Ignore this thread

[Sansa]

Jenny Jones: ohhh http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Tal'mahe'Ra
"The Western faction, however, mainly involved itself in vampire politics and were rumoured to plan the obliteration of the Baali."
holliebelle2: Cool!
Plus vampires and mages working together seems like they could be the source of a possible daywalking ring (if you read that post of mine)
Jenny Jones: indeed!
holliebelle2: How better to eliminate impure vampires than by daywalking and chopping their heads off or burning their nests while they sleep
Jenny Jones: :D indeed
holliebelle2: I was thinking maybe the ring was created but it only works with a certain bloodline or even just one individual
Jenny Jones: it sounds like something that would have been created with a specific purpose in mind.. and also designed to backfire if it wasnt used for that specific purpose!
holliebelle2: Or there's some downside that made the people who created it abandon the project rather than make a zillion of them
But these sort of details have been lost in the depths of myth and only the major details of "mystical ring allows a vampire to walk in daylight" still are known, leaving the other parts to be discovered later if the ring is uncovered
Yes exactly, like some rich Tremere created it for his own use and if any other bloodline tries to use it it burns them up to a crisp or something, but then, going in daylight would do that anyway.
And he used to
Jenny Jones: it would be one of them bloody tremere!
holliebelle2: And he used it to terrorize the country folk around him until one day he was asleep and they came with pitchforks and burnt down his castle
Or something lol
Maybe if you wear it you can walk in daylight but you also have to fulfill the mission of __something__, which the last wearer was tasked with.
Jenny Jones: maybe! it's a macguffin, it can do anything :P
holliebelle2: Exactly!
The beauty of it is that our characters might never find it, and if they do then whatever the writer wants it to be it can be, because its a myth so anything written about it "in the past" could be rumors and lies.
Jenny Jones: alright, so thinking aloud...
this black hand was concerned with hell and where the unholy went after they died, presumably with purifying their own souls
so I can give this malkav a derangement that is fixation on somehow cleansing his own soul, and the best way to do that is by eliminating unpure kindred
holliebelle2: Sounds suitably crazy :)
Maybe he starts thinking that his 'undead' life is purgatory and to be released he has to kill the impure ?
Jenny Jones: yes, something like that. although it seems like this black hand wasnt always killing.. sometimes just writing down names ina book
i kind of like the idea of him having a book of names with all the naughty vampires in it :P
holliebelle2: ...for someone else to kill ;)
Hahahaha I do too
Jenny Jones: oh cool, they wanted to wipe out the 'impure' bloodlines.. including the tremere!
holliebelle2: Slightly off topic but I think for the reveal to have maximum impact maybe we should have Gabe showing up and confusing Sansa, then jump back a few days to show why he's there, including Ewan realizing he doesn't have Gabe in torpor?

For posterity

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Jenny Jones: so, what do you want to do with sansa
holliebelle2: everything!
holliebelle2: specifically having her track down or interact with the hunter guy
holliebelle2: and meeting Gabriel again
holliebelle2: and
holliebelle2: whatever really
Jenny Jones: where did we say gabriel actually was
Jenny Jones: because i cannot remember!
holliebelle2: I dont' remember either!
holliebelle2: so I think that's pretty open to whatever makes sense
Jenny Jones: so wherever he's been, he's been there.. how many years?
holliebelle2: since Thaddeus sprung him from the Tower?
holliebelle2: which is
holliebelle2: 2007 Jan i think
holliebelle2: five years
Jenny Jones: okay
holliebelle2: oh we were going to do something with a daywalking ring too weren't we
holliebelle2: I'm looking through our chat logs lol
Jenny Jones: we were?
Jenny Jones: ahhh
holliebelle2: Oct 24 in specific if you want to look too
holliebelle2: we must have done most of the chatting while I was on the ipad because I only have part of a convo
holliebelle2: ipad doens't save them
Jenny Jones: bugger
Jenny Jones: okay, so they're broken out of the tower... jude steals sansa
Jenny Jones: they become shut-ins with sansa living under some weird malkav trance that makes her believe jude is gabe
holliebelle2: yes
holliebelle2: living in London because it's the one place Gabe can't come back to
Jenny Jones: right
holliebelle2: (theoretically)
Jenny Jones: so thaddeus sends gabe off to somewhere.. in europe
holliebelle2: yes
holliebelle2: Maybe Paris?
holliebelle2: doesn't really matter
holliebelle2: to me, that is, I'm sure it matters to Gabriel
holliebelle2: is it ok if I invite Droo in?
Jenny Jones: yeah, let me just hop onto a program that actually supports chats
Jenny Jones: one sec
holliebelle2: ok np
Jenny Jones: ok :)
*** HollieBelle2 has joined the conversation.
*** Jenny Jones has joined the conversation.
holliebelle2: I'm not sure if he's actually at his computer right now tbh lol
*** droogy droo has joined the conversation.
Jenny Jones: ahh
Jenny Jones: there he is :)
holliebelle2: oh there he is
droogy droo: oi oi
Jenny Jones: i was just thinking aloud about what to do with Gabriel
holliebelle2: we're talking about where Gabe has been and other stuff
holliebelle2: and what is going to happen to his brother, Jude
holliebelle2: and looking through my old chats with Jenny I remembered that we had talked about there being a daywalking ring mcguffin that we were going to introduce
Jenny Jones: so, Gabe is in Europe, at his lowest point.. and I think in all likelihood what would have happen is him going into torpor.
holliebelle2: ok that makes sense !
Jenny Jones: so he goes into hiding somewhere, goes into his vampire coma for a couple of years
Jenny Jones: and then is accidentally unearthed by someone
holliebelle2: the neighbors finally realize what that odd smell is from the flat upstairs
Jenny Jones: trying to tie in hunters to this... maybe it's http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Null_Mysteriis and they've had him in a lab somewhere for a while
holliebelle2: ooh
holliebelle2: oh we were talking about http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Tal%27mahe%27Ra these guys having to do with the ring creation btw, doesn't have to do with Gabe specifically
holliebelle2: maybe these guys unearth Gabe and revive him for Science
holliebelle2: the hunter guys I mean
Jenny Jones: that was my thinking
holliebelle2: and Gabe goes "NUH UH" and gets away
Jenny Jones: he would make an interesting test subject
Jenny Jones: so he escapes from them.. which puts hunters firmly on his trail. everyone hates gabe.
holliebelle2: poor Gabe
Jenny Jones: i think ultimately the way that he is able to redeem himself, in some small, in the eyes of the camarilla is by stopping hunters taking out a chunk of senior camarilla
holliebelle2: so he decides to look up Sansa finally despite the danger? because he's suicidal or something lol
holliebelle2: ooh I like
Jenny Jones: right.. he didn't even know these hutners existed before, but its suddenly clear to him that they are a huge threat
Jenny Jones: so he has to go back to england
holliebelle2: right
holliebelle2: and Roland is in trouble!
Jenny Jones: right
holliebelle2: maybe a primogen meeting is targeted and that's what Gabriel thwarts
holliebelle2: ok here is a lot of chat log text, sorry in advance but there was a lot of interesting stuff in here
holliebelle2: never mind it's way too long haha
holliebelle2: I'm going to just throw it into a thread and link ya
Jenny Jones: our young hunter gets involved because he's picked up what his late cousin left behind... voicemails and emails connecting him to other hunters, open/unfinished cases
holliebelle2: http://www.sw-fans.net/forum/showthread.php?p=399757#post399757
holliebelle2: makes sense
holliebelle2: and Sansa is going to be trying to find him maybe, if Rod finds out she made the guy eat her blood
Jenny Jones: his cousin was a part of http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Ashwood_Abbey
holliebelle2: ok cool
Jenny Jones: so maybe some kind of moral conflict for him.. if he actually develops some kind of connection with sansa. he didn't realise that his cousin was just doing what he was doing for the fun of it, there's something kind of depraved about that..
holliebelle2: well he HAS a connection to Sansa ;)
holliebelle2: but I know what you mean
holliebelle2: she's hard to hate :(
holliebelle2: unless you're Katarina
Jenny Jones: haha
holliebelle2: also Ewan should be ready to yell at Liam a whole bunch because he let sansa out of his sight and then she was gone all night and all day and they don't know what happened to her >_>
Jenny Jones: typical :P
holliebelle2: in his defense a Mage laid a false trail :p
holliebelle2: but then, he shouldn't have let her out of his sight in the first place :p
Jenny Jones: but she irritated him :P
holliebelle2: always with the violin playing
holliebelle2: doesn't she know any HAPPY songs?
Jenny Jones: i've got a lovely bunch of coconuts..
holliebelle2: haha
Jenny Jones: meanwhile, jude
Jenny Jones: was getting revived by the giovanni, i believe
holliebelle2: yes
holliebelle2: who wont be happy to realize he isnt Gabe
Jenny Jones: i guess that puts them on gabe's trail too.. with jude presumably helping them? so when gabe gets back to england, essentially everyone wants a piece of him
holliebelle2: Jude helping them under duress :p
Jenny Jones: right
holliebelle2: we were talking something about a Malk where my chatlog picks up, I wish I had the beginning of that conversation
holliebelle2: oh!
holliebelle2: weren't we talking about Sansa and the Malk primogen or something since Sansa is tied into the madness network through all the Jude blood she's been guzzling
Jenny Jones: possibly?
holliebelle2: probably doesn't matter that much
Jenny Jones: okay, in terms of hopping right back in with some action
holliebelle2: ok
holliebelle2: Can do Ewan and Liam reviving Gabe/Jude while Sansa is out of the house
Jenny Jones: right
Jenny Jones: gabe ships himself back into london on a cargo boat... through some kind of black market deal. like a bunch of kindred immigrants being shipped into the country in a cargo container.
Jenny Jones: only hunters know the shipment is arriving, because they've basically bought the kindred in as game to hunt.. so they're waiting for the kindred, but they're not expecting gabe. so he absolutey tears through them. that sets off alarm bells for everyone in london, to say that there is a powerful kindred in the area.
holliebelle2: ooh I like it
Jenny Jones: so that way we have motivation for the hunters to target him specifically, it alerts the giovanni to the fact that the real gabe is around, the camarilla will investigate, etc. everyone gets involved somehow.
holliebelle2: i like it
holliebelle2: then if we wanted to the daylight ring mcguffin could be brought in as the vamps needing an edge the hunters don't expect
Jenny Jones: right!
holliebelle2: which can bring Kat and Sergei back into things if we want
holliebelle2: and basically anyone who doesn't want to be murdered by people who hunt supernatural creatures
Jenny Jones: exactly
holliebelle2: or who doesn't want anyone ELSE to have the ring because they would of course misuse it and I know best, that sort of thing
holliebelle2: For example the Mages would probably not be keen on this idea of vampires daywalking but they aren't keen on hunters tearing London apart either
Jenny Jones: indeeeed
holliebelle2: sounds good!
holliebelle2: and we can delay the Gabe/Jude reveal by having Jude BS the Dunsirns for a while if we want to play it like that
holliebelle2: but drop hints like dark hair, that sort of thing
holliebelle2: yay so excited :D
Jenny Jones: :)
Jenny Jones: i'm just trying to figure out what would make for the best starting point, thread-wise
holliebelle2: ok
holliebelle2: i'm making sandwiches I'll be around
Jenny Jones: would sansa go to roland?
Jenny Jones: i'm just thinking, he might have heard about the fact that a shipment is coming in.. though he doens't know exactly when. and sansa is with him when the ventrue get the tip that the shipment is coming in, so that gives us an excuse to have sansa and roland roll up to the docks and find gabe surrounded by a load of mutilated hunters :P
holliebelle2: sansa could certainly go to roland
holliebelle2: possibly under the influence of the malk primogen who knows about gabe's death via Sansa madness connection
holliebelle2: well Jude/Gabe

[Lilaena De'Ville]

I'm super glad this is here D:

[Dasquian Belargic]

I knew we were awesome. I just forgot why.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Status: Still Awesome

:cheers

[Emilie]

This post is basically spoilery stuff for Emilie but I'm not going to mask it because I'm not sure anyone cares! (Except you, Jenny, I know you care :love )

She is a wraith/ghost/banshee, and part of the Grim Legion (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Grim_Legion) (wraiths who were murdered usually end up here). She spends most of her time in the place she died, as it is her primary Fetter (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Fetter_(WTO)), and the faint hope of avenging her death drives her. Something something, the daywalking ring is a Fetter for a high ranking wraith in an opposing Legion, and in her "job" (undefined, something covert) she is trying to get the Fetter destroyed to assist this guy on his way to Oblivion.

I'm still working out the Shadow/Psyche part of her, if I go into it at all. Emilie generally wears armor that is wrapped in barbed wire, imitating the way in which she was displayed during and after her death.

Arcanoi - http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Fatalism and http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Lifeweb

[Dasquian Belargic]

A reminder of Hesam's kill list:

Marcus Thornby - Brujah
Greta Willis - Gangrel
Anna Starkley - Malkavian
Saul Leavis - Nosferatu
William Brown Turrel - Tremere
Elizabeth Atkinson - Toreador
Roland Salisbury - Ventrue

Roland, Saul, Greta and Anna are still in London. Marcus is in Scotland, Elizabeth is.. somewhere?

All of them were Primogen under Rodermark, and since the contract can't be amended once it's in place, all of them will die.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

The Hierarchy (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Hierarchy) enforces the Dictum Mortuum (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Dictum_Mortuum), which treats the shroud as legally impassible even if it is low - Arcanoi (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Arcanos_%28WTO%29) which can violate the shroud are considered highly illegal. Certain Guilds (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Guild_%28WTO%29) are consequently highly interested in tearing down the shroud because of the power it would grant them: the Proctors (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Proctor) and Puppeteers (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Puppeteer) being good examples. Other organizations, like the Giovanni (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Giovanni) Clan (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Clan_%28VTM%29) of vampires (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Kindred_%28VTM%29), are also interested in tearing down the Shroud, although that may be a gross miscalculation on their part.

possible thread to tie in :)

I'm obviously not treating the Shroud as impassible, though it is difficult and not often done.

[Dasquian Belargic]

oh snap, thread connections happening of their own accord with us even planning it

[Lilaena De'Ville]

This is the framework Jenny and I are working off of for the 2012 London Olympics stuff that we've been...uh... working on ...off and on... for a while. Any other ideas, or what you might want to do, or your own plots happening in other parts of the world are welcome.