews. Gawd.

Part of a "good" review, "It often feels like the fifth or sixth rather than the second in a franchise."

Explain that to me please. I don't get it. How can it feel like the fifth or sixth? That line makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. What are you trying to say here?! What is this guy saying? Honestly. It feels like the sixth movie? Why, you saw the first one 5 times? I did too man, it was a good movie, but this is Rush Hour TWO! I'm just perplexed by that comment, because it is just as moronic as many of the other ones I've read.

Critics are really funny. If the critical consensus does not match the audience consensus, something is wrong with the critics because there are way too many audience members to say that millions of people are wrong, and a few hundred critics are right.

Do they know more about the film industry? Probably so, well damn I'd hope so because they should, but I'm extremely knowledgeable myself, and not every moviegoer is an idiot (the cynical attitude about the world), so they cannot all be wrong.

"A" grade means Rush Hour 2 rocked, no matter what critics said, so objectively speaking, since you can objectivity opinions (as CinemaScore and Variety do, among other polls), the critics were wrong! From my perspective, critics are not there to tell me JUST what they thought of the film, critics exist to give reviews that guide moviegoers. If those reviews are never accurate for most people, the critics need to be fired. They're not doing their job. I've said it before, and I'll say it again, if a critic cannot tell moviegoers what is good, meaning they do not have the pulse of the public, than they should lose their jobs because the ONLY reason such a useless job even exists is to help the less frequent moviegoer find the best films.

If I'm sitting here now trying to figure out what movie to see, I'm going to be screwed over because the critics have told me that Rush Hour 2 is not that good, they've told me Planet of the Apes is awful trash, JP3 is moronic and stupid, AI is a lousy film with a bad ending and it drags too long, and Tomb Raider is just a stupid, silly film with no plot and lousy dialogue. What should I see?! Apparently nothing, because those films all suck. Now, in my book, every one of those films was three to four stars (POTA and AI being the four star films), so the critics misled me. I'm apparently not in the minority given that most people seemed to like the films, at least. JP3 got a B-, whereas I'd give it a B. Rush Hour 2, to me, is a B+ film, whereas audiences gave it a strong A, so that shows apparently my opinion was not even as strong as the average moviegoer. Then again, anything "A" to me means "four stars," so I rarely hand out A's...

Go see RH2, it's the funniest movie in a long time -- definitely funnier than Scary Movie 2 or Evolution, both good films, but not that funny next to this.

ReaperFett
Aug 4th, 2001, 07:27:02 AM
I saw the trailer, and heard of some of the jokes, and it sounds as unfunny as hell. Its like Jay and Silent Bob. Funny as hell, until they let Chris Rock say a line. THank god its just a small part, so I can ignore it. First RH was fun enough, hardly deserving of a sequel for me.

with the 5th or 6th comment, he means the franchise is getting tired. Look and Rambo. They are making a fourth. Few would want one though. As the franchise is getting tiring. Ditto Rocky really



Aprently number 3 will be in Africa. Oh yippe, the potential there is...................none existant

ReaperFett
Aug 4th, 2001, 07:33:20 AM
Oh, and the French Connection is a classic, one of those truly great films. Its the film that got Roy Schneider the Jaws gig. It showed Gene Hackman for the great actor he is. And one of the best car chases ever shown on the silver screen If you havent seen it, see it. You wont be dissapointed

Dutchy
Aug 4th, 2001, 07:57:49 AM
Ok, cool, you've seen some movie called The French Connection, which honestly I've never heard of, nor have my two friends (spending the night tonight), and now you're comparing it to a major blockbuster.
Seriously? I'm surprised you've never heard of it. It won 5 Oscars in 1971, including Best Picture.


Ebert has a dictionary, borrow his! Moron.
Hehe, I loved this line. That was funny. :)

Jedieb
Aug 4th, 2001, 11:01:13 AM
Just a thought, would the critic's review of an action film Jon liked be any different than Jon's review of a Romantic Comedy that he didn't like? ;)

CMJ
Aug 4th, 2001, 12:16:54 PM
The critical consensus was that A.I. was really good. I saw WAY more positive CRITIC reviews for it than negative ones(probabably 70% to 30%), yet AUDIENCES HATED IT. But I agree with the critics(as you do Jon) on that one. Should the critics have been fired for realizing what kind of groundbreaking work we witnessed with that film?? I don't think so....

I actually tend to agree with critics more often than "the masses" anyways. You said the amount of films that you see doesn't affect your taste? I disagree to an extent. I am way less enamored with most S/FX extravaganza's than I was at a younger age BECAUSE I've seen more of them. I actually think the 2 years I've known you on this board I've seen your tastes change ever so slightly Jon.... So(and I'm not trying to be mean spirited here) calm down a little and grow up. Not everything has to be YOUR WAY of the HIGHWAY.

Darth23
Aug 4th, 2001, 12:18:36 PM
Never heard of the French Connection?

<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/embarassed.gif ALT=":o">


I've never really trusted reiews of comedy movies - since comedic tastes seem to be much more subjective.

Action movie reivews miss the point a lot also. I don't think critics who don't liek Chan or Tucker should even bother reviewing the film - but then, they're job is to sell papers (or get ratings) not to provide objective recommendations for movies.

foxdvd
Aug 4th, 2001, 02:31:11 PM
"Delivers its share of laughs, but offers nothing you haven't already seen."

Well I've seen reviews just like yours ten thousand times, and I'm a bit tired of seeing them too, but does that mean you shouldn't write them anymore? The movie was funny, and that is enough, certainly more than can be said of your idiotic review.


That is classic! Best part of your post Jon..

Oh, and I also think The French Connection s one of the all time greats..it comes to dvd soon!!!!!!


I agree..Rush Hour 2 was MUCH better then the first one..

ReaperFett
Aug 4th, 2001, 02:39:50 PM
its coming on DVD? Woo hoo!

foxdvd
Aug 4th, 2001, 02:45:29 PM
Yeah, both 1 and 2 coming to DVD Sept 25th... part of the 5 star collection..it will be a 2 dvd set for the movies, with lots of extras..

here is a link to amazon to read more

www.amazon.com/exec/obido...55-9239251 (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00003CXA3/qid=996950687/sr=2-2/ref=aps_sr_d_1_2/002-6212655-9239251)

JonathanLB
Aug 4th, 2001, 05:18:17 PM
Well cool, I will see The French Connection, and I figured it was probably some old classic, but I just don't get what that has to do with RH2, lol. I assume it is a good film, though.

CMJ, critics are naturally going to disagree with audiences sometimes, but it should be much less common. I am just saying that the sheer percentage of time that the critics disagree with audiences is so great that it makes them seem ineffective at telling us what movies we should see. That's why nobody listens to critics before seeing movies anymore, but I don't think that always was true. I think people used to be able to trust critics more than they do now.

Yeah, Fox, I agree with you for sure. I want to see RH2 again badly, that film ruled. I can't wait to see it again, but I have to drive forever to get out there.

I also agree with Darth23, if someone hates Chris Tucker or doesn't much like Chan, then there is little point in having the critic review RH2.

I wonder if I made a movie in 7 years or so, whether or not the LA Times would still have Kenneth Turan review it, even though I know him and he will by that time, hopefully, have given me a blurb for at least my first book. I think that'd be a conflict of interest, but who knows.

Jedieb, I don't much like romantic comedies, so I avoid seeing them, unless of course I think they are qualified wrong. Groundhog Day is one of my favorite comedies, but people call that a romantic comedy. In reality, it isn't, so I don't see how they call it that. A romantic comedy has to be ABOUT the romance part, but with humor added. Groundhog Day is just about the situation he finds himself in, and it's a comedy. I guess you could call Star Wars a romantic comedy if you can call Groundhog Day one, because SW has romance and comedy, haha. That alone does not qualify a film for that genre :)

===================

OK, on a side note, what the HELL is up with this stupid password prompt from www16.brinkster.com or something popping up on this EZBoard constantly?!?! How stupid is EZBOARD? I don't mind the damn ads but why am I getting a password prompt for frickin' ads?! LOL.

CMJ
Aug 4th, 2001, 05:35:20 PM
But I think that "older" people in general agree with critics *more often" than teens and early 20 somethings(of course I'm an early twentysomething...but I'm a unusual case). Alot of "blow'em up" flicks just don't do it for me like they used to. Same with the critics. Younger audiences however still eat'em up. Am I saying ALL teens and ALL adults are this way? Of course not....
Nonetheless it's something I've noticed. Still I can't say "yeah" or "nah" to RUSH HOUR 2 since I haven't seen it yet. I will soon though....

ReaperFett
Aug 4th, 2001, 05:55:45 PM
THEY PUT RCE ON THE FRENCH CONNECTION! F***!!!!!!!



So, my region 0 DVD player cant run it. Of course, I can wait for the Region 2 1 disk no extra DVD which is inevitable





AAAAAAAARRRRRRRGH!!!!!!!!!

Jedieb
Aug 4th, 2001, 07:25:57 PM
I'm puzzled why the critic would bring up The French Connection. It's a safe bet to say that TFC is a better film than RH or RH2, but the two movies are completly different kinds of movies. One is a police drama with a classic car chase, the other is an action comedy. You'd never compare The Onion Field with Naked Gun so why the hell would anyone compare TFC to RH2? That's a bit of a stretch.

ReaperFett
Aug 4th, 2001, 07:28:13 PM
tenius link is that Gene Hackmans character is a racist. And from the sounds of that review, he finds Tucker racist (easy enough to do). Awful link if thats it though :)

Jedieb
Aug 4th, 2001, 07:47:35 PM
Well I'm sure the film has its share of stereotypes. You're right, that's a bit of a stretch if that's the connection he was looking for. As for Chris Tucker, I usually find him INCREDIBLY annoying. He ruined The Fifth Element for me. Everytime he was on screen I felt physically ill. But he was halfway decent in RH, and I'm sure his performance in RH2 will be just as effective as the original.

And someone slammed Chris Rock earlier, what's up with that? His George Lucas line in the Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back trailer made me laugh out loud. And it looks like his voice work in Osmosis Jones is going to be hilarious.

ReaperFett
Aug 4th, 2001, 07:53:42 PM
Chris Rocks line I was criticising was the one about another white guy or something. Now, if thats so funny it had to be in the trailer, I fear for the film

Jedieb
Aug 4th, 2001, 07:57:02 PM
I don't remember that one. I guess I'll have to see the trailer again. But you have to admit, that Lucas line at the end is hilarious.

JonathanLB
Aug 4th, 2001, 08:34:14 PM
Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back is going to rule! The trailer is hilarious, and also, Chris Rock is one of the funniest guys around. Down to Earth is exhibit A. That film is absolutely hilarious.

Tucker was annoying in The Fifth Element, I agree with that, but I guess he was supposed to be, though. I still like Chris Tucker a lot, but I just don't know what they were trying to accomplish with his role in Fifth Element (which I just bought on DVD yesterday, speaking of it). When I first saw Fifth Element, I thought it was honestly the stupidest movie I had ever seen. I couldn't stand the whole "there is this big black evil blob coming at earth that will kill us all," hehe. After I saw it again on DVD, though, I ended up liking it a lot more. Visually, the film is splendid, and aside from annoyances (Tucker being a bit of one, and same with the blue opera singer), the film is actually pretty strong.

I also bought Unbreakable, The Sixth Sense, and Final Destination on DVD yesterday. Oh yeah, and the new R.E.M. CD, haha. :)

CMJ, teens do disagree with critics more, that's true, but I'm not the typical teen either, and I don't think my taste in films should be attributed to my age, because that's absurd. You and I, after all, have agreed on the best movies this year so far, if not in exact order, the exact same top three ;)

I still always enjoy a good summer blockbuster, but I'm not a fan of something like Armageddon. I see summer blockbusters for what they are, which is mostly just fun popcorn movies, though there are always the rare films during the summer season that are meant to be taken seriously and remembered, like AI, the Star Wars films, Gladiator, things like that. Then there are the Tomb Raider's, which are the staples of summer, and thank god for them I think. Tomb Raider was lots of fun and I saw it twice, but if the critics said it had a lousy script and a fairly weak plot, well they are basically right, but the plot was good enough for the action, and the dialogue wasn't exceedingly bad, just not good. Anyway, I'd give the movie 3.5 stars because I thought it succeeded at what it set out to do and I really enjoyed it, so that is enough.

ReaperFett
Aug 4th, 2001, 08:34:46 PM
funny, not hilarious. Excluding the white guy joke, good trailer

RHJediKnight
Aug 4th, 2001, 11:39:09 PM
Did anyone see Mark Hamill in the lightsaber fight in J&SBSB? That actually had me laughing, he looked so funny from what I saw (it was a really short clip though). And yeah, Chris Rock's George Lucas line was great. This might be the first Kevin Smith film I'll see in the theater, that is, if I go to see it.

Jedi Master Carr
Aug 5th, 2001, 01:48:46 AM
I agree with you mostly Jonathan about critics. Sometimes they make me angry and I never read them any more except maybe Ebert, I tend to agree with him most of the time, sometimes I find that he is wrong. The thing about critics is that they are just people like us. Their opinion should not matter more than anybody elses (although I think some of them think there's does). Is it is a useless job that anybody who knows how to write can do and that is why their opinion does not matter to me. I usually use the trailers or word of mouth to determine if I am going to see a movie. Then there are some films like JP3, EP2, LOTR I want to see when I hear about it.

JonathanLB
Aug 5th, 2001, 02:04:40 AM
Yes, I agree. To me, the most important thing is probably the trailer for sure. (Are you listening marketing executives? hehe).

Honestly, if a film has a trailer that just blows me away, I WILL SEE IT NO MATTER WHAT!!! Even if I have to drive forever, I will see it. If the trailer is good, but not great, I'll still go see it, providing I have time.

If the trailer is so-so, now the marketing department has really left their movie to chance. Now, I have to see who is doing the film and who is in it. Take that new Denzel Washington film, the one about him as a cop, training some new guy or something. The trailer honestly is not that good. It's a two-star trailer. I love Denzel, though, so I will be there. It's his star power that makes me want to see the film, because after The Hurricane and Remember the Titans, he's given me two of the best, oh, 20 movies in the last few years. Probably more like two of the best 15, really.

Next step. The trailer is not very good, or maybe it sucks even, and there's nobody attached who I especially like or know. Now, they've really screwed up badly. The key to a film with no names attached is great marketing, so someone just messed up badly here because I honestly like most trailers that are at least fairly inventive. Now, I have to read the critical reviews and hear what my friends/contacts say. If the critics trash the film, there is almost NO WAY I will see it, maybe ever.

Spider-Man had me from the concept, but then the trailer was so great, now there is no way in hell unless I am frickin' dead that I won't be there on opening day. I will be there.

I'm not hard to get into the theater, I mean I go every week, so if they can't convince me to see it, BOY are they in trouble!

In the summer of 2000, I saw 19 of the top 20 highest grossing films. I missed Road Trip, which is now one of my favorite recent comedies (seen it a few times in the last month and I have the DVD). In other words, if I'm not interested...your movie is in trouble!!! Or, it's a girlie film, in which case, move along, move along. ;)

CMJ
Aug 5th, 2001, 10:40:35 PM
I must say I think it falls somewhere in between the critical loathing of the film and "the average joe"'s opinion of it. I did find it funny at times...though at times Tucker annoyed the crap out of me(something he never did in the first film). The action sequences were inspired...but Chan's are always that way. Overall I liked the original more...but RH2 was a good(not great) sequel to a good(not great) original.

JonathanLB
Aug 5th, 2001, 11:23:13 PM
Umm...as my friend would say, "yeah ok whatever!" I don't think so! The second was FAR better than the original. The original was definitely a nice surprise and a great movie, but RH2 was frickin' awesome.

Chris Tucker isn't annoying at all, but if you don't like him, naturally you're not going to like the movie. I have no idea what would have annoyed anyone about him, since he's just damn funny, but hey whatever.

Rush Hour 2 is far better than the first movie. Audiences in general feel that way, which is good, because it IS better.

CMJ
Aug 5th, 2001, 11:27:31 PM
In your opinion it is. :)

RHJediKnight
Aug 6th, 2001, 12:04:58 AM
It seems to me that in most people's opinions it is...

JonathanLB
Aug 6th, 2001, 01:24:23 AM
haha, yeah exactly! Amen.

I saw it with three friends, and all of them thought Rush Hour 2 was better, me included, so that is four. From what I have heard from everyone and judging from the CinemaScore rating, people liked the second better. Even though the first still had basically an equal rating, but that means my stat is not disproven... :)

CMJ: "In your opinion it is."

Yes and MY opinion is the only one that matters, so neener neener neener! Haha. ;)

Darth23
Aug 6th, 2001, 09:54:05 AM
Jon bought an REM cd?

That was so PC of him.

:p :p :p

Dutchy
Aug 6th, 2001, 04:48:26 PM
Grades at the IMDb (http://us.imdb.com/Ratings?0266915) are good as well.