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Aurelias Kazaar
Feb 7th, 2009, 03:28:33 PM
I am not the biggest Alex Rodriguez fan, but no one can deny how talented he is. If this is true (and I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt right now) then I think that taints his career even more. If he used it to try to get over an injury...eh...but still. This ain't good for baseball...again.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/baseball/mlb/02/07/alex-rodriguez-steroids/index.html?eref=T1



By Selena Roberts and David Epstein
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In 2003, when he won the American League home run title and the AL Most Valuable Player award as a shortstop for the Texas Rangers (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/baseball/mlb/teams/rangers), Alex Rodriguez (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/baseball/mlb/players/5275) tested positive for two anabolic steroids, four sources have independently told Sports Illustrated.


Rodriguez's name appears on a list of 104 players who tested positive for performance-enhancing drugs in Major League Baseball's '03 survey testing, SI's sources say. As part of a joint agreement with the MLB Players Association, the testing was conducted to determine if it was necessary to impose mandatory random drug testing across the major leagues in 2004.
When approached by an SI reporter on Thursday at a gym in Miami, Rodriguez declined to discuss his 2003 test results. "You'll have to talk to the union," said Rodriguez, the Yankees' third baseman since his trade to New York in February 2004. When asked if there was an explanation for his positive test, he said, "I'm not saying anything."


The MLBPA issued a statement, saying "Information and documents relating to the results of the 2003 MLB testing program are both confidential and under seal by court orders. We are prohibited from confirming or denying any allegation about the test results of any particular player[s] by the collective bargaining agreement and by court orders. Anyone with knowledge of such documents who discloses their contents may be in violation of those court orders.


"As we have explained previously, in detail and in public (http://oversight.house.gov/documents/20080703114405.pdf), there was no improper tipping of players in 2004 about the timing of drug tests. As set forth in our letter to Chairman Waxman of the House Government Reform Committee, in September 2004 MLBPA attorneys met with certain players, but we are not able to confirm or deny the names of any of the players with whom we met."

Rob Manfred, MLB's Executive Vice President of Labor Relations, also released a statement saying, "We are disturbed by the allegations contained in the Sports Illustrated news story which was posted online this morning. Because the survey testing that took place in 2003 was intended to be non-disciplinary and anonymous, we can not make any comment on the accuracy of this report as it pertains to the player named." (Click here for full statement (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/baseball/mlb/02/07/arod.mlb.statement/index.html))


Though MLB's drug policy has expressly prohibited the use of steroids without a valid prescription since 1991, there were no penalties for a positive test in 2003. The results of that year's survey testing of 1,198 players were meant to be anonymous under the agreement between the commissioner's office and the players association. Rodriguez's testing information was found, however, after federal agents, armed with search warrants, seized the '03 test results from Comprehensive Drug Testing, Inc., of Long Beach, Calif., one of two labs used by MLB in connection with that year's survey testing. The seizure took place in April 2004 as part of the government's investigation into 10 major league players linked to the BALCO scandal -- though Rodriguez himself has never been connected to BALCO.


The list of the 104 players whose urine samples tested positive is under seal in California. However, two sources familiar with the evidence that the government has gathered in its investigation of steroid use in baseball and two other sources with knowledge of the testing results have told Sports Illustrated that Rodriguez is one of the 104 players identified as having tested positive, in his case for testosterone and an anabolic steroid known by the brand name Primobolan. All four sources spoke on the condition of anonymity due to the sensitive nature of the evidence.


Primobolan, which is also known by the chemical name methenolone, is an injected or orally administered drug that is more expensive than most steroids. (A 12-week cycle can cost $500.) It improves strength and maintains lean muscle with minimal bulk development, according to steroid experts, and has relatively few side effects. Kirk Radomski, the former New York Mets (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/baseball/mlb/teams/mets) clubhouse employee who in 2007 pleaded guilty to illegal distribution of steroids to numerous major league players, described in his recent book, Bases Loaded: The Inside Story of the Steroid Era in Baseballby the Central Figure in the Mitchell Report, how players increasingly turned to drugs such as Primobolan in 2003, in part to avoid detection in testing. Primobolan is detectable for a shorter period of time than the steroid previously favored by players, Deca-Durabolin. According to a search of FDA records, Primobolan is not an approved prescription drug in the United States, nor was it in 2003. (Testosterone can be taken legally with an appropriate medical prescription.)


Rodriguez finished the 2003 season by winning his third straight league home run title (with 47) and the first of his three MVP awards.
Because more than 5% of big leaguers had tested positive in 2003, baseball instituted a mandatory random-testing program, with penalties, in '04.



According to the 2007 Mitchell Report on steroid use in baseball, in September 2004, Gene Orza, the chief operating officer of the players' union, violated an agreement with MLB by tipping off a player (not named in the report) about an upcoming, supposedly unannounced drug test. Three major league players who spoke to SI said that Rodriguez was also tipped by Orza in early September 2004 that he would be tested later that month. Rodriguez declined to respond on Thursday when asked about the warning Orza provided him.


When Orza was asked on Friday in the union's New York City office about the tipping allegations, he told a reporter, "I'm not interested in discussing this information with you."


Anticipating that the 33-year-old Rodriguez, who has 553 career home runs, could become the game's alltime home run king, the Yankees signed him in November 2007 to a 10-year, incentive-laden deal that could be worth as much as $305 million. Rodriguez is reportedly guaranteed $275 million and could receive a $6 million bonus each time he ties one of the four players at the top of the list: Willie Mays (660), Babe Ruth (714), Hank Aaron (755) and Barry Bonds (762), and an additional $6 million for passing Bonds. In order to receive the incentive money, the contract reportedly requires Rodriguez to make extra promotional appearances and sign memorabilia for the Yankees as part of a marketing plan surrounding his pursuit of Bonds's record. Two sources familiar with Rodriguez's contract told SI that there is no language about steroids in the contract that would put Rodriguez at risk of losing money.


Arguments before an 11-judge panel in the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit in Pasadena are ongoing between government prosecutors and the players' association over the government's seizure of the test results from the Long Beach lab. The agents who collected the material had a search warrant only for the results for the 10 BALCO-linked players. Attorneys from the union argue that the government is entitled only to the results for those players, not the entire list. If the court sides with the union, federal authorities may be barred from using the positive survey test results of non-BALCO players such as Rodriguez in their ongoing investigations.

Lykaios
Feb 7th, 2009, 10:27:23 PM
The shame -_-

But meh, my beloved Yankees will be under the microscope, 104 players are in that report, yet only one is named and that is the price Alex will pay for being as talented as he is and the price tag it carries.

Aurelias Kazaar
Feb 7th, 2009, 10:34:53 PM
And I don't get why they didn't reveal the others either. Of course if the guy who won the MVP that year tested positive...that's why.

Of course, I also hate 'unnamed sources'.

Figrin D'an
Feb 7th, 2009, 11:20:42 PM
This entire era of baseball is tainted, so it's hard for me to really concern myself any longer with who did what. All that can be done at this point is just to put it on the record that steroid/growth hormone use was rampant and unchecked and let the public decide for themselves how to regard players from the era. ARod is just another player who used either to recover from injury quicker or get more power to keep up with the ridiculous numbers being put up by others. I don't really feel any differently about him than I do any of the other players named in previous reports.

Aurelias Kazaar
Feb 9th, 2009, 01:48:42 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=Av0Uc2eBnYGiUBMVhOtNMxI5nYcB?slug=txarod steroids&prov=st&type=lgns

And now ARod says "yes I did use steroids". 'Least he admitted it right?

Nathanial K'cansce
Feb 9th, 2009, 04:58:13 PM
My two gripes are this:

1.) Doesn't anonymous mean no names?

and

2.) MVP that year or no, ... why didn't anyone deal with this ya know, back in 2003 when he tested positive?

Stupid questions, I know, but they must be asked. I'm on the same boat as Figy.

Lykaios
Feb 9th, 2009, 06:28:04 PM
You know, it's very admirable that he admitted to doing wrong and taking PED's.

That being said, everyone now claims that his legacy is tarnished, but if you saw the interview he touches a point that we're all aware of, the steroid culture in the game of baseball.

If his records should have an asterisk or be questioned, I say all the statistics from 98 to 03 when steroids were rampant should be questioned as well. Sure people are talking about him and Bonds and Big Mac but they weren't the only ones juicing, heck even Andy Petitte did it and how that he's admitted to it, no one is questioning his wins or even on his case anymore about it.

What bothers me the most is how when baseball wasn't America's pastime anymore, the players answered MLB's heed and did everything necessary to save the sport (albeit not the best way to do it, mind you) and the league and us fans decided to turn a blind to it (heck, I think MLB even encouraged it somewhat, remember that commercial "Chicks dig the long ball"?) and now that the league has cemmented its place in sports, turning franchises into a steady source of income and even saved some from contraction, we're all ready to crucify them.

Bob Costas said it best, the record book should have a discliamer about how PED's altered the statistics from such years and let the public decide for themselves.

JMK
Feb 10th, 2009, 08:48:26 PM
Just make a 'steroid era' room in the HOF and that's it. Baseball itself is as guilty as the players. In fact, the fans and media slurped up cartoon baseball and didn't even want to entertain the notion that these guys were dirty.

So we have:

The first guy since Maris to top 60 homers (McGwire)
The guy with the most 60 home run seasons (Sosa)
The most recent 3,000 hit/500 home run guy (Palmeiro)
The winningest righty in the live ball era (Clemens)
The single season home run champ AND all time home run leader (Bonds)
The guy many see as the next home run king (A-Roid/A-Fraud)

None of them going to the HOF. These guys at one time were legends of the game for all the right reasons (or so we thought). Now none of them are going to be inducted. So what's baseball to do? Not have inductees for years on end? I think they should treat this era separately, have a room- removed from the REAL hall of famers and make it clear what these guys accomplished and how they did it.

One of the lessons we've learned, and should have learned long ago is that none of these guys are truthful when they've been busted. They are coached to deny until proof smacks them in the face, and then - only then - admit that you did it by accident and you are ashamed/embarassed/regretful/sorry or any other empty excuse that you want to give.

Like Fig, I'm fairly indifferent now. A-Rod was already guilty in my mind, long before this came out. ALL baseball players have lost their trust in my eyes. It's too bad for the few who didn't do it, but that's life. These guys have insulted our intelligence for too long and I never will accept the "there were no rules against it in baseball" excuse. It's crap. There were rules forbidding it, there just weren't any penalties. That's MLB's fault. It's the MLBPA's fault for stonewalling. There's also this thing called the law, and that always forbade the use of these substances and carried penalties.

No, these players are guilty until proven innocent now. Too much trust has been abused now.

JMK
Feb 10th, 2009, 08:51:44 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=Av0Uc2eBnYGiUBMVhOtNMxI5nYcB?slug=txarod steroids&prov=st&type=lgns

And now ARod says "yes I did use steroids". 'Least he admitted it right?

I'll give a player credit when he stands up and admits to doing it BEFORE news comes out that he did it. I'll give him credit if he didn't deny deny deny every time he was asked the question.

These guys are issuing not issuing apologies. They're merely sorry that they got caught.

The Original BuffJedi
Feb 12th, 2009, 01:13:31 PM
I have been saying that baseball was dirty for years!!(for like the past ten years) and people laughed at me. I said that The powers that be, knew the players were dirty, and people laughed at me. While I am gloating about being right, I would rather be wrong. But we must face it, cheating to this degree is in ALL sports, form Racing to golf all the way to the NFL. That's one reason I primarily only watch college basketball, even though it's in the same boat too :( 'm afraid .


Does anyone know where/how to find REALLY old topics, from when this place was hosted by Ez-board? I wanna dig up one of the topics about baseball where I said all that has come to, would come to pass and people scoffed at me. Well, I think it was here or Mojo o_O

CMJ
Feb 12th, 2009, 01:52:40 PM
I'm not sure steroids would help a golfer that much. Oftentimes hitting with too much power would be a bad thing. I'd think it'd be more of a hinderance.

Atreyu
Feb 12th, 2009, 05:31:43 PM
Does anyone know where/how to find REALLY old topics, from when this place was hosted by Ez-board? I wanna dig up one of the topics about baseball where I said all that has come to, would come to pass and people scoffed at me. Well, I think it was here or Mojo o_O

Try the ClassicFans archives:

http://www.sw-fans.net/archive/forum/ (http://www.sw-fans.net/forum/../archive/forum/)

I checked the archived boxoffice forum and the oldest threads there go back to September 2000. Just use the search function there and you should find what you need. :)

JMK
Feb 12th, 2009, 05:51:10 PM
I'm not sure steroids would help a golfer that much. Oftentimes hitting with too much power would be a bad thing. I'd think it'd be more of a hinderance.


Some roids help recover from injury sooner so they can get back on the field or golf course or whatever surface they play on. Not all of them are meant to bulk guys up.

I'm with Buff, and as far as I can remember, I always have been. In the Summer of Sosa/McGwire, I was ignorant of it. But it was not long after that, once homers started flying out of the ball park, that I knew something was up.

The Original BuffJedi
Feb 12th, 2009, 05:54:02 PM
Does anyone know where/how to find REALLY old topics, from when this place was hosted by Ez-board? I wanna dig up one of the topics about baseball where I said all that has come to, would come to pass and people scoffed at me. Well, I think it was here or Mojo o_O

Try the ClassicFans archives:

http://www.sw-fans.net/archive/forum/ (http://www.sw-fans.net/forum/../archive/forum/)

I checked the archived boxoffice forum and the oldest threads there go back to September 2000. Just use the search function there and you should find what you need. :)Thank you :)

Lykaios
Feb 12th, 2009, 06:03:36 PM
In the Summer of Sosa/McGwire, I was ignorant of it. But it was not long after that, once homers started flying out of the ball park, that I knew something was up.
See and during 98 HR race, I remember both of them being tied at fiftysomething homers a piece (I think it was 55) at the end of August and I turned to my friend and I asked him: "What the hell are these guys doing that they're 6 HR's both from breaking a record that's stood for decades and that stood for even longer before Maris broke it in the last game of the season that was 8 games longer than Ruth's?"

And most steroids are for bulking, that's why it inhibits the natural production of testosterone, what helps people heals faster is HGH.

The Original BuffJedi
Feb 12th, 2009, 06:05:30 PM
I'm not sure steroids would help a golfer that much. Oftentimes hitting with too much power would be a bad thing. I'd think it'd be more of a hinderance.


Some roids help recover from injury sooner so they can get back on the field or golf course or whatever surface they play on. Not all of them are meant to bulk guys up.

I'm with Buff, and as far as I can remember, I always have been. In the Summer of Sosa/McGwire, I was ignorant of it. But it was not long after that, once homers started flying out of the ball park, that I knew something was up.exactly. Steroids are also used to enhance fast twitch muscles, and with a golf player, you get most of your hitting power from your legs. I have found for my self the stronger my lats, the more I get out of each hit BUT i have an odd swing and I'm around 10-12 handy cap, so I'm no where near their league.But the stronger I am the better my hits, I guess that's what I'm trying to say lol!!