Thus, the Cold Wars Have Begun

[Vince]

With the fast forward largely done with (though I do still have a few questions I'll get to posting up in the proper place later), I think it's prudent we discuss where the proxy wars and battlefields will take place.

Aside from covert operations into each other's territory, I'm thinking a Knight or two (with the obligatory Intelligence and military support structure beneath them) may be installed as "advisors" to planets and systems in the neutral zone(s) for factions sympathetic to the Empire, and I'd be a bit disappointed if the Alliance didn't do the same thing, though not necessarily on the same planet, unless we want a Korea/Vietnam style conflict erupting almost immediately after the establishment of the Alliance.

Any particular planets in mind? I'll take a look at the map and see where a good war could be started and post up some ideas that could work for a large number of storylines for everyone.

[Reshmar]

The Centrality is An Imperial Supporter. Someone needs to keep an Eye on them.

[Captain Untouchable]

A few things that spring to mind -

The Hutts

The Alliance has a slightly stronger stomach for making deals with unsavoury types than the Empire has, including the Hutts. With the Empire completely cut off from Hutt space, that could be a problem. What if the Alliance cuts some sort of deal with the Hutts, giving them access to resources, free passage through their space, and so on? What if, heaven forbid, they actually manage to form an alliance with the Hutts? It's unlikely, but it's not the sort of thing that the Empire would want to sit back and allow, so presumably they'd take steps to covertly sabotage the Alliance-Hutt relationship: fake Alliance ships attacking Hutt convoys; pirates allegedly on the Hutt payroll attacking Alliance ships/worlds; etc. Perhaps the Hutt Cartels are even split: some loyal to the Alliance, some to the Empire.

Corellia & Duro

I know Duro is definitely neutral; not sure about Corellia. Even if Corellia is still officially part of Imperial space, it's always been semi-separate. It's also home to one of the founding resistance movements of the Rebel Alliance, and I doubt those people have gone anywhere. The Empire is presumably going to be pretty keen to get those resistance fighters gone, but local bureaucracy is going to make that exceptionally tricky. On the flip-side, Corellia is a long way from the Alliance border, so it would be especially hard for the Alliance to send any of it's new allies or resources. Basically, the Corellian Resistance would be one of the last vestiges of the Rebel Alliance.

Smugglers

The Rebel Alliance used smugglers extensively to sneak things past Imperial customs patrols. If there are still rebel cells on Corellia, Chandrila, Ithor, and so on, they'll still need those smugglers to send aid to those insurgents. However, because the Alliance is now a legit government they'll also need to start using taxation to generate revenue... and by their very nature, smugglers circumvent that. It creates an awkward catch-22, and the Empire could exploit that. The Empire is presumably a lot wealthier than the Alliance; perhaps they could afford to reduce their customs taxes: either the Alliance is forced to cut their own to remain competitive (which they can't afford to do), or traders choose to sell to Imperial worlds instead of Alliance worlds because it's more profitable.

Not all wars are fought with weapons, etc.

[Charley]

One wrinkle that might also be fun is that Fey'Dann (in the Carshoulis Cluster) is always at odds with the government on Prime. So you've got the Alliance who are largely egalitarian and open, of which the Pride is a member, but yet not nearly so open internally.

You could have the Empire try to undermine that, which would be hilarious for morality mixing because they'd be right about Fey'Dann for wrong bigger-picture reasons and such.

[Reshmar]

Being on the edge of Alliance/Imperial Space I figure the Carshoulis Cluster will be a very active location for many types of activity.

[Dasquian Belargic]

Basically, the Corellian Resistance would be one of the last vestiges of the Rebel Alliance.

I like this... the idea that Corellia might still technically be at war. I'm just imagining this cynical Corellians grumbling about how the Alliance says the war is won, but no one thought to tell the Corellia. As if they got left behind and they're the only ones still fighting the good fight against the Empire.

[Reshmar]

Maybe the Alliance could have some sort of Unofficial aide system set up thru Cato Neimoidia. It is on the edge of the corellian sector more or less.

[Vince]

So here's a list of the places we've got running so far, with the ideas for them (and some other places with potential for black ops and such):
The Carshoulis Cluster
Fey'Dann - Spy Shenanigans
The Centrality
Lots of potential for Ben and (Dis)Honest Jobs smuggling stuff through the lines of his former and perhaps current employers - Smuggling and Spy Shenanigans
Corellia/Duro
Alliance/Corellian Resistance friction
Imperials funding government crackdowns(?)
Wayland
Jedi/Knights have a deep cover battle here over the cloaking technology that Thrawn would have used in his campaign against the New Republic (?)
Disciples of Ragnos Crisis (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Disciples_of_Ragnos), perhaps(?)
Thisspias
Homeworld of Oppo Rancisis, it has been pretty well jackbooted by the Empire; if it isn't in Alliance control, some black ops might free some of the royal family, leading to the planet suing the Alliance for protection and leading to a stand-off with the planet-killers by navies in orbit. If it's in the neutral zone, we can have an Imperial Knight military advisor and an Alliance military advisor working the ground here.
Triffis
Kalinda
Tibrin
Dorvalla
Minos ClusterEDIT: added more border planets to widen operations and the scope of the conflicts we can have going on. I'm not saying we have all of these going on at once, but I'm throwing ideas out there and hoping it catches with somebody. I'll get some ideas and information on these little systems and areas tomorrow or tuesday.

[Reshmar]

Thisspias Is right on the Imperial side of the border so it might well be in neutral territory.

[Captain Untouchable]

The Doldur is another one of potential interest. The Empire retained control of it partly because of sentimental value (the Empress used to be Moff here), and partly to deny the Alliance from having a world that might have been strategically useful to them.

Doldur / Druckenwell could almost end up being like the Empire's Cuba: somewhere within striking distance of the Alliance capital where they can shove missiles, garrisons, fleets, and all sorts in preparation for a decisive strike if the Cold War ever heats up.

[Park Kraken]

A few things that spring to mind -

The Hutts

The Alliance has a slightly stronger stomach for making deals with unsavoury types than the Empire has, including the Hutts. With the Empire completely cut off from Hutt space, that could be a problem. What if the Alliance cuts some sort of deal with the Hutts, giving them access to resources, free passage through their space, and so on? What if, heaven forbid, they actually manage to form an alliance with the Hutts? It's unlikely, but it's not the sort of thing that the Empire would want to sit back and allow, so presumably they'd take steps to covertly sabotage the Alliance-Hutt relationship: fake Alliance ships attacking Hutt convoys; pirates allegedly on the Hutt payroll attacking Alliance ships/worlds; etc. Perhaps the Hutt Cartels are even split: some loyal to the Alliance, some to the Empire.



This I think strongly depends on which alien member of the Alliance is dealing with the Hutts. The Mon Calamari have a history on cracking down on Smugglers and anything Black Market related, while the Bothans may go an opposite route and make deals with the Hutts. I would think many of the Hutts would be highly uneasy with the Alliance territory surrounding Hutt Space. Plus, Alliance Officers and Officials will be much less likely to be bribed or corrupted by the Hutts then Imperial Officers and Officials.

[Captain Untouchable]

Plus, Alliance Officers and Officials will be much less likely to be bribed or corrupted by the Hutts then Imperial Officers and Officials.

Not necessarily.

Not everyone who is part of the Alliance of Free Planets is a noble, holier-than-thou resistance fighter. Some certainly will be. Some will be planets that are just chuffed to be free of Imperial rule. Some will be planets who want to "stick it to the man" at any cost. Some will probably be human-hating alien worlds. Some may be through-and-through Imperial worlds with cowardly Moffs who switched sides because it was the safest / most profitable thing for them to do. Some may be planets that are only siding with the Alliance because they're the kind of people who side with whichever faction is strongest in their region. On top of that, you've got people who were previously smugglers, pirates, criminals, mercenaries, and terrorists who are now officers, officials, and members of state.

In general, Alliance officers/officials are probably less susceptible to corruption or bribery... but individually, you may well find people - or entire worlds - that are more susceptible than the Empire. It'll be one hell of a mixed bag.

[Reshmar]

Reshmar has always been against alot of the practices of the Rebellion as far as using smugglers and Pirates sorts. He has always been publicly against it though he knew it was at the time needed to hold the Rebellion together and keep it going. He never has and never will Trust Bothans for the most part but knows they are not all bad and the few he does not hold contempt for he admires and trusts them. He Will not totally trust the Hapen's because of their pirate routes but knows they are not their fore fathers/mothers.

The Fleet will not openly support any smuggling or other illicit act in the name of the Alliance any longer. While there will be those among the Defense force who feel differently' and will at times act against the SOP for fleet now, any actions will be deemed treason by the Alliance Defense Force Command. SO.... don't get caught.

That Being said about my fishy alter ego, I think with over a hundred sectors now under alliance protection anything goes. Lets face it Our fleet is woefully insufficient for the task of defending let alone patrolling the amount of territory we now have. So soon after a 15 year war with The empire 90 percent of the Fleet is still on a war stance. going from 5 mostly mobile forces to 7 fleets with 30 plus anchorages is a chore which will take months if not the better part of a year just to sort out.

Losing imperial Customs enforcement has opened up the flood gates for alot of worlds now in Alliance Space. While the Defense force is licking its wounds from the last 15 years and sorting out who is what and where are we going, Smugglers and pirates and who knows what else have pretty much free run of Alliance space.

[Mdharra Ceergorra]

I wonder if the Cizerack may commit some ships to bolster the Alliance fleet as a show of good faith, and also as a way of keeping a close eye on their new allies.

If so, it sounds like just the sort of thankless and paradoxical assignment they'd fob off onto an unpopular but hard-to-get-rid-of Naala'in Huntress captain. :)

[Reshmar]

I had thought or creating a Cizerack heavy Battlegroup. It would be more like the Aliance sending ships to assist the Cizerack fleet under an Alliance Flag.

I am not sure how The Alliance will deal with Home Fleets. I am sure the Mon Cal, Bothan, Sullust, Cizerack and Hapens would have a planetary or system defense group outside the Alliance Defense Force. Would all military assets be folded into the Alliance Defense Force like the Empire did? I think the Cizerack and Hapens would not like this idea. Should there be special battle groups for certain groups. Hapes, Calamari, Cizerack?

Should we make some sort of exchange program where we get ships and crews for giving ships and crews? The thought of getting a non-Cizerack war ship into the cluster is interesting. How would this go over?

Also, Has the Empire agreed with the Cizerack joining the Alliance. They are so close to Imperial space, was the cluster a part of the Peace agreement or do the Imperials see the now enemy aligned Cizerack as a threat they can deal with outside the Peace agreement?

[T'yeellaa Meorrrei]

The Cizerack are fully vested in the Alliance, per the High Mother's edict. You can make that issue fuzzy with Calan and maybe egalitarianist rebels on Fey'dann, but those factors are outliers at best and enemies of the state at worst.

Home fleet duty has always been A Thing for the Huntress Navy, but they're probably more tilted towards patroling the space lanes. They're more extroverted than the Hapans, and have always used their capital ships as a projection of power along the Hydian and other trade lanes in order to keep them secure.

I think they'd be rather receptive to the concept of integrating their deep space starfleet into the Alliance Navy. I say the concept, because the reality of it will be pretty tricky in all sorts of ways!

[Mdharra Ceergorra]

I think the key is in the terms - this is an Alliance, not an Empire. The Empire would demand ships and troops as tribute in return for protection. I'd imagine the members of the Alliance have each signed an accord that respects their own sovereignty, but that also guarantees that each contributes to the Alliance as a whole according to their abilities.

I can't see the Hapans or the Cizerack completely signing away the defense of their homeworlds to the Alliance fleet, but I'm sure the terms of their charter included contributing to the common defense. That could be in the form of coordinating their battlegroups with Reshmar's, a la "a multi-national peacekeeping force," or they could actually integrate their units into the existing Alliance fleet structure. I actually think it would likely be a bit of both.

But I like the idea of Mdharra being placed under the command of a forrda admiral. Gives her something to grumble about. :3:

[T'yeellaa Meorrrei]

It'll be an interesting chance to marry tactics. The nimble hit & fade of traditional alliance style with Cizerack "rally around the gun" to anchor them when they need to hold the line.

[Dorna Forlon]

Meet Captain Forlon, Commander of the 136th Alliance Defense Battlegroup. Headed to a Cluster near you.

Edit: I need to catch up on everything Cizerack fleet. I would like to get Dorna in as a sort of operations officer for the Alliance forces as they mix with the Cizerack.

[T'yeellaa Meorrrei]

If Mdharra is going to be posting with Reshmar, consider me your home fleet contact :) T'yeellaa captains the Haifa'Iro'Iro

[Park Kraken]

Sending Battle Squadrons from member states to join the 1st Fleet reminds me a bit of the British Grand Fleet from WW1, accepting ships from other nations.

As for other ideas, starting last night I began toying with the idea of making a Neimodian toon and restarting the Trade Federation to serve the Empire in a direct contrast to how the Cizeracks are joining with the Alliance.

[Reshmar]

The Neimoidians have never been Fans of the Empire. Neimoidia may now be firmly under Imperial rule but many would resist even on Neimoidia. With Cato Neimoidia now under Alliance protection the real power of the Neimoidian race is a free world. They have had 25 plus years of being taught to be Duros again so I do not know where the Imperial loyalty limits are for Neimoidia. with them trying for so long to cleanse themselves of the Trade federations taint I do not know if the majority of Neimoidians would want or support a new Trade Federation.

That being said. I am sure Old Guard Neimoidians are still around. They would be greedy, crooked and opportunistic. I could see an Imperial Backed Old Guard Neimoidian starting up trouble with the new school Neimoidians. A boarder war between an Imperial Backed new Trade Federation and Alliance backed Cato Neimoidia for Deko Neimoidia and Koru Neimoidia would be fun.

[Captain Untouchable]

If you want to do something tied to the Empire, the InterGalactic Banking Clan might be better than the Trade Federation. I know Charley had a Muun banker at one point, so there's potentially something to build on there.

If we're playing this as a Cold War, I think that the Alliance is probably Russia: certainly in terms of their finances and resources. Muunilinst and Mygeeto are still well within Imperial territory, and I think it'd be really interesting to see an Empire that still has a lot of finances that they can throw at anything/everything, while the Alliance is still struggling to get money for things. I think it'd be cool to see the Imperials being the high-tech power, while the Alliance is still operating a fleet of ships ranging from brand new to fifty years old, where engineers repair most things by just whacking them with a hammer.

Also, "In Alliance of Free Planets, Alderaan vaporises you" seems like a meme we should totally get going on the boards. :uhoh

Edit:

That leads me into a totally separate thought. We've talked a lot about the variety of non-humans available to the Alliance... but will the Empire now be forced to relax it's anti-alien policy a little in order to compensate for the loss of so many human worlds it can recruit from? It might be interesting to see more near-humans (Muuns, Zabrak, Mirialans, etc) showing up as Imperial officers; and it could potentially lead into alliances between the Imperials and the Chiss, etc.

Edit 2:

I notice that Rothana (T15) is now part of the Hutt Space blob of non-Imperial, non-Alliance worlds. Rothana Heavy Engineering is/was a subsidiary of Kuat Drive Yards that made a lot of the Grand Army of the Republic stuff - those Acclamator (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Acclamator_I-class_assault_ship) transports, LAATs (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Low_Altitude_Assault_Transport/infantry), AT-TEs (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/All_Terrain_Tactical_Enforcer), and so on.

Previously, the Alliance has never really had an army, but f we're going to have some sort of ongoing Alliance-Hutt diplomatic relationship it might be cool/interesting to have Rothana / the Hutts responsible for supplying us with a lot of that equipment (in addition to any stuff that we produce locally). Maybe that will involve Rothana setting up factories on Alliance worlds. Maybe that will involve the Hutts sending shipments of tanks and space helicopters to Bothawui. In any case, it could be one of the things that the Empire is working to disrupt. I have a Bothan Senator and/or a Hutt character who could be involved in establishing that sort of stuff.

[Parack Bell]

Someone called for a Muun banker?? :D

[Park Kraken]

After looking through all the various CIS groups last night and doing some plotting I think a new incarnation of the Techno Union could be in order. Members of the Union could include the Banking Clan (which would call for a Muun member) and a few other factions. I was thinking of having a splinter cell of the old Union reappear from a hidden base in the Unknown Regions to be the catalyst, and for allies they could help the Yevetha gain their independence from the Empire in addition to enlisting the Banking Clans in return for helping the Muuns return to power (who were largely replaced by humans from the Empire).

[Park Kraken]

Capt, as far as race relations go I think the Empire might do a partial reduction in race oppression in allowing species that've historically proved mostly cooperative with the Imperials to join more military ranks including such as Devaronians, Twi'leks, Barabels, etc.

[Vince]

Capt, as far as race relations go I think the Empire might do a partial reduction in race oppression in allowing species that've historically proved mostly cooperative with the Imperials to join more military ranks including such as Devaronians, Twi'leks, Barabels, etc.

Depending on the arm of the Imperial machine I would agree. Intelligence, the Knights, Imperial Customs, and select other institutions would accept non-humans, but the Stormtrooper Corps, the the Imperial Navy, and the much more conservative political institutions wouldn't be open to non-human species, even if it would grant them a balance against the wider appeal of the Alliance's diverse military force.

[Stela'shlit'nuruodo]

The Empire of the Hand showed that Chiss and Humans working together well. Though The Empire of the hand is now gone here at fans. The Chiss arn't. Lash is looking for ways to keep the Ascendancy's Borders safe. With the Imperials and Alliance now at peace the Threat from Imperial Expansion and aggression is a real threat to the CHiss. At least they see it that way. A peace between the Chiss and The Empire is needed. Thing is who does Lash talk to and where does he go to deal with this? With the Empire now in what ever shape it is in who will be dealing with working stuff like this out?

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

Man, we need to the old gang back, heh. Jarek, Telan, Travis, K7, Taylor, Lebron, Sean, and Visc. Those jokers would be all over this.