Alliance of Free Planets

[Captain Untouchable]

Didn't want to clog up the main discussion with one particular topic, so I figured I'd start a separate thread.

It's no secret that I like maps. I've wanted to take The Essential Atlas and put together a Fans map for ages (adding the Carshoulis Cluster, marking important worlds, etc), and with this time-skip and me cutting back on the majority of my roleplaying, it gives me a fantastic excuse... as well as something to keep me busy and out of people's hair. ;)

Holly has already put together this map (http://i.imgur.com/MSbpQDJ.jpg) of the approximate area we're looking at. On top of that, The Essential Atlas has released a bunch of online supplements, which include versions of the official maps that EU authors use, including ones of the Expansion Region (http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20121025231205/starwars/images/a/a2/Expansionregion_map.jpg), Mid Rim (http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110316023713/starwars/images/0/0a/TheMidRim.jpg), and Outer Rim (http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090911072224/starwars/images/4/4b/Outer_Rim_Sectors.jpg) that show all the individual sectors. There's a little bit of the Alliance in O9 and O10 of the Inner Rim (http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090904110315/starwars/images/0/07/TheInnerRim.jpg), but 90% of it is on those maps.

There are a couple of things I could use clearing up: there probably aren't cut-and-dry yes/no answers to most of these (unless they've been discussed already in chats?), but hopefully there's nothing too contentious. :)


Where is the Carshoulis Cluster?
I've been told where it's near before, but the more specific we can be, the easier it will be for me to put a pin in it and mark it on the map. Is it possible to narrow it down to a specific grid (P9, etc) on those maps? Is it between somewhere and somewhere else?

Will Alliance borders follow Sector borders?
When the treaty was signed and the official border drawn between Imperial space and Alliance space, did they respect the existing sector boundaries, as laid down by the Galactic Republic? Were any sectors redrawn, or sliced in half?

What is the Demilitarized Zone?
In what was conveyed in the discussion thread, it seemed like there was some discussion about having a DMZ, which might possibly include Duro. However, Duro is quite some distance from the border. Is the DMZ an x-lightyears-wide exclusion zone that runs down the Alliance border - something like the Romulan Neutral Zone? Is the DMZ just a patch of space, possibly the Duro and Corellian Sectors? Is there one DMZ, or are there several?

What if I don't want to be part of the Alliance?
Are we assuming that the majority of worlds inside Alliance territory will be loyal to the Alliance? Are there any notable ones that wouldn't be? Geonosis, Kamino, and Falleen spring to mind as planets that we want to stay neutral / not be Alliance... unless having access to battle droid factories is something we want, to help the Alliance compete with the size of the Imperial army? Also, might there be any Imperial holdouts - planets that are in Alliance territory, but would much rather be Imperial? Would they be "occupied", or would their be blobs of Imperial inside Alliance territory?

What about the Doldur Sector?
This is the Sector where Empress Tarkin was a Moff. It isn't a particularly strategic location from an Alliance perspective, save for the fact that it's on the border between the Alliance and the Empire; it's appeal is largely sentimental. On the other hand, it's very strategically poised to help the Alliance police the Corellian Run and avoid any "holes" in their territory. Would the Empire have held on to it for sentimental value / the pure satisfaction of preventing the Alliance from having it, or would it being ceded to the Alliance be something that the Empress is pretty sore over?

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Carshoulis cluster is right by the LE of the PERLEMIAN TRADE ROUTE. I have another map with it marked hang on.

edit: http://panicked.org/webmap1/2.html actually this has it on the Hydian Way (pre-reset) so lemme see what's in the wiki.

edit2: Hydian way it is!

[Captain Untouchable]

Unfortunately, the various versions of the Star Wars galaxy maps don't always agree on where stuff is. The old map (http://panicked.org/webmap1/2.html) that Holly just posted puts the Carshoulis Cluster "on the Hydian Way, between Toprawa and Bimmiel". If you look at the example map (http://i.imgur.com/MSbpQDJ.jpg) Holly uploaded a few days ago however, Bimmiel is in grid N4 - in completely the opposite direction. In the ostensibly official map (http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090911072224/starwars/images/4/4b/Outer_Rim_Sectors.jpg) from the Essential Atlas team, Bimmiel is still in N4... and again, it's three whole sectors in the wrong direction.

Also, Toprawa and the Hydian Way are well outside of Alliance territory, based on the second of those maps.

It would be helpful if you could point me at it's location on the Essential Atlas version of the map: that's the most complete, and thus is the one I'll have to use as a basis. :)

Edit:

Perhaps it would be useful to put it proximate to somewhere else that is important for roleplaying / already has one or more Senators? For example, it might be interesting to see Carshoulis in the same neighbourhood as Hapes, so that our two introvert/isolationist space clusters with sizeable militaries would potentially be cooperating closely on matters of defense/etc.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

http://i.imgur.com/uzIwVKf.jpg map with the Carshoulis Cluster marked and included within borders.

[Captain Untouchable]

Could we let someone else weigh in before we make a final decision?

I realise you're a big part of creating and running the Cizerack, but I would feel considerably more comfortable if others had a say before we decided to bolt a few thousand extra square lightyears of territory onto the side of the Alliance. Doing so affects Reshmar's planning for the Alliance fleet, absorbs Korriban (a planet that is important to Dark Siders) into the Alliance, and cuts the Hydian Way in half thus screwing with Imperial access to the Corporate Sector.

It seems like something that should be a team decision because of how all-affecting it is, hence me starting a thread where we could discuss stuff as a group. :)

[Droo]

As I recall, that map was the one being tossed around in the chat and a couple of threads thereafter, and I don't recall anyone raising any issues about it at any point. Perhaps there's something I've missed, but regardless, I'm sure a few nips and tucks won't be too much of a problem if neccessary.

Edit: My bad, that map was not the original one. In this one Alliance territory has been expanded to include the Carshoulis Cluster, as opposed to the Carshoulis Cluster simply being plonked in existing Alliance territory, which is what I originally thought. Maybe a slight tweaking of the Cluster's position on the Hydian Way? I mean, I understand the map simplifies the reality of it, but surely if we just moved it over to the other side of the Hydian Way, closer to Alliance territory, that would be an easier way of incorporating it without further impacting the border disputes?

[Dasquian Belargic]

No problems with the map, here.

[Captain Untouchable]

Which version of the map: the one Holly uploaded days ago (this one (http://i.imgur.com/MSbpQDJ.jpg)), or the one she uploaded just now (this one (http://i.imgur.com/uzIwVKf.jpg))?

Droo hadn't noticed there was a difference between the two, and that difference makes quite the difference. If everyone is happy with the latter map then cool beans: that's what we'll go with. I just want to be clear that everyone is definitely signing off on the version they've just seen (which adds the former Sith Empire and a chunk of the Hydian Way to the Alliance), rather than just glancing at it and going "oh yeah, that looks like the one I saw and was fine with the other day" without noticing the change.

[Park Kraken]

Don't we need a little splotch of green where Duro is?

[Dasquian Belargic]

I'm happy with either. The updated one with the Carshoulis Cluster on it makes the most sense to use, I guess?

[Lilaena De'Ville]

I would rather the Carshoulis Cluster was on the Perlemian Trade Route like i'd initially thought but that has to be cleared with Charley and others since it might alter current or past RPs. Since you asked me to mark it on a map I did as you requested, using the location used pre-reset and that is currently in the wiki. For the sake of illustration I extended the green border of the Alliance over it, but I don't imagine that any of that image is set in stone, not even the location of the Carshoulis Cluster.

edit: I really didn't mean for people to assume that my green splotch means anything ^_^; as it was just supposed to be a starting point

[Captain Untouchable]

^ Sorry Holly, my mistake in not explaining what I meant well enough.

What I was after was someone showing me where the cluster was on the new / Essential Atlas version of the map (the one with all the sectors). If I'm going to make a map for Fans that features all of the stuff relevant/important to us, it makes sense to base it on the map that has the most information / most planets / all the sectors marked / etc. The older versions of the map unfortunately have a lot of stuff in wrong places, whereas the Essential Atlas is based on the data that EU writers work from. :)


Don't we need a little splotch of green where Duro is?

As I understand it, it was decided in the chats that Duro would be a neutral site: neither Imperial nor Alliance.

[Droo]

What I was after was someone showing me where the cluster was on the new / Essential Atlas version of the map (the one with all the sectors). If I'm going to make a map for Fans that features all of the stuff relevant/important to us, it makes sense to base it on the map that has the most information / most planets / all the sectors marked / etc. The older versions of the map unfortunately have a lot of stuff in wrong places, whereas the Essential Atlas is based on the data that EU writers work from. :)

Not that I don't appreciate your enthusiasm, but is that at all neccessary? The one we've been working from seems to do just fine (aside from contradicting a source that, as far as I'm aware, we don't use), and, personally, I much prefer the more simplistic map. I can follow it for a start. The Essential Atlas, for all its detail, is headache-inducing.

[Captain Untouchable]

Never mind then.

[Miranda Tarkin]

I do believe that the Empress wants her Doldur Sector to be honest. it's bad enough she has to sign some treaty but to take her place... hellz no :p

[Dasquian Belargic]

I would rather have a more simple map too. It's not going to have a huge amount of bearing on my RPing anyway. I can't think that I've ever referred to the map, except once to establish where Hapes and Dathomir were in relation to Onderon ^_^;

[Captain Untouchable]

The sector map isn't the only map in the Essential Atlas. I included links to them because knowing where the sectors are would have made it easier to draw a border.

The actual Essential Atlas maps are considerably simpler... but even then it would have been irrelevant, because I was just planning to use the Atlas for accurate star positions. The actual Sector borders / star lanes / political borders / etc would have been as simple and clear as I could possibly make them.

I thought that having a easy-to-read map that featured all of the stuff that we did / made up would be helpful, particularly since everyone is clamouring for an influx of new people.

I seem to be alone in that opinion however, so I won't bother wasting any more of anyone's time.

[Taataani Meorrrei]

The Cluster is on the Hydian: it's vaguely near toprawa and vaguely near the Gordian reach. I've never put a pin in a map so...that's as precise as I can be lol

[Lilaena De'Ville]

The Cluster is on the Hydian: it's vaguely near toprawa and vaguely near the Gordian reach. I've never put a pin in a map so...that's as precise as I can be lol
Charley -


I would rather the Carshoulis Cluster was on the Perlemian Trade Route like i'd initially thought but that has to be cleared with Charley and others since it might alter current or past RPs. Since you asked me to mark it on a map I did as you requested, using the location used pre-reset and that is currently in the wiki.

What do you think about moving it to be a little closer to the rest of the Alliance planets and near to Hapes? We don't have to, I really don't know how that would affect things.

[Ben Merasska]

The sector map isn't the only map in the Essential Atlas. I included links to them because knowing where the sectors are would have made it easier to draw a border.

The actual Essential Atlas maps are considerably simpler... but even then it would have been irrelevant, because I was just planning to use the Atlas for accurate star positions. The actual Sector borders / star lanes / political borders / etc would have been as simple and clear as I could possibly make them.

I thought that having a easy-to-read map that featured all of the stuff that we did / made up would be helpful, particularly since everyone is clamouring for an influx of new people.

I seem to be alone in that opinion however, so I won't bother wasting any more of anyone's time.

I say go for it, dude. I know that the map we're using now, while easy to read, is kinda something not so much I don't use, but something I avoid. Something we can all read that includes the places important to Fans would be a nice thing to show off, and would likely give the map a new look along to go along with all this updating we're doing.

[Reshmar]

May I offer a map for consideration?

http://www.sw-fans.net/wiki/index.php/Image:Galaxy.jpg

[Taataani Meorrrei]

What do you think about moving it to be a little closer to the rest of the Alliance planets and near to Hapes? We don't have to, I really don't know how that would affect things.

It's always been on the Hydian, that's really the only part that I've mentioned repeatedly in RP's. That was also part of them being a go-between back when the Corporate Sector looked like it might be getting involved more with core business. The thread "I am Become Death" references the Gordian reach as being rather nearby, since the Huntress Navy uses it as training areas.

I'm pretty flexible to it being flexible along the Hydian, but it really needs to be on that lane since it's part of Cizeri lore at being gatekeepers of that trade route.

[Taataani Meorrrei]

May I offer a map for consideration?

http://www.sw-fans.net/wiki/index.php/Image:Galaxy.jpg

I like this placement.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

May I offer a map for consideration?

http://www.sw-fans.net/wiki/index.php/Image:Galaxy.jpg

Looks great!

Charley, that's fine I don't have a problem with leaving it there :) as I said I really didn't know how much it had been mentioned because my memory isn't that great. ;)

[Park Kraken]

Here are my propsed Imperial Oversectors. In all there would be six total, each governed by a Grand Moff.

http://www.sw-fans.net/wiki/images/7/77/New_Oversector_System.jpg

[Droo]

I like how the Hydian Way is divided between Alliance and Imperial territories, presumably some mutually beneficial agreement would be drawn up on paper to address this, so all use the trade route - officially, at least. But that is not to say it wouldn't be a hotbed of conflict and clandestine dealings, which would be great for story purposes.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

I was thinking last night that the Pride will probably map out (or already have mapped) a hyperspace route along their borders forking out from the Hydian Way and then back again. So that route could be used for commerce and travel between the Corporate Sector and the Empire (plus the Pride will probably still be doing some trade with various entities). It would just need a cool name.

[Reshmar]

Here are my propsed Imperial Oversectors. In all there would be six total, each governed by a Grand Moff.

http://www.sw-fans.net/wiki/images/7/77/New_Oversector_System.jpg

Whats with the green squigly lines in the lower oversector?

[Lilaena De'Ville]

...space snakes?

[Captain Untouchable]

@Reshmar (sorry, can't seem to quote reply on my phone) Looks good, though the border will need to be tweaked because the Empress wants to keep Doldur.

On the new map (that's the Essential Atlas map, guys) the Gordian Reach is closer to the Hydian Way, so tge added territory is less extreme. We might want to address the fact that the Alliance controls Korriban - a major Sith world - now. Perhaps this is something of interest to Salem / the Circle?

Mapping a diversion on the Hydian to skirt Alliance space seems wise. The alternative is a lit of customs checkpoints and added cargo scrutiny.

Because of its location, would the Corporate Sector be Imperial still, or might it and its neighbours have gone neutral to profit from both sides?

[Reshmar]

So with some help from Jace and some Wiki reading I worked out a new map. the bordera have changed a bit because there are a few planets the alliance would have wanted. Commenor and Yag'Dhul being the main ones. Also the Empire kept the Doldur sector added a few minor players, expanded the Hutt territory to include all the "Independant" places for criminals to play. I need to add a few planets later on but I will update this As I need to.

If anyone has anything to add or issues please let me know.

http://www.sw-fans.net/wiki/index.php/Galaxy_Map

[Sansa]

I keep looking for Doldur but I can't find it for the life of me :lol

Looks good though. :)

edit: since it's a sector maybe I shouldn't be looking for planet Doldur :p

AH YES DRUCKENWELL ok I got it just ignore me :D