The Jedi in Year 10

[Droo]

In case you hadn't heard, there's a bit of a shake-up going on in our Star Wars setting which will have an impact upon the Jedi, their role within the Alliance, and their part in the greater galactic conflict itself. So, to summarise the relevant changes by the time 10.000 roles around:

The Hapes Consortium and Cizerack Pride have thrown in their lot with the Rebel Alliance.
The Alliance and the Empire developed Starkiller missiles, superweapons derived from Cizerack technology, which results in a Cold War sort of stalemate.
A treaty was signed between the Empire and the newly formed Alliance of Free Planets, recognising borders and establishing Duro as a demilitarized zone.
Bothawui became capital of the Alliance of Free Planets.
The Jedi have finally settled down on a planet, safe with the Alliance's borders.
So, with that in mind, I suppose the immediate question is: which planet?

Ossus (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Ossus) has been brought up as one option. Cularin (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Cularin), too. On top of that, if we're looking at places with a Jedi history, there's also the option of Ambria (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Ambria) or there's always old reliable Yavin 4 (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Yavin_4).

Next we need to establish how long it has been since the Jedi established their presence on the planet, and how far along they are in setting up their facilities; ie. an academy, a shuttle port, flushing toilets, etc.

Also, maybe something Alliance military types can chime in on here, what kind of resources will they have been afforded after the Wheel has been dismantled? Do they have ships? Defenses? Resources? If so, where are they coming from? What sort of infrastructure do they have set in place by the start of the new year? Just some things to consider so we can throw ideas around here instead of clogging up the other thread.

[Loklorien s'Ilancy]

I rather like Ossus, since it would be fun to revisualize the old Jedi Order's world and put our own unique stamp on it.

[Serena Laran]

I like Ossus as well.

Will we have our own representative in the Senate? I like the idea of the Jedi not wanting to just exist on the Alliance's good graces but wanting to be recognized with the rights of member planets.

I believe we RPed getting Jedi Snubfighters and the Jedi centric ships like the Whaladon and other personal ships would certainly be based in and around our planet. I could see the Wheel's Alliance escort being assigned to protect the Ossus system as part of the overall Alliance fleet rather than the Jedi's personal protectors. If that makes any sense.

edit: the reason we're deep inside the Alliance's borders is so we are protected by the Alliance. I don't think we need a huge amount of extra military protection, as the Empire won't be jumping in a Star Destroyer to slag our planet and any sneak attacks by Inq or dark siders would be dealt with by the Jedi in person.

[Captain Untouchable]

+1 for Ossus.

I like the idea of the Jedi being part of the Senate. It demonstrates that the Jedi are trying to rejoin the galactic community as equals, rather than something superior. We had previously talked about Navaria Tarkin representing the Jedi on the Advisory Council: I think she'd make a good Jedi Senator, if Dani would be up for it.

It might also be worthwhile having a Jedi on the military/political leadership council that Reshmar outlined - alongside the Minister of State, Minister of Security, Supreme Commander, etc - to help facilitate the Jedi helping in Alliance missions and stuff. In theory Navaria could also do this, but it would mean that Dani would be writing opposite herself (Grace), and I imagine the Minister of Intelligence and the "Jedi Minister" would interact a lot. Perhaps Zem Vymes would work for this: the plan was for him to liaise with Alliance forces in the Wheel.

As far as the military goes, protecting Ossus would be the responsibility of the 2nd Fleet: they're the navy unit up in that top right / Mon Calamari area of the Alliance. I would imagine that Ossus would have a modest force in orbit: not too much, because like Holly says you're a decent way inside Alliance territory. It probably wouldn't warrant the protection of an elite unit like Rogue Squadron any more.

By this point, the Jedi should have access to an assortment of Jedi and Old Republic stuff, salvaged from a crashed Venator Star Destroyer in a thread Christin and I are still working on. That includes the newer Jedi Starfighters (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Eta-2_Actis-class_light_interceptor), as well as Z-95s (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Z-95_Headhunter), ARC-170s (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Aggressive_ReConnaissance-170_starfighter), LAATs (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Low_Altitude_Assault_Transport/infantry), and perhaps the odd Nu-class (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Nu-class_attack_shuttle) or Eta-class (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Eta-class_shuttle) shuttle.

Edit:

A random thought that just popped into my head: perhaps the Alliance has a training facility on Ossus, where soldiers can learn to fight alongside (and against) Jedi? The Jedi could train soldiers in proper battlefield conduct alongside people running around with laser swords... and with the introduction if the Imperial Knights, they might have some interesting lessons to teach on the best way to fight force-users (how not to get blaster bolts deflected back into your face, etc).

[Kyle Krogen]

I also like Ossus, as it offers a lost heritage to rediscover.

I don't have much else to say in the matter, though, since Kyle is still in INQ custody. I guess I could just warp him out of there as part of the time jump to Year Ten but that just feels like cheating.

[Dasquian Belargic]

I like Ossus.

I'm not fond of the idea of the Jedi being in the Senate, though. Keep the Jedi out of politics, aside from in an advisory capacity. If the Alliance wants their advice, they can ask for it - but I don't think the Jedi should be automatically part of the governing process.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Then we could have the Jedi seen as a neutral force (at least by the Alliance, the Empire will still consider them enemies) with their own rules in their system and keep them out of politics all together.

I think it might be a bit much to ask Dani to RP the Empress and a Jedi Senator what with her only just coming back after an absense but that would be up to her of course.

[Droo]

I'm with Jenny, the Jedi shouldn't have any part in the Senate outside of fulfilling some sort of advisory role, when it's called for.

And I'm also in favour of Ossus.

Edit:



Edit:

A random thought that just popped into my head: perhaps the Alliance has a training facility on Ossus, where soldiers can learn to fight alongside (and against) Jedi? The Jedi could train soldiers in proper battlefield conduct alongside people running around with laser swords... and with the introduction if the Imperial Knights, they might have some interesting lessons to teach on the best way to fight force-users (how not to get blaster bolts deflected back into your face, etc).

I really like this idea.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

I also like Ossus, as it offers a lost heritage to rediscover.

I don't have much else to say in the matter, though, since Kyle is still in INQ custody. I guess I could just warp him out of there as part of the time jump to Year Ten but that just feels like cheating.
It isn't cheating it's taking advantage of a time skip to simplify your life and drop dead storylines. ;)

[Ilias Nytrau]

+1 for Ossus.

Also agree about no Jedi senators... but advisors? Yes. That's fine.

[Droo]

If we are to go with Ossus then I think that, on top of them being suddenly setup on a planet, with a fully functional base of operations courtesy of the Alliance, and with the Great Jedi Library at their fingertips, giving the Jedi their own brand spanking new academy might be pushing it. Does anyone else feel the same way?

Not so much for the sake of making what they can achieve in a matter of, what, eight months, believeable, but rather to give them something to work towards in-character. That way, our Jedi will have decent enough facilities and resources to really start training up their new ranks, but they haven't built for themselves a home of their own, yet.

[Miranda Tarkin]

I am for Ossus for sure!

And no Senators for Jedi. We are allies and advisers, and for the record, I've come back here and full force once we iron things out to start new story. So Holly, I rather say I could be part of that role as Navaria as adviser if that is all right since it was in the works as Jace said. I would love to do it :D

I like having the base there Droo, like you said, but making an academy is a great goal, not established yet

[Kale]

Perhaps some of the ships of the Wheel have been decommissioned and landed on the surface to be converted into temporary living quarters?

Though I know you said you were tired of writing about ship corridors, Droo. :p

In the meantime, we could be in the process of exploring what ruins remain on the planet. Some may be safe enough to start using, but they'll need renovation, power, and utilities. Some may even hold interesting artifacts, records, or holocrons.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

I am for Ossus for sure!

And no Senators for Jedi. We are allies and advisers, and for the record, I've come back here and full force once we iron things out to start new story. So Holly, I rather say I could be part of that role as Navaria as adviser if that is all right since it was in the works as Jace said. I would love to do it :D

I like having the base there Droo, like you said, but making an academy is a great goal, not established yet
I'm sure that's fine, Dani, I just didn't feel comfortable with people speaking for you. ^_^;

[Captain Untouchable]

The Jedi could always just land the Whaladon and the other freighters on the planet... be living out of transports and shipping containers New Caprica style while they explore and refurbish the Jedi Library. It would still retain that makeshift quality of the Wheel, but it gives room to grow that wasn't there in the harsh vacuum of space.

Just to clarify, when we talk about Jedi as "advisors"... are we talking about Navaria being an advisor to the Senate, or an advisor to the cabinet/council? Both?

[Dasquian Belargic]

Just to clarify, when we talk about Jedi as "advisors"... are we talking about Navaria being an advisor to the Senate, or an advisor to the cabinet/council? Both?

Either or, I think. I'd say that the Jedi are there as a neutral body if anyone from the Alliance wants to come see them for advice, whether that's a minister or a soldier.

[Captain Untouchable]

Fair enough. I was just worried about the prospect of Dani having to roleplay Grace / Navaria conversations whenever the Minister of Intelligence and the Jedi rep work together, but if she's happy to do that then all is fine.

[Dasquian Belargic]

It's probably safe to have the whole Jedi Council as officials reps, if needs be. I'm sure Dani wont be forced into rping with herself, anyhoo.

[Vince]

Just letting folks that there would be an empty Inquisition/Knight encampment on the planet that could be used by the Jedi in setting up their own place. I don't expect they got far in making it a permanent structure, but it could be a good start.

[Miranda Tarkin]

It's probably safe to have the whole Jedi Council as officials reps, if needs be. I'm sure Dani wont be forced into rping with herself, anyhoo.

I likes :D

[Kelly Perris]

It's probably safe to have the whole Jedi Council as officials reps, if needs be. I'm sure Dani wont be forced into rping with herself, anyhoo.

I likes :D

As do I!... er, well... not that there's anything wrong with playing with yourself. :mischief

[Captain Untouchable]

So, I just watched that What if Episode I Was Good?" thing, and the dude was talking about the idea of Palpatine being an intermediary between the Senate and the Jedi.

If we're leaning away from having a sole representative of the Jedi like Jenny suggests (which I also like), might something like that work? It would give someone who can step into the void left by the "Commander of the Wheel" character as the guy who requests supplies / military assistance / etc on the Jedi's behalf, and it means there's still a strong link between the Alliance and the Jedi even without all the Rogues/etc around.

Someone like Taatani maybe? She's already friendly with the Jedi, she's a Senator, and I'm pretty sure she "Knows a guy" for anything the Jedi might need.

(Just thinking out loud - not trying to speak on anyone's behalf or anything.)

[Wei Wu Wei]

I like the planet Ossus. I agree that the Jedi Library makes a great story point for future development of the Order. And there's also the tree of Jedi Master Ood Bnar. Having a literal spiritual presence to watch over and protect the New Jedi Order is a cool idea to me.

I also like the idea of using the ships from the Wheel as temporary quarters. Perhaps later they could use one or several ships as a New Chu'unthor for the purpose of recruitment or even as a mobile platform for staging large-scale operations.

On a side note, there was talk about getting the Jedi an Ithorian Herd Ship. Were we still going to do that?

I also like the idea of the Jedi as advisors to the Alliance, rather than having their own seat on the Senate.

However, if Ossus eventually becomes settled by people outside the Jedi Order, it should have a seat on the Senate.

I do not like the idea of Jedi training/practicing tactics with Alliance. The Jedi weren't meant to be military leaders, and the idea of handing the Alliance a group of soldiers trained to fight Jedi would only be an opportunity for another corrupt leader to wipe them out again. If nothing else, the Jedi Order ought to at least learn from its mistakes from the Clone Wars that led up to the Jedi Purge.

[Zenas Codrey]

Zeke wants one of the spare Wheel ships for his family. Otherwise, the location of the Order doesn't change much for him or his family's situation. I've also been removed too long to really feel like I have much to contribute, not knowing anything of recent events in the universe, particularly not when fleets/politics are involved. But I know you guys will make a good decision.

[Taataani Meorrrei]

Taataani would happily add Jedi Liason to her Senatorial duties if that was desired.

[Dasquian Belargic]

Given that he used to be a Jedi and is now responsible for dealing with inter-government/faction relations, I think Salem would be well suited as a good between for the Jedi and the Alliance

[Captain Untouchable]

It would be helpful for Salem's evil puppet master stuff too I guess, and it'd help give Evil Kitty more stuff to do on that side of things.

Maybe both could work somehow? I'm not sure if Salem is intended to be a Senator as well, but being an ex Jedi and the Minister of State is plenty of excuse to visit often anyhow. Taa on the other hand doesn't have a Jedi past, so she's slightly more impartial, which the Senate might like. One rep from the Senate, and one from the Ruling Council?

[Dasquian Belargic]

I don't think he could be a Senator and a Minister, so will just be acting as a Minister for now :)

No problem having both of them act as go-betweens really.

[Captain Untouchable]

Well, I think Numax Meltstrong is meant to be both.... but Minister of State is a pretty weighty job, so I imagine it's not something one could multitask with other roles all that well, so it stands to reason that Salem would focus on it exclusively (as far as everyone knows :ohno).

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Wei and Palara have RPed recently on Ossus so maybe we could get their opinions as to where we should set up camp, etc?

Also, is our Jedi Tree an NPC?

[Kala'ndryl Ryj]

It had best be somewhere near a body of water, dammit -__-

[Vince]

Wei and Palara have RPed recently on Ossus so maybe we could get their opinions as to where we should set up camp, etc?

Also, is our Jedi Tree an NPC?

Well, the Library is the only real place we fleshed out in our thread there. Ood Bnar is an NPC, though I suppose if people wanted I could play him for those spiritualistic scenes of self-discovery or something. I have Tell Cho, but he's technically not a part of the Order, just a former Jedi whom I hope will be able to mentor and provide a foil/character to bounce off of for Jedi at the Senate and such.

Palara did report on what she saw at Ossus, and the Inquisition was setting up a research station/base near the library. The Jedi could use that as a starting point for whatever they're setting up on the planet. I don't think they made a good impression on the natives, so the natives would be a bit hostile to them also; but their proximity to the Library will provide some security.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

I figure the Library would be a central area of our camp, or at least a place the Jedi go a lot for study or working to preserve what's there. Maybe repairing the building/s...

edit: Also, can we think about making the Jedi forum/s more visible from the front page? Or... I don't know. They're really hard to find even if you know where they are. And they will need renaming and a new description. :uhoh

[Vansen Tyree]

Also, can we think about making the Jedi forum/s more visible from the front page? Or... I don't know. They're really hard to find even if you know where they are. And they will need renaming and a new description. :uhoh

We might want to cut out the middle man as far as Roleplaying Groups, and just have the Sub-Forums we actually use listed on the front page. We have three Roleplaying Groups, but within that there are only perhaps four or five Sub-Forums we would actually still have a use for:
Core Worlds for the important Imperial worlds like Coruscant and Kuat; and also for the Corellian/Duro Sector(s), which is our neutral / demilitarized zone.
Bothan Sector, for the Alliance capital and Intel/SpecForce HQ on Bothawui; for the big fleet base at Moonus Mandel where most of the Fleeters, the Novgorod, and possibly Rogue Squadron will hang out.
Hapes Frontier or whatever name is appropriate for Hapes/Onderon/Zeltros/etc, where Salem's sneaky shizzle goes down.
Ossus, for the new Jedi Temple.
The Outer Rim, a catch-all for all of the Cloud City, Carshoulis Cluster, Corporate Sector, Hutt/Nar Shaddaa, Mustafar, etc threads that end up happening.

We'd go from three Roleplaying Groups with numerous Sub-Forums to just having the five Sub-Forums on the front page, and it'd make stuff considerably easier to find, and more visible. It also stops it being a "you have to be an Imperial to post here" sort of affair: I think that's one of the reasons that a lot of stuff has been happening in the main roleplaying forum (where everyone can see it / etc) rather than taking advantage of the geographical sub-forums.

[Wei Wu Wei]

I like Vansen's idea a lot.

I also agree with Vince: Ood Bnar is an NPC. I plan to do a lot with Master Ood Bnar in Wei's next big thing. I think having someone to write Ood Bnar would be helpful, but in the event the character gets used a lot, having only one person roleplay him might be overwhelming.

Perhaps get one or two people to do it?

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Has anything been decided?

[Captain Untouchable]

As far as my understanding goes, we've decided -
The Jedi will definitely be on Ossus, where
The Wheel has probably landed, and the Jedi are probably living out of those ships (New Caprica style) because,
They have not yet explored all of the library (this is where we'll start), so there will be adventures to be had. Also,
Ossus doesn't have a Senator, but there will be a handful of Alliance ships defending the planet. Even so,
The Jedi will not be actively participating in Alliance politics or military stuff (yet).
That seems to be the consensus as far as I can tell, anyhow.

[Serena Laran]

I think "we" need to re-write the stickied post in the Jedi forums.... since we're not the Wheel any more?

[Droo]

Bumped because there's loads of relevant and interesting stuff here.

Also: now that the Jedi are settled and are developing their makeshift camp with aid from the Alliance, is it time to consider their role as something more than a Hogwarts School for Jedicraft and Jediry?

Certainly for Jedi characters old and new alike, Ossus will always be a place of refuge and learning, and the heart of Jedi activity. In fact, we've scarcely explored the opportunities yet. But from an in-character persepctive, I'm thinking about how the rest of the Alliance considers them, and their purpose in the grand scheme of things, and indeed, how the Jedi consider themselves in this picture. They have, after all, spent a long time being secretly ushered around the galaxy courtesy of the Alliance, and under the protection of the Alliance military. They have had copious amounts of resources commited to them in the past, and have done little to reciprocate the generosity of their saviours. There was once talk of integrating the Jedi into military operations in and around the Wheel, but that never really got a chance to take off what with the switch to Year 10 and redeploying the Jedi to Ossus.

Undoubtedly, it was in the Alliance's best interests to protect the last remnants of the Jedi, and keep them sweet. Now it's time, I reckon, from an IC and OOC point of view, for their work to start paying dividends; in-character, because it makes sense, and out-of-character, because it would give Jedi characters more purpose in this fascinating landscape that has been resculpted from our roleplaying sandbox.

Basically, as much as I like the Ossus setting, I'd like for it to feel like the Jedi are actually contributing towards the ebb and flow of adventures, as opposed to simply being subject to them. I've already started laying the groundwork for doing things of this ilk with my own character, but it would be nice to have the input of others, so anyone else who writes a Jedi character understands what opportunities are available to them and what may be considered out-of-bounds, so to speak.

Also, on top of considering how the Jedi can contribute towards the Alliance, I'm interested in hearing what Jedi-roleplayers would like to see the Jedi working towards as a group (on top of growing their own food and having running water!). What kind of adventures would you like to see on their radar outside of their role within the Alliance?

[Captain Untouchable]

Hogwarts is an interesting analogy.

I think a big problem with the Jedi from a roleplayer perspective is the Master/Apprentice dynamic. It's traditional, and it's canon, but it often seems like it requires the planets aligning for Masters and Padawans to be around/active at the same sort of time. For the Padawan, it can make it difficult for your character to feel like they're actually advancing anywhere; for Masters, I imagine it might feel like you don't have as much freedom to roam the galaxy if you aren't able to bring your sidekick along. There are always plenty of people to interact with, and that's great for character development; but as far as character advancement goes it can feel a little bit like spinning your wheels, and I'm fairly confident I'm not the only one who has felt like that at some point or other.

What if we were to do away with the idea of Masters and Apprentices: not as a "you can do shared classes" work-around like we had on the Wheel, but actually do away with it entirely? Perhaps there are too many untrained Jedi, and not enough trained ones to pair everyone off; so instead we're like Hogwarts, with Master Loki teaching Defense Against the Dark Arts, Master Laran teaching History of Magic, and that sort of thing. Instead of there being just one character with whom you can advance your training, there's an entire faculty of people who are equally capable of doing that; and if a Knight/Master wants an adventure with a Padawan, it doesn't have to be their Padawan: it can be whoever is available at the time. We'd be doing away with the segregation entirely, and it'd be a purely mix-and-match sort of affair.

If there's a specific student and a specific master that makes a particularly dynamic duo, a Master/Padawan relationship could be a special circumstance / honour student type thing: but it'd be a teacher taking a special interest in a student and giving them bonus training / missions / etc to fast-track them, not the be-all and end-all?

[Droo]

I see no reason why this cannot be the case. Our band of Jedi are nothing if not unconventional. In fact, I'm more in favour of open-source training than I am traditional master-apprentice pairings, and for the most part, that's actually how I've been roleplaying things with Loki. It's best for everyone, and those roleplayers who want their characters to have a special master-apprentice relationship can rock on with it.

[Dasquian Belargic]

I would love to do literally anything with some Jedi and Bryna. Some adventures off-world would be fantastic.

[Taataani Meorrrei]

Agreed. I'd love to cut Anbira loose while he's still alive!

[Zereth Lancer]

I think we have enough Jedi to form an "Away Team" for some kind of mission, whether investigating sith hotspots, quelling cults (my character Alexia Sturkov actually started two cults, one on Corellia and the other on Naboo), or even throwing their hats back into the diplomatic scene. I figure there will be some discord between all the races being thrown together, especially in the case of immigrants trying to find their place and boiling pots of races type cities springing up across the galaxy (like Little Mon Cal). Plenty of room for Jedi to act the part of the peacekeepers. I figure with the cold war stand off that Imperial Agents could be slipping into Alliance space to spark discord.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

I'm pretty sure 'shared classes' have been a thing since Yoda trained the younglings in Attack of the Clones. We've done it at the Wheel, we've been RPing it's happening on Ossus. The problem with training is people having time to RP, which just isn't something Padawans and Masters have in spades OOC like we used to when we were teenagers. I said it, we're old. If the site was more active with more RPers we probably wouldn't have a problem.

Throw Bryna into Initiation, Jenny.

Also, I think doing peacekeeping stuff is cool and Jedi should do it. We are part of the Alliance, Ossus is a planet there after all, and while we may not be participating as a full political member (I can't remember if we were having a Liasion to the Senate? I think it might have been Navaria) diplomacy and settling disputes is something the Jedi historically have done and the other planets in the Alliance may call on Ossus to help them settle things. It isn't something that would have to go through the Senate or the military, just the Jedi helping out the Free Planets. As I see it anyway.

[Captain Untouchable]

We're geographically inside Alliance space... that isn't quite the same as being "in the Alliance". Lots of planets are within our borders, but they aren't all politically affiliated with us. Some are neutral, independent, etc.

When we initially discussed stuff, there was quite a lot of reluctance to have any sort of political ties to the Alliance at all; we basically took a lot of steps away from integration in the Alliance. Having the Jedi called in as third-party mediators is a very good idea; but they'd be a third party, they wouldn't be "Alliance" per se.

[Droo]

That isn't true. It was agreed that the Jedi would not be a part of the senate, but no steps have been taken to distance them from the Alliance. As discussed in this thread, the Jedi are recieving Alliance aid on Ossus to help them build a new home for themselves, and are working alongside the Alliance military, who are on site and presumably in orbit:


As far as the military goes, protecting Ossus would be the responsibility of the 2nd Fleet: they're the navy unit up in that top right / Mon Calamari area of the Alliance. I would imagine that Ossus would have a modest force in orbit: not too much, because like Holly says you're a decent way inside Alliance territory. It probably wouldn't warrant the protection of an elite unit like Rogue Squadron any more.

Politically, the Jedi have no sway, of course, but that doesn't make them any less a part of the Alliance.

[Emelie Shadowstar]

Okay...

So I only keep hearing about stuff second hand but since I have two Jedi running around I want some like...solid damn answer on this. *grump mode activate*

...Are the Jedi actually part of the Alliance? I thought they weren't so they didn't have any sort of actual bias one way or the other between Alliance and Empire or am I completely remembering something wrong there?

If they are not part of the Alliance then acting as peacekeepers within their area seems like a serious conflict of interest....?


Yeah I'm just confused.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

As far as my understanding goes, we've decided -

The Jedi will definitely be on Ossus, where
The Wheel has probably landed, and the Jedi are probably living out of those ships (New Caprica style) because,
They have not yet explored all of the library (this is where we'll start), so there will be adventures to be had. Also,
Ossus doesn't have a Senator, but there will be a handful of Alliance ships defending the planet. Even so,
The Jedi will not be actively participating in Alliance politics or military stuff (yet).

That seems to be the consensus as far as I can tell, anyhow.

This is the consensus we came to just a few posts up when we first hashed all this out. I always understood the Jedi to be part of the Alliance, if not a political part of it.

[Taataani Meorrrei]

My interpretation of the Jedi was that they were Space Vatican, in the sense that they're largely in agreement with the Alliance, but they're semi-autonomous to the point where they aren't beholden to support what the Alliance is doing if they feel its against the will of the force, etc.

[Dasquian Belargic]

My interpretation of the Jedi was that they were Space Vatican, in the sense that they're largely in agreement with the Alliance, but they're semi-autonomous to the point where they aren't beholden to support what the Alliance is doing if they feel its against the will of the force, etc.

Yup! My understanding too.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Yes but the Jedi on Ossus are one of the Free Planets in the Alliance of Free Planets.

[Droo]

Since the establishment of the Wheel, the Jedi have been working fairly closely with the Alliance to get to where they are, and while no-one may have signed on the dotted line, my presumption has always been they had been welcomed into the fold, as it were. We have boots-on-the-ground Alliance soldiers and other personnel, and Alliance ships up in orbit, and the Jedi have been working with them, and in some cases training with them. Because they don't have senate representation, it is presumable they are not beholden to Alliance politics because they aren't themselves a political body, but I just don't get where all this talk of the Jedi distancing themselves from the Alliance has come from.

[Captain Untouchable]

Clearly there's a pretty big divergence of people's understanding of what is going on, then.

Based on the people who are in the Dark Banana hangout at the minute (Sarah, Christin, Charley, Dee), the Jedi distancing itself from the Alliance is our understanding of what the plan was/is. That's why s'Ilancy, Zem Vymes, Vansen Tyree, etc were all left without the roles/etc that they had previously been expecting to fill. If things are different, and if things are being roleplayed as different, that's not something we were all on the same page about.

[Droo]

Clearly not, and I just don't get why, because no such thing has ever been discussed. I can understand why people see the Jedi as autonomous politicially, because we agreed they have no political representation. But to think they were severing ties with the Alliance, with whom it is documented in this thread and other roleplaying threads, that they're pretty much shacked up together on Ossus, especially after they helped round them up, protect them, and deliver them to a new home, is completely left of field.

I'm not sure what you mean when you say folks like s'Ilancy, Zem Vymes and Vansen were all left without the roles they'd been expecting to fill as a result of this distancing. Vansen I understand to an extent, as a result of our past conversations, but why this sentiment is more widely shared is a little baffling.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

I don't really get it either tbh.

edit: I mean, the Alliance helped the Jedi get back together as a group and pretty much are financing them settling in on Ossus. Those are pretty close ties.

[Captain Untouchable]

Clearly the five of us are incorrect, then. Nevermind.

[Dasquian Belargic]

There's no correct or incorrect here. We just need to figure out where the misunderstandings have happened, and come to a collective agreement on what is going to work best for all of us, and we can do that by having a discussion about it.

There have been some different interpretations of what the current status of the Jedi is like, and that's understandable. This thread is pretty much all that we've used to establish a fairly large change in the status quo, after all, so it's only natural that there should be some crossed wires, particularly after we've all been largely inactive as far as RPing goes for a long while now.

If necessary, we have the luxury of being able to define, or re-define, what we've created, as there hasn't been a whole lot of post Year 10 action at this stage (at least to my knowledge).

I'm happy to go with whatever the general consensus is on how the Jedi/Alliance relationship is defined.

[Droo]

I'll keep this as brief as I can:

In conjuring up a handful of throwaway plot ideas for Jedi-centric roleplays, my thoughts returned to the Jedi library on Ossus, and how we've done next to nothing with it so far. Then I got to thinking about the current discussion concerning the link between the Jedi and the Alliance. One of the things I was aiming for in thinking up some new Jedi missions, what with the present debate, was to make them as independent, and as disconnected from the Alliance as possible. The logistics of this become apparent when you take into consideration the Jedi are in Alliance space. And as a result, I had an idea.

What if, buried deep within the vaults of the library, an ancient and miraculously unscathed computer exists. The only way to access and activate this machine is by interfacing with a holocron. This unlocks a dormant communications network which spans the galaxy through myriad relay stations; the same network the Jedi of yore once used to transmit and gather the vast wealth of information locked away in the library. Naturally, the intent would be for the communications network to be accessible only to Jedi, providing our small growing group with a means to act privately and independently of their Alliance friends.

What appeals to me about the idea is this would be the first thing the Jedi could truly say is that they alone obtained and is exclusively their own. Not to mention the fact that it would be a very useful tool in facilitating off-world adventures without cutting Jedi characters off from the rest of the group.

There are details I've left out here, plot points that will be fun to unveil as and when it is neccessary, but suffice it to say it wouldn't operate like your run-of-the-mill holonet. Before I get too far ahead of myself, I wanted to see if anyone had any objections to this? Or any thoughts to contribute at all, for that matter? I am aware this is quite a considerable thing I'm just pulling out of my rear end here, but it's all in the name of a good story, and allowing the Jedi to take a step towards a more autonomous existence.

[Vittore Montegue]

I'm not sure I understand what purpose this network actually serves?

As I understand it, the Alliance, the Empire, the Hutts, and everyone else is using the same Holonet infrastructure, the same "internet", that the Galactic Republic set up thousands of years ago. The same Holonet that allows Sassy to phone up and check on Black Sun stuff on Nar Shaddaa is the same Holonet that Obi Wan used to contact the Jedi Council while he was on Geonosis. The Alliance and Empire might monitor the traffic that goes through the servers/satellites/etc within their territory (the way the NSA can/does monitor the internet), but the Jedi aren't (as far as I know) under any sort of communications blackout?

I can understand why having a private Jedi-only communications network might be "nice" for the sake of privacy, but aside from the thread exploring the Library to find it, I'm not sure what it facilitates that wasn't already possible prior to that? To paraphrase a member of Alabama's government: the Holonet we got communicates pretty good, don't it? :uhoh

Or is the point that the Library "wakes up" things in certain lost/forgotten locations, that the Jedi are then going to wander off and find?

[Droo]

Or is the point that the Library "wakes up" things in certain lost/forgotten locations, that the Jedi are then going to wander off and find?

Pretty much this. It's a springboard for other things. In terms of functionality, it offers the same service as the holonet, but what is special about it is the interface is uniquely Jedi, and I'm not just referring to the holocron feature. It's also the sense of ownership that I like; the Jedi have been ferried, fed, protected, and rehoused by the Alliance, and precious little of what they have actually belongs to them. This discovery will be the first thing that the new Jedi can claim to be their own, and it is something that brings them together, almost literally, what with it being a communications network, and at the same time it has a bit of old Jedi lore about it. But most importantly, as you mentioned, it will provide them with an opportunity to go off on Jedi-centric storylines, and really, that's where everyone's imagination can really kick in.

[Kale]

Sounds like some Jedi-themed Indiana Jones shenanigans are in order. :)

Or perhaps like Prometheus, but with better adherence to health and safety protocols and fewer murder worms?

[Rhianna]

Adventure time. :eee

[Commander Koine]

Sorry if this seems sarcastically obvious, but didn't we pick Ossus because it had the Library?

Some sort of plot mcguffin to springboard more opportunities is a great idea, but rather than a technological plot device that we find by stumbling around in the ruins, would it not be more fitting to go with a plot device found through studying what is in the archives? Anyone, Jedi or otherwise, can stumble across a dusty telephone in a forgotten back room; actually sitting down and accessing the knowledge and wisdom that we came to Ossus to exploit seems a bit truer to what we originally had in mind.

If Indiana Jones is what you're after though... in Knights of the Old Republic, your character had to find special artefacts in ruins dotted around the galaxy, and by combining them together you wound up with the location of some hidden/forgotten planet. Maybe the Great Jedi Library has a holocron that sends us off to some of the Jedi's oldest temples, and from what we find there we're ultimately able to find our way to... Tython? Somewhere like that?

[Lilaena De'Ville]

I like your idea Droo :)

Edit: a holocron found while exploring the archives/library is pretty much the idea, right? And an old dusty computer in the archives?

[Droo]

actually sitting down and accessing the knowledge and wisdom that we came to Ossus to exploit seems a bit truer to what we originally had in mind.

That's exactly what would be happening, except in this case, it's interactive. There's absolutely no reason why Jedi can't mine the library's wonders in the more traditional sense, too. This is just an idea I had that I liked because I found it unique and has plenty of potential.

[Commander Koine]

Fair enough. :)

[Kyle Krogen]

I have to agree with Jace that a Jedi exclusive communication relay seems really out of place, that is unless the relay predates the holonet and has miraculously weathered over a thousand years of inactivity to continue to work. It would still require each point of the relay being activated individually, unless Ossus just happens to be some kind of control center for the whole relay that allows it to remotely activate all the other relays. Considering how inactive they are the other relays will likely need to have power sources replaced, or reconnected/turned back on if they have some kind of eternal power source. It would be very unlikely that in over a thousand years that they have remained in mint condition and completely unmolested by war, thieves, and weather. It would be a lot of work to get the whole system up and running again. Quite a few relays might be lost behind Imperial borders as well.

It's definitely a novel idea.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

I believe the idea is it's a way of communicating that uses the Force? So instead of holograms you'd sort of 'meet' the other Jedi you're contacting in your mind.

and if that's not the idea then it should be ;)

[Emelie Shadowstar]

I really have no issues for/against the whole thing except for what Kyle pointed out. But like if there's a long series of threads with setting this all up then maybe it'd be a pretty cool saga... just hopefully there'd be room on each "mission" for anyone who wanted to come along from experienced Jedi to padawatsits :p

Though... I don't know about the whole...relay that boosts Force communication over long distances. I'm not going to wave the "NOOO That's OP!" flag by any means but I do have to admit there's something about it that makes me uneasy? I can't quite put my finger on it but I wanted to say something in case I'm not the only one.
And if I am...thennnn uhhh... ignore my unease and go forth? :uhoh

[Vansen Tyree]

Uneasy is the word I would go with as well.

It's not going to negatively impact me if you do decide to go with the plan as-is, but I feel like the same end result is achievable in a slightly more plausible way?

[Lilaena De'Ville]

I probably misunderstood what Droo was talking about over aim because I was eating dinner, so don't get worried on account of me.

[Droo]

I don't think it is anything to feel uneasy about. It doesn't work like Cerebro, amplifying a Jedi's power. Since the cat is more or less out of the bag, I'll go into more detail. In order to use the network, a Jedi must be carrying a unique kind of holocron, interaction with which would then grant him or her access. The relay network would then create a virtual space in which the Jedi could appear to each other and speak, a Jedi Matrix if you will. Naturally, any Jedi communicating this way would be vulnerable on the outside world, as they'd be deep in meditation with the holocron.

Some interesting points have been raised regarding the condition of the relay stations. The idea is that they would be reactivated from the central hub on Ossus, and there would definately be issues to be dealt with, and that can be an ongoing thing for people to pick up and play with whenever they fancy. The holocrons is another interesting story point, because none exist within the library, but through the network, Jedi would be able to track some down and learn to rebuild them for their own use.

[Captain Untouchable]

I'm even more uneasy now, actually.

1) This network is great for stopping non-Jedi from being able to get in on our business, but what about darksiders? If these "communicrons" are lying around in ruined temples, what's to stop Salem Ave or Vega Van-Derveld from getting their hands on one and going all Sauron/Saruman on the network? You never know who will be watching, and recent events should have given the Jedi quite a lot of darksider paranoia.

2) The rarity of the communicrons (hard to find, hard to produce) makes it very exclusive. To start with, only the Jedi elite will benefit: if you only have five communicrons, you're going to give them to your most important five people. That opens up plenty of opportunities for your top five, but introduces a fair bit of lag time before the lower tiers benefit from the idea.

3) It makes it even harder for Padawans to do anything. If you don't have a communicron, and/or you're not "senior" enough to be trusted with one, you can't take advantage of the network. If you can't take advantage of the network, you can't use it as a springboard for adventures. We're back to Padawans (and junior Knights) finding it difficult to do anything without "adult" supervision.

4) In terms of players, who gets one? Sarah won't; Cleo Némain and Desmond Nil'vak are both lowly Padawans. Dee won't; same reason. Kaman and I probably won't; Amos Iakona is a Padawan, and both Inyos Aamoran and Ilias Nytrau aren't really "in" the circle of trust. Christin presumably won't; Loklorien s'Ilancy isn't going to be in the Jedi's good graces for quite a while. Will Charley, or will Zem Vymes helping save s'Ilancy have alienated him? Will Chris, just because Morgan Evanar tends to go wandering a lot? I feel like there's a lot of people who, initially at least, will be on the outside looking in with this idea.


It is a very cool, very sci-fi idea that reminds me a lot of things from Stargate, which is a sure-fire way to win me over. If you want to do it on the basis of it being a cool story you want to write, you most definitely should... I just don't think it's going to create as much opportunity for others as you think.

[Charley]

Reminds me of the palantir. Useful, but could just as easily be dangerous if evil eyes gaze upon.

I imagine that once discovered they could possibly be put on loan for certain missions? The bottleneck problem does potentially exist, but not all missions out would require the use of these artifacts. Kinda adds spice to the dish.

[Droo]

I think there are a lot of assumptions being made regarding to whom the holocrons will be made available. The short answer is everyone. And no-one has one to start with, so we're all in the same boat. The first one will be retrieved promptly following the discovery of the network. Anyone is free to go off and find one in whatever way you'd like, but as I said before, the first holocron will be reverse engineered so that more can be made for all Jedi. This is an inclusive thing, not something reserved for the Jedi elite.

As for darksiders, well, if eventually one of them did acquire a holocron, that would just make things more interesting.

Edit: Also, let's not forget this is only one possible option people can explore if they wish to go adventuring with their Jedi characters. I have a short list of a few mission templates that I'll post a little later that anyone can feel free to use and group up with others to go travelling, doing Jedi stuff. I don't see how this network can be at all limiting when it is in no way definitive.

[Rurrick Grov]

So, it's a "finders keepers" situation?

Or, if Cleo Némain finds one digging around in the bins behind a Wal-Mart on Corellia, does she have to turn it in to the Jedi Council so they can allocate it to someone who will put it to better use?

You seem to be saying that these things are both rare (and thus exclusive) and readily available for everyone. I don't understand how they can be both?

[Droo]

They are rare, but they can be tracked down. And when the time comes, should someone wish for their character to use one of these things, they are at liberty to either roleplay the story of how they acquired an original, or simply skip that and claim to have been given one of the newly constructed holocrons. Either way, I've no objection.

[Dasquian Belargic]

Apologies if this has been covered off and I've missed it... Have we come to some kind of decision on how the Jedi/Alliance are connected?

[Droo]

No. I've said my piece: the details that were agreed upon are here in this thread(namely, no senate representation, but an Alliance presence in orbit, and on the ground), and I'm clueless as to how the general consensus has deviated from that in the time since. There's nothing more I can say on the matter.

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Yes I thought the consensus we came to in March was what we were going with and is what I've being RPing with with my Jedi.

[Captain Untouchable]

How the consensus has deviated doesn't seem to be all that relevant, Droo: the fact that it has deviated is what is important.

Rather than dragging heels and going back and forth about what each of all thought was the situation, perhaps we could try and be constructive... work out a situation that we are all, now, happy with and understanding of, so that we can answer Jenny's very simple and perfectly reasonable question?

[Rhianna]

:whaa Why make sense at this point. Let's just plan some more, that'll get us somewhere.

[Arya Ravenwing]

:whaa Why make sense at this point. Let's just plan some more, that'll get us somewhere.
Yes, more planning! :eee

But seriously, we all hashed it out months ago. I don't think that the people who have been RPing since then should be forced to throw out their RPs, or parts of them, because other people remembered incorrectly.

[Droo]

Those who believe the relationship between the Jedi and the Alliance is a divergent one are welcome to come forward and express their interpretation of the present status quo. I've said several times what I believe the situation is with regards to Ossus and the Jedi and how the Alliance are involved, and if I get an impression of what the other side has in mind, then a dialogue can begin.

Also, I have to echo what Holly said, I am personally very frustrated with this situation, in that I have been roleplaying things in accordance with what was discussed here. I started that introduction to Ossus thread so everyone could have a starting point, and no-one raised any concerns back then. That it seems we have to renegotiate this all over is a real ball ache.

[Dasquian Belargic]

What about a compromise:


no senate representation, but an Alliance presence in orbit, and on the ground

As Droo explained, this is what we agreed on in March. It's been roleplayed pre-year 10, and post-year 10 to some degree.

Could we make it a storyline that the Alliance is doing a gradual downsizing of their presence on/around Ossus? To give the Jedi a greater degree of support during the initial stages of their settling on Ossus, but then allowing them to become more indepedent as time goes on. This would allow people to keep all the threads that they've been posting to/planning in-tact, but also open up some scope for some of the other plots that have been bandied around.

From an IC perspective, the Alliance is theoretically struggling with managing the difficulties of suddenly having such a large selection of worlds to have actual government on, so it's plausible that the resources being sent to Ossus could be needed elsewhere and thus gradually drawn away.

[Captain Untouchable]

No one's asking anyone to throw anything out, Holly. There's no need for any of the "remembered incorrectly" stuff, either: we're supposed to be working collaboratively on this sort of thing, not name-calling and taking pot shots.

Perhaps though there's some sort of compromise that will allow what has been done so far and what has been "mis"understood to go hand in hand, leading to happiness and cupcakes for everyone?


What about a compromise:


no senate representation, but an Alliance presence in orbit, and on the ground

As Droo explained, this is what we agreed on in March. It's been roleplayed pre-year 10, and post-year 10 to some degree.

Could we make it a storyline that the Alliance is doing a gradual downsizing of their presence on/around Ossus? To give the Jedi a greater degree of support during the initial stages of their settling on Ossus, but then allowing them to become more indepedent as time goes on. This would allow people to keep all the threads that they've been posting to/planning in-tact, but also open up some scope for some of the other plots that have been bandied around.

From an IC perspective, the Alliance is theoretically struggling with managing the difficulties of suddenly having such a large selection of worlds to have actual government on, so it's plausible that the resources being sent to Ossus could be needed elsewhere and thus gradually drawn away.

I think it would be helpful to understand just what "a presence" is supposed to entail. What has been specifically mentioned, and what is understood by the people who understand that it's there? Is it just a couple of ships in orbit? Is it a squadron somewhere on the planet? Have any ships been mentioned by name/type/etc? A force of engineers has been mentioned - is it a big force, or a small one?

It might be that no downsizing is necessary: it might merely be that a matter of definition is the issue here: what is in place already might seem totally fine, if we only knew what exactly it was. Or, it might be that some sort of "gradually handing responsibility over to the Jedi" situation can be worked out that people are happy with, etc.

[Charley]

Not sure about specifically mentioned, but from what I've read and what I've interpreted on the ground is that the Alliance basically has had a detachment of engineers and "peace keepers" for lack of a better word. Kinda like a UN mission where they could provide limited defense and stuff, but their primary mission is to help get settlements built and help get the Jedi on their feet.

Not sure about the size, but I'd think maybe 300 would be more than enough considering how relatively small the Jedi faction is currently.

EDIT: It's entirely possible I may have missed some detail written to expound on that. If anything is in conflict with what I'm imagining then ignore me :)

[Dasquian Belargic]

Off the top of my head, I was thinking of things that would help create a long-term settlement such as mechanics and engineers to assist with installing buildings/equipment, people to help with stabilizing the agriculture so the Jedi have a self-sufficient supply of food and water, perhaps a small contingent of shuttles for transport and a small number of starfighters or other armed vessels, to protect the Jedi if they venture out somewhere potentially dangerous. Plus whatever other generic non-military stuff that people are interested in having the opportunity to interact with, I guess :)

I don't have exact numbers, because I honestly don't know how many would be reasonable. I'm not sure that it's essential to drill down into that level of detail, if we say that there are less Alliance representatives than there are Jedi, and they are predominantly there to teach the Jedi how to do a thing.

[Droo]

In my head, I always imagined there were a lot more Alliance personnel than Jedi, chiefly because they would be the ones with experience in setting up something like this and the Jedi are quite a small group who lack that kind of experience. The scope of the Ossus site was considerable when I first desribed it, I had it as a growing community of Alliance professionals and Jedi, working together along with a small army of droids to develop all the facilities they needed. The Jedi were living out of the landed Whaladon, soldiers were stationed at the barracks, with mechanics, engineers, doctors, and what have you all living in a makeshift cluster of shuttles, tents, and prefabricated little homes.

Edit: To get a feel for what I had in mind, check out the opening post of this thread (http://theholo.net/forum/showthread.php?23290-One-Day-on-Ossus-10-001), the description of the site begins from the 7th paragraph.

In my head, I figured that once everything was up and running, a few specialists would be left behind to keep things running smoothly, like the mechanics, electricians, droid engineers, etc. along with any essential droids and hardware. While the soldiers would stick around, working with the Jedi, because it was my belief at the time that the Alliance viewed the Jedi as an asset they'd want to develop. I think, ultimately, I didn't see it as a Jedi site, but an Alliance site that had sprung up because of the small number of Jedi that had been relocated there. There was even a visit from Taataani and other senators under way, too, so I just figured it all fell under the Alliance banner.

The downsizing suggestion makes sense, there'd be no reason to keep those kind of numbers around once the site was up and running and self-sustaining. I suppose the question that arises is, once they withdraw the bulk of their presence on Ossus, how do the Alliance percieve the Jedi? An ally or an independent group? Has all their assistance simply been an example of the Alliance coming to the aid of a small and vulnerable group, then helping them get back on their feet before granting them independence? That does sound like quite a UN thing to do, and maybe it is done in good faith to keep the Jedi sweet for the future.

[Captain Untouchable]

I was thinking in terms of ballparks in terms of dozens vs hundreds when I was asking for "specifics". That clears it up nicely - thanks Droo!

Reading back over this thread, and thinking back over what I remember from group chats, I think the perception of the Jedi "distancing themselves" might in part stem from the fact that there was so much resistance to the idea of a "Jedi Senator". Perhaps if there was a better understanding of why, that might clear things up.

The Jedi not wanting to throw their lot in with the Alliance, not be beholden to it's laws / policies / etc is one thing... but by not having anyone - Senator, Representative, Ambassador, or otherwise - involved with the Senate, they're cutting themselves out of every single discussion the Alliance has, and every single decision the Alliance makes. They aren't party to any discussions on humanitarian aid, on legal crises, on refugees, on diplomacy, etc. The Alliance could wander over to the Sluis Sector tomorrow and forge an alliance with the Bpfasshi (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Bpfasshi), and the Jedi wouldn't be in any position to raise concerns about it. They've "distanced" themselves by not being part of the conversation, as it were.

Is there a reason for that? Are the Jedi still living in secret, hence the Alliance protection of their planet? Are trying to echo the Jedi Order of old and set themselves up as advisors? If so... why don't they have anyone in a position (ie. in the Senate) in order to voice that advice? (That last bit in particular is what I'm struggling with.)

Also, if the Jedi aren't trying to distance themselves, then what does that mean for Ossus? Have the Jedi called dibs on the entire planet, or are they only custodians of the Library itself, leaving the rest of the planet as fair game? Might the Alliance want to make use of this large, verdant, and mostly unpopulated world for agriculture, refugee colonies, etc... and would the Jedi be okay with it if they did?

(Bear in mind that a lot of people may want to emigrate from the Empire to the Alliance, and new homes will need to be built for them. A few of us Senator types have already talked about ways to do this within our own turf, but there's always a demand for land: it's the one thing they aren't making any more of.)

[Sasseeri Reeouurra]

We have a Jedi Liaison to the Alliance, or were supposed to, in Navaria as I recall.

[Captain Untouchable]

To the Alliance, yes. The idea was (as I recall / understand it) that she was there to liaise with the Ministers and the military. That is not the same thing as someone sitting in the Senate offering sage advice. That's not something, I think, that we ever really talked about.

[Charley]

I can only answer that question IC as Taataani or my other Alliance government people might respond.

They'd consider the Jedi as both a protectorate and as a potential ally. They spent a lot of blood and treasure keeping the Jedi safe from Imperial aggression and I think they'd still feel honor-bound to come to the Jedi's aid in a crisis. I don't think they'd garrison or fleet the place up simply because there are so many areas that need that kind of protection, but they'd feel that if a threat were to appear against Ossus that they ought to respond to it.

As far as allies, there is both the hope that the Jedi can use their sanctuary world to once again become an organization that helps to protect peace and to arbitrate disputes. I think there's very real worry that mistakes of old might happen once again if the relationship between the two groups is more cozy than that, so while there is a desire for embrace, it's kind of an arm's length embrace if that makes sense.

I mentioned Space Vatican as an example before, because I think the Jedi still kind of dictate the moral foundation that the Alliance strives to be on, so it would probably be important for the Alliance to conduct themselves in a manner that has their blessing. Of course they are free to go their separate ways on some issues, but that would be politically at the peril of an Alliance leader to suggest.

[Droo]

Re: the Jedi not having senate representation



Is there a reason for that? Are the Jedi still living in secret, hence the Alliance protection of their planet? Are trying to echo the Jedi Order of old and set themselves up as advisors? If so... why don't they have anyone in a position (ie. in the Senate) in order to voice that advice? (That last bit in particular is what I'm struggling with.)

Also, if the Jedi aren't trying to distance themselves, then what does that mean for Ossus? Have the Jedi called dibs on the entire planet, or are they only custodians of the Library itself, leaving the rest of the planet as fair game? Might the Alliance want to make use of this large, verdant, and mostly unpopulated world for agriculture, refugee colonies, etc... and would the Jedi be okay with it if they did?


I think it's because people don't see, and probably don't want to see, the Jedi as a political organisation. Politically, it would be strange surely to have a representative for one minority/religious group, and not others. However, there is a work around for that. Personally, I have no objection to Alliance citizens making a home for themselves on Ossus, provided the Jedi are given their space for both privacy and security. It's mental to think a tiny group of people could claim an entire planet for themselves, and following the mission to rescue Serena from Coruscant, I think it's safe to say it is known that the Jedi are back, and are regrouping. Absolute secrecy is no longer neccessary.

Anyway, if more people start to populate Ossus, then perhaps a convenient marriage of politics and Jedi representation could see a Jedi diplomat, someone like Navaria, elected to represent Ossus as a member of the Alliance of Free Planets. That would then cover both bases without making it look like the Jedi have senate representation purely on the basis of being a minority group.

[Aimee Connors]

I sort of see the settling there and exploration of the Jedi Library to be like what might happen here if we found the Library at Alexandria and could excavate it. (Well, if the library had significance to a semi-religious group with mystical powers.) Besides Jedi who might see it as a pilgrimage site as well as a place to be studied, there would be scores of academics who would be foaming at the mouth to get in there and start researching.

It's been done a little in some of the RPs, mentioning some scientists studying the plant life on Ossus for one, and I could see the main camp/compound/complex/village becoming a place of learning and study for academics, not just Jedi. I'm not describing it adequately, perhaps.

[Augustus Valorum]

I really like the idea of non-Jedi archaeologists!

It also might be interesting to have tourists / pilgrims of a non Jedi variety making their way over there as well: it is a "hokey religion" after all. Maybe even refugees from the Empire who would much rather be under the protection of the Jedi than the former rebels?


Anyway, if more people start to populate Ossus, then perhaps a convenient marriage of politics and Jedi representation could see a Jedi diplomat, someone like Navaria, elected to represent Ossus as a member of the Alliance of Free Planets. That would then cover both bases without making it look like the Jedi have senate representation purely on the basis of being a minority group.

I'm thinking more in terms of a Representative, a la Holly's character from Krant. The Krantian homeworld falls under the umbrella of the two Bothan Senators. In order to avoid that region of space from having too much political influence, they only have two Senators... but the Krantians, as well as the Veknoids from Moonus Mandel, get a Representative... like Jar Jar Binks. They might not have a direct vote, but they have just as much of a right to speak up and offer their opinion as a Senator does.

I think having the Jedi in that sort of role - there to advise, not to vote - would not only fit with the idea of the Alliance revering the Jedi Order's legacy; it also sets an interesting precedent for other opinion yes / vote no people who are allowed to sit in the Senate chamber and talk during debates. Personally, I'd like to see a Representative from someone like the Lantillian Spacers' Brotherhood (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Lantillian_Spacers%27_Brotherhood) too (tucked in under the Lantillies Senator), to offer their "expert opinion" on taxation, customs, and so on.

At any rate, that's somewhat different from what we talked about Navaria doing previously; and while there's logic to Navaria doing both roles, there's also logic to someone else being the Representative (while Navaria continues to advise the Ministers / Chief of State as is her current role) so that the Grand Master doesn't have to spend quite so much time not on Ossus.

[Droo]

I know I'm late in getting back to this, but for the role of a Jedi representative, I think Tell Cho would fit the bill. He seems to be perfectly positioned to take on the role, what with his Jedi history and present involvement in politics, he'd presumably have strong ties with both sides. I know Vince is game for it, so, provided no-one has any objections, we have our Jedi representative. Thoughts, anyone?

[Vansen Tyree]

^ I was talking to Vince about this as well. Tell Cho is the de facto leader of a group of Gossam refugees. What if the Gossam settled somewhere on Ossus, and we killed two birds with one stone?

Said refugees have been freed from slavery/etc, where they would have been doing the kinds of manual labour / construction / agricultural / etc type roles that would be needed to help establish both their settlement and the Jedi settlement... that might be a fairly seamless way to transition from the Jedi relying on the Alliance Corps of Engineers over the course of the coming IC months. It also means that Tell Cho wouldn't specifically be a Jedi Representative/Senator: it's sort of a bonus perk/responsibility, like the way that the Senator for Sullust is also the CEO of SoroSuub, the way the Senator for Naboo has to vote based on what is best for Naboo and the Gungans, etc. Also, Tell Cho's history with the Corporate Sector makes him a fantastic character to have on Supply / Trade / Commerce committees and such, so from an OOC perspective this would be a very useful way to position that character in order for that to be possible.

So basically... vote Tell Cho as Senator/Representative for Ossus 2014?

[Droo]

I'm all for that. Ossus is a big place, after all, and the Gossam are such cute itsy-bitsy things! As the only person to presently roleplay a Gossam, at least to my knowledge, then we'll have to see how Vince feels about them relocating to Ossus. Also, are the Jedi roleplayers cool with this?